A link to the difference in gear based on dye, just scroll down to the two dyed wool robes.
In case anyone else was interested.
Colored gear with specific classes.
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10-07-2011, 09:42 AMOscillate_Wildly
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10-07-2011, 09:45 AMEstelliosIf you missed it, take a look at the hats though. The stats are reversed probably to balance out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oscillate_Wildly
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10-07-2011, 09:47 AMOscillate_WildlyI wasn't talking about hats because of this, I was joking with another person tongue in cheek about matching hats to go with them dying dye all over themselves for stats. It was a joke, it wasn't supposed to be taken seriously. Besides, that doesn't make it better. D: It just means if you want those stats back you need to wear the full set.Quote:
Originally Posted by Estellios
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10-07-2011, 09:53 AMNuruSo otherwise if you wanted to focus on a certain role you have to look like a clown. lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Oscillate_Wildly
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10-07-2011, 10:05 AMOscillate_Wildly
I just checked felt hats against their body pieces.
Green Felt Robe: +8 healing mag potency ---> Green Felt Hat: +4 Piety
Red Felt Robe: +6 Piety ---> Red Felt Hat: +4 Mind -
10-07-2011, 10:07 AMNuruSo, to be an effective healer, you'd need:Quote:
Originally Posted by Oscillate_Wildly
Green Felt Robe: +8 healing mag potency
Red Felt Hat: +4 Mind
Bozo the Clown anyone? -
10-07-2011, 10:11 AMOscillate_WildlyPerhaps, if you wanted a matching set. If we're looking at +healing mag potency you'll look at the Felt Cavalier's hat in Brown. Or if you're less ambitious, wool in purple.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuru
OR if you were looking at that stat in specific, there's a mask of the immortal hex? Offers I think +20 potency healing. D: -
10-07-2011, 10:12 AMNuru
Can you craft that mask? it sounds amazing >.>
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10-07-2011, 10:17 AMOscillate_Wildly
I have noooo idea if it's even in the game as I just did a check between Zam and the dats. Zam says one thing, and then a dat file says another. Now I want my server to have the items in the market wards so I can check which ones are real. :/
I'm gonna feel a fool if Zam's entire database is bunk. -
10-07-2011, 10:21 AMNuru/comfortQuote:
Originally Posted by Oscillate_Wildly
lolZam -
10-07-2011, 10:23 AMOscillate_Wildly
Welp. I hope it's wrong as I do not wish to ever have to wear green. And with that I am going to go to bed. :D I shall be back to die a little on the inside later in the week.
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10-07-2011, 10:40 AMKiote
I'm glad to see there is a large group of people who share my opinion on this. Making stats dependent on Color is a massive step backward. People like customization and individuality. Its good to have some gear that is Class specific, but to make it based on color is just Cruel. I for one want to wear Blue and Black regardless of what job I play. I don't want to have to sacrifice my characters efficiency just so I can look cool. God knows this will only lead to people being rejected from parties based on the color of their gear..
Please do not have us Judged on the color of our gear.. -
10-07-2011, 11:00 AMDeadRiser
I must agree Oscillate. All craftable gear should be equippable by any class. Still should have required rank
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10-07-2011, 11:08 AMKioteI can agree with this to an extent. Crafted gear should most certainly not be restricted to any single class. Further more, All crafted gear should be able to be used by the same classes despite what color they are.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadRiser
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10-07-2011, 11:16 AMMasamune
Agreed. Colour limiting ability of the same type of gear is unwanted. How did this even register as a reasonable thing to do.
This is simple. Stats on gear stay the same. Colour changes. Bing bang boom that's how babies are made. -
10-07-2011, 11:20 AMNurulol exactly, hopefully they can fix this in next patch, or even better, 1.19a.Quote:
Originally Posted by Masamune
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10-07-2011, 12:39 PMDeminiaExactly! I was so happy with the concept of an all-purpose dye, but these new dyes are anything but all purpose. Everyone will be running around in the exact same gear with no individuality.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadRiser
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10-07-2011, 12:46 PMDeminiaI agree with this 100%.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiote
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10-07-2011, 01:52 PMAlixandir
This was a very wierd idea on the devs part. They have talked of it several times before but I think I was in denial about it. I simply couldn't grasp the point of a system that will make everyone look alike, and narrows down options in areas were options arguably only are good.
I like the patch so far, I've liked all patches so far. But this one thing is bugging me... -
10-07-2011, 03:07 PMWintersMoondancer
and here i made the mistaken thought that all-purpose would allow us to use ANY of the colors and apply it to ANY on the uncolored gear. I had several people ask me about making them purple Ranger gear, so I know it's not just me thinking that the one or two color dyes is massively stupid also besides the stat effects. Purple means royalty right? Then purple gear should have awesome stats... /sigh
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10-07-2011, 03:19 PMDreadnought
as a non crafter i was waiting for patch 1.19. however i think SE threw a few in your face things they could have warned us about before hand and this is definitely one of them.
the dying process and its limitations is not only intimidating to me but also just plain diminishes my interest in the effort.
i just cant really think of any reasoning for dye color itself having anything to do with class or stats...
i truly hope this changes soon. -
10-07-2011, 05:17 PMNabiri
Gear colour shouldn't change stats. D: That suuuuucks. I'll end up wearing what I think looks best regardless, and suffer in stats because of it. (Till I fix it with materia). XD
As for the "getting dye off of rocks" I'm just gonna pretend our characters sit and make the dye right then and there. >.> Because otherwise it's silly.. Things don't bleed dye randomly! XD -
10-07-2011, 05:21 PMBetelgeuzah
Every class now has their own specialized gear.
That's what you wanted! But no, wait, there's a downside!? Who could've realized.
Dyed equipment is the "AF" of classes. -
10-07-2011, 05:34 PMFensfield
Good god, surely this is a mistake?
There have been far more annoying and disagreeable decisions on the part of the development team but I have never come across one this utterly stupid and incomprehensible in all my time following the genre. I can't imagine it's anything other than some sort of bizarre error.
Here's hoping someone in the know speaks up soon because just.. wow.
And yeah it's also downright sad dyes aren't created by crafters anymore and that the number of colour choices have apparently dropped in contradiction of developer promises (getting to be a bit of a pattern, that) too, but even that's a side issue beside letting stat and class usage be controlled by an item's colour.
Good lord.. -
10-07-2011, 05:47 PMRinsui
I am one of the loudest proponents of class uniqueness.
But forcing players to dress in a certain color is utterly retarded.
Just you wait until SE brings us the recipe of a pink laced Optical Hat with optimal stats for Highlander Marauders >.>.
Sadpanda. -
10-07-2011, 06:13 PMBetelgeuzah"I am one of the loudest proponents of class uniqueness, but forcing players to wear gear unique to their class is utterly retarded."Quote:
Originally Posted by Rinsui
Well, then. -
10-07-2011, 09:20 PMDeminiaI keep hoping that a dev will comment and say this was all some big oversight and it will get adjusted in the next mini patch. I'm not sure it is so simple to do that, but I still hope they will. Materia was supposed to be for extra stats, HQ is for extra stats, NM & rare dungeon drops should be for rare stats. Wearing red gear vs undyed gear? It should be for looks only, no stats difference for otherwise identical gear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fensfield
I really loved so much of the patch and I am also happy about many of the changes to crafting. I hate this dying system.
Another huge problem right now is the availability of dye. Players can gather up a few dyes, whereas before, a player could crafted several dye bottles at one time. There is a large amount of dye needed to craft all of this new gear, but only 1-2 dye drops at a time out of a gathering point - and it seems quite rare a drop at that. I went out to gather dye and got 2 bottles (1 from each of two zones I tried) and that was just frustrating. -
10-07-2011, 10:10 PMOscillate_Wildly
So I had a few minutes to check in game while I was getting dressed and I'd like to amend last night's statement about the dyes. it seems Zam /does/ have the correct information and indeed the stats for each coloured piece of equipment are different.
So I did not make a mistake, and I too would like a dev response on this. D: -
10-08-2011, 12:07 AMOscillate_WildlyThe problem with before is that before alchemists created far too much dye. I guess having it drop 1 at a time for the marketwards to continuously be empty is their new goal. Cynicism aside they could have fixed this by dropping the output from 12 to at least 2-3 and bouncing the raw mat up from 1 to 2 moss. Not dropping the synth all together. Particularly as right now the dyes are wrongly named. At least before you knew which ones were to be used for cloth and which paints were for metal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Deminia
Was that really so frustrating to have specific dyes? Really? -
10-08-2011, 02:12 AMKiote
I honestly thought there was some semblance of a chance that I could get over this, but I can't. This is making me more and more angry every time I make a new piece of gear and change it to the color I want I can't use it or the stats are wrong.
Why would you make color effect who can equip something?
Why would you make it change the stats?
This doesn't make any sense. Please, please fix this.
I never in my wildest dreams would have thought such a stupidly simple feature could be so game breaking for me. :( -
10-08-2011, 02:14 AMBetelgeuzahIt's called class uniqueness...Quote:
Why would you make color effect who can equip something?
Why would you make it change the stats?
AND IT'S WHAT EVERYONE SEEMINGLY WANTED.
Caps lock: Unleash the fury -
10-08-2011, 02:18 AMOscillate_Wildlyinb4 "use materia", Materia isn't a bandage to fix a piece of equipment from being gimp. It's a system to enhance a piece of equipment even further. The fact that dyes adjust the stats across the board is simply outrageous and laughable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiote
Especially since, trust me on this, the stats don't quite compliment one another as you look at the pieces that match it. Like I said earlier, if you were gearing as a low level conjurer for healing, you'd be wearing a clown costume. And I wouldn't waste good Materia on anything but level 50 armour anyway.
Honestly I'm baffled even still. <__> Not to mention the sudden change in what you can and can't wear as a crafter and DoW. If anything this is casually shunting uniqueness across the board and resembling what XI was every other patch. Pretty soon I'm going to be able to tell what Archer is going for strength over Accuracy, by the colour of his gear.
Not by the gear type, not by the weapon, not even by his rings, but mainly by his gear COLOUR. BS. -
10-08-2011, 02:21 AMOscillate_WildlyI can't tell if you're trolling in this thread or just being stupid. So you want class uniqueness by having everyone dress the same way?Quote:
Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah
I'd just like to say it's not what I wanted so your argument may be valid for some it doesn't work to generalize. :U I was happy with the way things were, and I was happy with the range of equipment I got to wear especially as a Lancer. But now, all the gear I used to be able to wear, despite being able to STILL wear it, it offers nothing but perhaps a slightly higher defense, while gear I loathe offers better attack.
I don't see how class uniqueness means for everyone to wear the same shirt, in the same colour, at the same rank. :D Isn't that what boss drops are for? Not crafted equipment. -
10-08-2011, 02:26 AMGramul
Honestly, stat's linking to colors is a pretty standard system in many games, and the fact that you can actually change the stats with dyes is pretty novel. But the fact that people want to express themselves by their color choices kinda puts a damper on that system.
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10-08-2011, 02:28 AMBetelgeuzahEvery class dresses in its own certain way.Quote:
So you want class uniqueness by having everyone dress the same way?
It can't get any simpler than this.
People wanted to express themselves freely? Then why the hell were they asking for class uniqueness then? -
10-08-2011, 02:39 AMOscillate_WildlyWhat a shame to think like that. The whole idea behind this game went as far as to say "Play as you like" not, "Play as we dictate if you don't want to be gimped." Why give us any choice at all then? You're blindly in support of a system that could have been done differently or not done at all. I don't think it'd be so much of a problem if the game had started out that way. But it didn't start out that way. It was one of the many options as we went from armour to armour, to have it in a colour we chose. To now give the colours bonus stats, just...why? Explain why this is good and benefits people more than the materia system?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gramul
So long as you're in the business of imposing restrictions, the dye system was one system that didn't lightly push us into the 'correct' choice or the 'choice most suited for ____ role'. Such as, to be slightly better at healing, you would wear a green felt robe.
What kind of universe are you living in that the colour of your shirt gives you extra strength? Besides, this point is invalid as we have Materia for it. Anything extra is either overkill or outright stupidity. IF we hadn't had materia, I could grudgingly accept it. But as this game is full of players other than yourself you must admit and accept that some people enjoy customization.
because I've suggested a different route. Let's look at it this way.
We have Materia, and that's all well and good, but now we have dyes which give stats. Clearly this is an unpopular choice. What they could have done instead was create different catalysts that you could attach to undyed gear. This catalyst would 'level up' so to speak depending on what piece of gear you equip it to.
Such as from wool to felt, equiping a piety catalyst to wool would give +6, and to felt, a +7. This leaves the dye system alone, as aesthetic purposes only as it should be, and the only change to happen to the game itself would be to the search system.
Such as opening up Upper tailors, Body, Felt robe, and bring up a whole list of felt robes available sorted in order of what catalyst was used to give it the bonus stats.
Bonus stats could have been optional, they could be equipped to anything with varying results, and would have allowed for a greater amount of diversity amongst classes that has nothing to do with Dyes. -
10-08-2011, 02:44 AMOscillate_WildlyExcept I'm not talking about cross class. I'm talking about the same class, uniqueness within a class. If you can't tell an archer from a marauder you clearly need glasses. Now we have restrictions on what classes can wear. For example only Gladiators and Maruders can wear the new Sentinel set. That's class uniqueness isn't it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Betelgeuzah
But what about 2 mid/high level conjurers who want or have to heal? Obviously the best choice, dictated by the new dye system, would be a GREEN felt or wool robe. Green because it has the best bonus stat for healing, not red or purple, just green.
Of course every class dresses in its own way, except now there's a casual push to wear a certain colour, or colour period, as the undyed versions have no bonus stats and are therefore second class.
Uniqueness within a class is important too. I was never an advocate for class uniqueness so I can't share your sentiment so forgive me. :/ -
10-08-2011, 02:44 AMBetelgeuzahAnd once again, class uniqueness is completely ignored. And that comes down to aesthetics only.Quote:
Bonus stats could have been optional, they could be equipped to anything with varying results, and would have allowed for a greater amount of diversity amongst classes that has nothing to do with Dyes.
There's no 'better alternative'. There is only denial and acceptance. -
10-08-2011, 02:45 AMDallie
I tend to agree with the majority...what was the overall purpose of limiting the dyed versions of items to classes that weren't included on the base item? In what way, in any game, does this make sense? Now, if they made the items add components besides dyes, say tacking on some spikes to your belt, then I could understand going from FSH to GLA.
People were under the assumpton that dyed versions would do just what they did previously, provide distinction. I guess that's the community's fault for using logic. -
10-08-2011, 02:46 AMKioteName three.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gramul