Do you pay a monthly fee to be angry at people?

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Originally Posted by Sho86

God forbid people want to play the game they are paying a sub for and not watch someone else do it for them just because they rushed ahead/got on the game first. This is exactly why I try to get through new content quick (not that i want to), I get to see it for myself and learn with people, but minus the rage cause they are in the exact same position. Its no fun if you know exactly how it ends every time.

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It depends on the content you're doing, though. What do you need to know as an off-tank to do A1N? Voke .5 when it appears and tank it opposite of the original. That's extremely easy and you can go in blind for that fight and I'll explain everything you need to do in one sentence.

Now go to A3N as a tank. What do you need to know? The boss has 3 forms. The hand has cleaves that share damage. The hand splits into 2 parts and they must be tanked facing opposite ways. When he turns into a water spout, you have to take the tethers away from other players. For the magnets, opposites attract and likes repel. The 2nd part of the humanoid phase will have stacking vulnerabilities on you a-la-Shiva EX so a tank swap will make things smoother.

See the difference in things that need to be explained? An A3N explanation is still extremely light compared to fights like T9, so I won't even go there and instead use this very simple fight to get my point across. What's going to happen if you tank A3N going in blind wanting to "figure things out by yourself" when the fight is no longer new? The MT will have to turn the hand on the group because you don't know about the damage sharing, depending on how fast you react, the MT may be tanking both hands for a while, you won't know that you have to pick up tethers, but your commons sense may save you for the magnet mechanic. Not doing any of the things above, though, will just make the MT have to work harder to pull a victory out of the group because you couldn't be bothered to watch a 3 minute video guide, and if both tanks are in the same boat, then forget about it. Either that, or have someone in the group explain the fight to you after the first wipe because you didn't want to "watch someone else do it for you", except this is what's happening right now by having a group member explaining the fight for you, only difference is that you could have also done this on your own time.

It's expected to wipe on a fight when it's first released. Everyone is new and they're all still learning, but a month into content and still getting people going blind into fights that require explanations longer than a minute, then it gets to be a little tedious and honestly, you'll most likely die and end up being carried anyway, unless your failure to adhere to a mechanic has repercussions beyond your own death and you take the rest of the group down with you.

When going into a fight I don't know, I'd personally rather have some consideration for the 7 other people in my group and watch a short video (if the info is available, of course) so I know what's going to happen instead of having someone in the fight spoon feed me all the information, but hey, that's just me.

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

Aether is fine, why would you recommend Excalibur as well? That place is horrid and ridiculously overpopulated.

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Or maybe you just attract horrid people.

I think there's going to be nasty people no matter what data center you go to. I'm on Aether and have certainly run into plenty of bad people in duty finder but I've met far more good ones. I don't think it'd be any different on any other data center.

That said though, server-wise, Zalera is pretty friendly. If you ask for help there, you'll most likely get it, unless it's off peak time of course, it's a smallish server.

Not too much rage out here in Hyperion as far as I know. Think it's on the Primal data center as well (I think...) and I haven't run into many bad folks at all.

The quitting after one wipe thing however... >.>

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Originally Posted by Esp

The quitting after one wipe thing however... >.>

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I haven't had this happen to me yet for some reason, in fact, I recently had a very persistent group of newbie players join up with me so we could beat Garuda normal for story progression. We were all new to the fight and only I had watched a vid beforehand so it was a real horror story, people losing track of the adds, hiding behind the wrong side of the rocks, but after 7 wipes we pulled through. :P

I can see how that would be annoying to someone who's played for a long time already but it was good intense fun for me.

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Originally Posted by Zephera

I haven't had this happen to me yet for some reason, in fact, I recently had a very persistent group of newbie players join up with me so we could beat Garuda normal for story progression. We were all new to the fight and only I had watched a vid beforehand so it was a real horror story, people losing track of the adds, hiding behind the wrong side of the rocks, but after 7 wipes we pulled through. :P

I can see how that would be annoying to someone who's played for a long time already but it was good intense fun for me.

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The groups that usually stick it out are the best in my opinion, cause no matter how many times you may wipe, people seem to progress each and every time. It just takes a bit more fine tuning here and there before they finally get the clear. It just gets on my nerves a bit when people just leave a fight after one slight mistake, even when the mistake is easy to remedy.

Really grinds my gears when it happens during a learning party...

People that QQ about parses after being told in a nutshell

http://puu.sh/k87ua.png

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Originally Posted by Kat_Manx

Everywhere I go in this game, just angry angry people.

Yelling in dungeons, yelling in raids, yelling in Free Companies, yelling in linkshells.

The tank doesn't hold hate well enough, the healers don't heal well enough, the DPS don't DPS enough.

Someone doesn't know all the mechanics the very first time they entered the dungeon. "WATCH A VIDEO!" "But.. I did... I just need a little time to learn by doing it myself..."

*VOTE KICK N00b*

Someone in the Free Company likes to craft instead of raid? What a newb.

Someone in a linkshell uses too many smileys? Jeez. How dare they.

I cast a Cure spell on you when you were soloing? "I WOULD HAVE MANAGED ON MY OWN!"

...............................

I am...starting to feel as unhappy as you already are. Where are the people I could be friends with? Do you... have any fun at all?

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Frustration is boiling... and thats what you experience.
To sum it up - RNG is very BAD gamedesign.
To add grinding on top of RNG, it becomes a chore!

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Originally Posted by Esp

The groups that usually stick it out are the best in my opinion, cause no matter how many times you may wipe, people seem to progress each and every time.

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Yeah, the problem is when there is no progress happening.
I have been in such groups, be it in Garuda Story, Chrysalis, Bismarck EX, or even in normal dungeons. And that causes a LOT of frustration.
I will stick out ANYTHING as long as people make progress and we are getting closer to a clear, even if I have already cleared the content. But if there is no progress happening, and the wipes are in the same spot, either someone has to be replaced, or the content abandoned.

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Originally Posted by Kat_Manx

Everywhere I go in this game, just angry angry people.

Yelling in dungeons, yelling in raids, yelling in Free Companies, yelling in linkshells.

The tank doesn't hold hate well enough, the healers don't heal well enough, the DPS don't DPS enough.

Someone doesn't know all the mechanics the very first time they entered the dungeon. "WATCH A VIDEO!" "But.. I did... I just need a little time to learn by doing it myself..."

*VOTE KICK N00b*

Someone in the Free Company likes to craft instead of raid? What a newb.

Someone in a linkshell uses too many smileys? Jeez. How dare they.

I cast a Cure spell on you when you were soloing? "I WOULD HAVE MANAGED ON MY OWN!"

...............................

I am...starting to feel as unhappy as you already are. Where are the people I could be friends with? Do you... have any fun at all?

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*gives you a super Miqo'te hug*

I don't know about you but I pay a monthly fee to play elaborate dress-up.

First off yes duty finder is mostly to blame I'll admit I lost my cool this weekend and called the healer stupid for using return on a boss when they died when there were 2 SMN in the party and I was raising him. It was late I wanted to do high level before I logged I did get kicked. But in my defense he did say he was dumb as he died for not dodging that aoe so I just went with the train of thought and decided to play along wouldn't have said that if he didn't call him self dumb most likely. But did deserve to be kicked ya. (thou i did get nothing from that whole run.)

Also yes OP the DPS never do enough dps why you think there so manny tank threads whining and telling us to use more str.

I pay a fee to punch things with my axe.
Don't ask how it works, Even I don't know. It's just an extension of my body now.

They need to get laid.

I've seen my fair share of "angry" people. I usually just chalk them up as either spoiled little kids with no manners, or trolls. Just ignore them and keep being the happy person you try to be. ^_^

The truly angry ones are the ones who don't say anything and just leave groups.

If someone bothers to "rage" at the group yet aren't dropping the group, they know they aren't that angry.

Cheaper than anger management classes

I've seen this kind of behavior every so often in-game and it kinda sucks. I see it a whole lot more on the forums. People pick something to be outraged about, latch onto it for dear life, and treat everyone who doesn't feel the same amount of outrage like crap.

Not that I'm saying OP isn't justified in being angry, you certainly have the right of it. I'm just speaking of the forums in general.

That's what you get for playing with random people on pf or df. Obviously you'll eventually run in with bad players and you should always expect that. And getting mad is your problem because you're playing with randoms anyway.

This does not reflect the entire community though, you probably just came across jerks is all

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Originally Posted by Tyla_Esmeraude

Bad parenting. Probably spoiled too much. Not enough spanking.

The OP's angry people at least talk. When I do dungeons, mine are zombies. Not even bothered to give a Hi, nice to meet you. That bothers me more than angry people. lol

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Oh but if you screw up you know they will say something lol

duty finder is convenient but has to change. maybe there should be a system limit to how often you can use it. maybe limit it so that you can actually interact with the community in the same server and actually work together on diff goals.

not sure how well this would be received, let us not forget the outrage over ffxiv 1.0 with the fatigue system. Although thinking back now...it sooooort of made a bit of sense. If there's a system limit to how much you can progress a job in game it would push you to do other things in game with others. but on the other hand if not executed properly it can make people angry.

just my 2 cents

Your not alone, I had a DF group the other day. Was my first time doing The Vault. I was the healer. Our tank didn't pause one bit. I kept um alive through the first boss. When we started first boss I only had half mp, was oomp at end of boss but pulled through. Right as boss ended he immediately pulled again. Before 2nd boss someone said WHM MP, and he ignored it. We wiped on 2nd boss and he said kick me, healer sux. Well we did, and still managed to beat that dungeon with a new tank.

Ye there out there.

Really makes me wanna find a good FC with friendly people to run content with, but that's hard to find these days.

Gota be on your toes and do content when it first comes out, or your gonna run into issues like that, and aperently it only takes like a month or less before people just expect everyone to know what there doing now.

I think you forgot to uncheck all the languages in the DF except JP, jp people don't yell and scream in chat like americans, start playing with jp only or real life friends.

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Originally Posted by Obysuca

Tbh, instance/cross server DF for everything is kind of to blame for these people :/ Back in older mmos when you had to do everything with your server and knew everyone, there were less people like this, since people actually had to behave if they wanted to get anywhere and there was actually a community and you could make plenty of friends. If you were new to a fight, no one yelled at you to watch a video or anything, people explained the fight in like 30 seconds or so and you got down to business, usually completing the fight, playing to the best of your ability because you knew if you sucked a certain amount, everyone would know.

But modern mmos with DF and cross server stuff encourage people to misbehave like this, because they know they can get away with it with 0 consequences. Also, most of today's generation of kids (anything pre-18) seem to be like this too, no respect, "me me me, screw everyone else" attitude, want trophies for showing up etc

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While this is true, to an extent, the old systems came with their own fair share of problems. Spending hours trying to get people together for a fight, an exp pt, etc. Playing on off-peak times, or having a different schedule from your friends/ ls mates. Unfortunately, I think the PF system is about as close to a happy median as we're going to find in any MMO.

Also people would do well to bear in mind that it's the extreme cases we tend to remember. I've partied with hundreds (if not more) of random people while playing this game and the majority of those encounters were entirely without incident. It's only the ones that were exceptionally good or bad that tend to be memorable. I'm sure everyone else could say the same. Now, if you're literally running into jerks every single time you use the DF, then it might be something you're doing.

As a side note: Can we please get away from this ridiculous belief that the JP player base is the absolute paragon of skill, friendliness, manners, social etiquette, etc? Speaking as someone that played XI for over a decade, I can assure you that they are, as a whole, no better or worse than any other culture or group. Some are nice and really skilled, others are complete @#$^s and can barely manage to find their way out of town. Some are an even mixture of all those things, much like any other individual is or can be.

I pay a monthly fee to be irritated by the OF's posters. Does that count for something?

It helps having a great FC. I just joined my current FC and literally the same day they took me through T9, T13 and organized a full alliance Crystal Tower series (all three 24-man raids) run for a random guy who'd been trying to do it for a month and put up a pf for it.

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Originally Posted by Odett

god forbid that you're expected to pull your own weight

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I don't think it's that they don't think they should pull their own weight but there is a way to address the issue without making the person feel like a piece of trash. There is only so much that one can learn by watching the video, and to yell at someone who's just playing the game (assuming they are at least trying to fill their role), you shouldn't yell at them for that. This kind of behavior is what drives people away and while most people say "Good, get rid of the casuals" I say that we should welcome everyone as this game needs as many subs as it can get.

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Originally Posted by FOOLK1LLAH

I don't think it's that they don't think they should pull their own weight but there is a way to address the issue without making the person feel like a piece of trash. There is only so much that one can learn by watching the video, and to yell at someone who's just playing the game (assuming they are at least trying to fill their role), you shouldn't yell at them for that. This kind of behavior is what drives people away and while most people say "Good, get rid of the casuals" I say that we should welcome everyone as this game needs as many subs as it can get.

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I agree with this, but for all the people putting it out the wrong way, there's someone who can't take any critique at all. There's been several people in df runs with me, where they basically always fail a certain mechanic and/or deal sub-par dps, and I've politely asked whether I could help them overcome the issue, only to be snarled back at with a "get the f of my case Sherlock, I know what I'm doing/I play how I want".

There's all kinds, sometimes I wondered why those people even tried any extreme content/raids.

Nowadays I mostly raid/do extreme content with people I know so I don't really have to deal with ignorant people much, but that was a really prominent attitude with some people back in the day at least.

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Originally Posted by Zeonx

And people want to use parser's which would cause more of this.

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Except it wouldn't.

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Originally Posted by ShaneDawn

I agree with this, but for all the people putting it out the wrong way, there's someone who can't take any critique at all. There's been several people in df runs with me, where they basically always fail a certain mechanic and/or deal sub-par dps, and I've politely asked whether I could help them overcome the issue, only to be snarked back at with a "get the f of my case Sherlock, I know what I'm doing/I play how I want".

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Fair points, I certainly agree there are people who can't take a little constructive criticism. Problem happened to me in a group last night. We were doing Ravana with some 1st timers (I was one of them) and several members of the party died (Lol I accidentally ran off of the cliff right after Bloody Fuller) and a DPS didn't listen to everyone who was shouting use LB after Ravana's health dropped really low. In short DPS got mad and although we won without any deaths next round, you could tell there was serious tension in the air.

I've had my far share of bad groups, but I mainly experience neutral groups where people rarely say anything. Its refreshing to get groups who are really friendly and talkative. But it could also be that you just attract the negative people. For instance, I don't have much of an issue, but my best friend and hubby both tend to get stuck with people who are rude and are just plain awful and don't listen to the advice you try to give them. I know when I get into a group with people who aren't performing very well, I try to kindly give advice on how to improve. I can't tell you how many people (especially healers) I wish I was there to teach them when they started, so they could be better and not have had to deal with negative people. Being in a good FC also helps a ton. My FC may be small right now, but we all help each other. We know what its like to get into DF with random people and have to deal with rude and inconsiderate people, so we offer to help ease the burden.


Bit of advice... If people are just ridiculously rude, report them or tell them you'll report them if they don't settle. one of my friends Used to be one of those jerks in DF, but he got reported enough times for SE to send him a warning bout his behavior and tried to be nicer after because he didn't want to get suspended or banned. Not everyone will react that way, but it helps to give them a push. This game used to be so positive, but for some reason more and more people are getting just awful /:

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Originally Posted by Tyla_Esmeraude

Bad parenting. Probably spoiled too much. Not enough spanking.

The OP's angry people at least talk. When I do dungeons, mine are zombies. Not even bothered to give a Hi, nice to meet you. That bothers me more than angry people. lol

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I don't usually say hi in dungeons, mostly because I'm kicked back in my chair very comfortable with my dog and at least one cat in my lap. Not gonna disturb the cuties just to say hi to some random I'm never going to see again. That would require too much rearrangement when I'm already so comfortable and far away from the keyboard.

I got a new one today...

...In neverreap the second section of mobs after the wind tunnel jump pad, tank pulls everything up to the wind jump to the boss. Of course he dies in less than 4 seconds. And here's the kicker, he blames the SUMMONER, me! Why? I said, "why did you pull all that? it's not normal routine." And I get a snarky reply, "It's the smn fault. If we didn't have you we wouldn't of wiped. Your just bad."

And then I was kicked!

So these jack hats thought a drg was going to aoe 10+ mobs by himself? LMAO.

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Originally Posted by Evergrey

"Why do you pay to play a game and not even try being good at it?"- Angry people probably.

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You really don't understand, do you?

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Originally Posted by Obysuca

... But modern mmos with DF and cross server stuff encourage people to misbehave like this, because they know they can get away with it with 0 consequences. Also, most of today's generation of kids (anything pre-18) seem to be like this too, no respect, "me me me, screw everyone else" attitude, want trophies for showing up etc

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Please allow me to respectfully disagree (in part). I know a lot of over-18 "kids".

"Kid", in your meaning ("me me me" etc.), is not an age. It's a way of being. Some people are born "kids", and stay so all their life. Other people are born real men or women, and stay so all their life.

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Originally Posted by Malevicton

dunno why he blamed the smn, but you can totally pull that with a decent group

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I wouldn't say decent group. But you need an extremely well geared tank who knows when to use his CDs, and well geared healer who is ready for it.
I remember when a tank did that to me for the first time and I burned through at least 5 Aetherflow charges, and E4E to keep him alive, and it was pretty close. Don't really know how WHM would manage that, and AST would have to be ready with their Lightspeed.

Anyways, it's an absolutely unnecessary risk with a random group.

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Originally Posted by Goodberry

Please allow me to respectfully disagree (in part). I know a lot of over-18 "kids".

"Kid", in your meaning ("me me me" etc.), is not an age. It's a way of being. Some people are born "kids", and stay so all their life. Other people are born real men or women, and stay so all their life.

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Hey another person from Mateus!

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Originally Posted by Goodberry

You really don't understand, do you?

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No, he doesn't. Nor do most of the carebears who say the same nonsense. You and I could be friends though.

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Originally Posted by sirDarts

snip

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Eh, with an amazing group it's kinda overkill. I did it is ts3 with people from our static and coordinating holmgang+benediction I never had to even leave cleric stance.

Still, you should have a good idea of what you're group can do by then, and this group didn't seem up for it, but it's not an absurd expectation.