Heavensward Monster Difficulty /excitement

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Originally Posted by Gunspec

This isn't Moogle Souls. Although that would be a wicked game. hmm... Maybe we can have another calamity after Heavensward.

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This also isn't Hello Kitty Island Adventure but with all the crying of things being difficult it sure sounds like it

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Originally Posted by Sylve

You and many others are equating stronger mobs with "OMG we have to party up to kill anything now!"

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That wasn't my intention. It was for those wanting normal mobs at party difficulty and reasons why they aren't a good idea. :)

Also, your last comment. They don't need to, as SE keeps nerfing eveything instead XD SE needs to take a stand and say newp, it is at intended difficulty, git gud! :P

Y'all want this game to be like ffxi so bad. Go ahead but don't blame SE.

I also think that the challenge won't be the same when you increase your average item level a few notches and come back, since gear makes a huge difference in this game, but just seeing him acknowledge that players asked for something more challenging makes me think the design will be more interesting.

im ready as all hell to walk into heavensward and get scared
bring on the strong monsters whats a game without a spark of fear to fuel the excitement
besides as many have mentioned before once you get to fly traversing these zones will be a cinch

I can't wait to see the difficulty in Heavenward but will it stay like that or will people just say it's to hard like everything eles and just get nerf in the end. I hope not tho a challenge is fun >.< if I didn't want a challenge I would just go play a "Hyper link" MMO any who rant over, I can't wait for Heavenward <3 not long now.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

Don't count on any challenge if you're already ilvl120 or higher until later in the game. Even then, we'll get powerful gear down the road anyway and once again wondered why the trash mobs are weak.

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this: the mobs might be tough for someone who just got carried through SoF, with bare minimum ilv.
for tanks, everything is easy.
with a chocobo companion, everything is easy (provided you lv it a bit)
as a healer, everything is easy.
Unless all the mobs are "Elite" it still won't be difficult (i'm guessing)

I hope one Heavensward monster will have at least the power of 2 or even 3 ARR monsters

Let's be honest. SoF was nerfed. This won't last either. Sure this is also responce to a complaint, but it remains to be seen which group is the more vocal.
As long as it lasts, I welcome it. We are setting feet into areas that were locked away more than a decade ago. It has to be dangerous. Besides I often feal like a dirty cheater as a monk, bard, black mage or scholar.

http://images.bluegartr.com/bucket/g...609459db50.JPG


. player
. target
.monster
( safe path
_"path taken by people crying on the forum for monster nerf because taking the safe path waste 15sec of their life and they rather cry on forum for hours than "loose" 15sec

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Originally Posted by Barimu

This also isn't Hello Kitty Island Adventure but with all the crying of things being difficult it sure sounds like it

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Does anyone else notice the male insecurity issues among people who make this absurd argument?

Make an argument for more difficulty if you like but, at the very least, keep it somewhat above board.

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Originally Posted by Akuryu

There are 25 days until release...

Which means 25 days + 30 mins until the first "this is too hard" posts start to appear.

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LOL its so true. I'll bet you it happens in less than 30 minutes!
@the OP: I'm excited for this as well. I miss trying to slay tough mobs for the sake of slaying.

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Originally Posted by Hayward

Does anyone else notice the male insecurity issues among people who make this absurd argument?

Make an argument for more difficulty if you like but, at the very least, keep it somewhat above board.

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Mentioning any form of nerf or easy difficulty seems to be an equation to having an allergic reaction to a bee sting.

The real problem about the zones people mention like Zaha'rak (and even myself with Natalan) isn't entirely that the zones were tuned for lower iLvls, but more to the fact that you kept getting sent back to these zones to do content even after you're well past the iLvl it was tuned for. The devs simply pushed themselves into a corner where they kept trying to reuse zones and existing content to fill in the additional systems (Yes, I'm looking at you FATEs). Hopefully with this added bit of difficulty plus the size of the zones allowing for small expansions here and there will alleviate most of these woes, and it just means when you're not to the point of completely out classing those critters you'll just needed to be a bit more mindful of what you're doing and not auto-running through everything.

I too was just reading the summary of the live letter, and I like a lot of what I read...and like some of you I too have fears of other players claiming the mobs are too hard. I'm also excited by the fact that just maybe the possibility of exp parties ala 1.0 can be done again.

wont matter after we unlock flying and just fly over everything =/

I'm not too excited about 'dangerous' monsters. I'm sure it's all relative, and as soon as we get our first set of level 60 tome gear we'll be walking though anything we want just like now. Unless normal mobs are going to start using stuns, slows, poisons etc A LOT more often than they do now (think Heavy when you're mounted, except monsters are debilitating you everywhere you go) and have more instant attacks and longer leash ranges, I expect the average player to be above any open world trash mob within 3 weeks

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Originally Posted by Hayward

Does anyone else notice the male insecurity issues among people who make this absurd argument?

Make an argument for more difficulty if you like but, at the very least, keep it somewhat above board.

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This has nothing to do with insecurity issues, I take it you're the type of player that waits for everything to be nerfed before you beat it? To me, that's insecurity right there. Not my fault I don't want a game where there's no effort involved, where I'm not being challenged and everything is handed to me the moment I cry.

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Originally Posted by MrSmiley

wont matter after we unlock flying and just fly over everything =/

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We have to touch the ground at some point.
Many quests are going to send us on kills, flying will allow us a safer travel, but the tasks will still be there :v

and this is exactly why the hardcore and casual stereotypes will forever exist

I worry that having every mob be "hard" will make Heavensward tedious. Like the Sylphlands.

I am not opposed to difficulty but there has to be some downtime too. I think if, instead of every mob being hard, zones had a few wandering hard-hitting monsters that would be better. You would be able to travel but you'd have to keep your wits about you and remember the world is a dangerous place.

On a different note...I hope SE has learned from watching Blizzard and will not regret flying mounts.

Ion Hazzikostas had this to say regarding the implementation of flying mounts in WoW:

"Having looked at how flying has played out in the old world in the last couple of expansions, we realized that while we were doing it out of this ingrained habit after we introduced flying in The Burning Crusade, it actually detracted from gameplay in a whole lot of ways. While there was certainly convenience in being able to completely explore the world in three dimensions, that also came at the expense of gameplay like targeted exploration, like trying to figure out what's in that cave on top of a hill and how do I get up there."


Hazzikostas gives an example: "Before flying was introduced to World of Warcraft, if you got a quest to rescue a prisoner from an enemy encampment, it would play out a certain way. Players would need to fight their way through the camp. After flying, players could just fly into the center of camp, land on top of the hut where the prisoner is, free him and fly out. It made the world feel in many ways much smaller."

Originally, Blizzard took out flying in Warlords of Draenor as an experiment, and Hazzikostas says he would have bet "slightly better than even money at the time" that they were going to bring it back eventually. But as they played the expansion and watched others play it, they discovered that they liked the game better without flying.

"The world feels larger, feels more dangerous. There's more room for exploration, for secrets, for discovery and overall immersion in the world. At this point, we feel that outdoor gameplay in World of Warcraft is ultimately better without flying. We're not going to be reintroducing the ability to fly in Draenor, and that's kind of where we're at going forward."

I don't intend to make this a WoW comparison thread now just... I reallllyyy hope SE has found an elegant way of bringing flight into the game and won't regret it in future expansions.

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Originally Posted by Ayuhra

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The WoW comparisons are the most relevant in this discussion considering Yoshi-P is making this a WoW clone and he loves that game.

I think the Wow camparison is a bad one. Thought they said that you need to find air currents to fly. Not like in WoW where you can fly almost whenever you want.

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Originally Posted by Cazamar

I think the Wow camparison is a bad one. Thought they said that you need to find air currents to fly. Not like in WoW where you can fly almost whenever you want.

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You need to attune to an area ala primals to be able to fly, you'll be able to fly whenever you want in the expansion.

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Originally Posted by Cazamar

I think the Wow camparison is a bad one. Thought they said that you need to find air currents to fly. Not like in WoW where you can fly almost whenever you want.

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Well I certainly hope that's not true. For all this game's faults it has a vision that I think puts it above the bloated, aimless mess that WoW has become. It's more of a Zenga title than a MMO RPG at this point. It's hemorrhaging subscribers at the moment. (WoW is, not ARR. That I know of)

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Originally Posted by Ayuhra

Well I certainly hope that's not true. For all this game's faults it has a vision that I think puts it above the bloated, aimless mess that WoW has become. It's more of a Zenga title than a MMO RPG at this point. It's hemorrhaging subscribers at the moment. (WoW is, not ARR. That I know of)

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It seems ffxiv is following the exact same footsteps as WoW. Allowing ppl to do level 50 content at level 60. LFR raids. Flying mounts. I guess we will see how it turns out.

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Originally Posted by Hayward

Does anyone else notice the male insecurity issues among people who make this absurd argument?

Make an argument for more difficulty if you like but, at the very least, keep it somewhat above board.

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Male insecurity? lol... what does that even have to do with people requesting difficult content? You do know the quote comes from South Park's WoW episode right?

Anyway, glad SE is bringing mobs up to the challenge of other MMO's (WoW included, though last I played was TBC so maybe WoW's mobs are hella easy too). If you don't want to fight the monsters, you can always go around or just go one by one.

It's surprising how much the bar has lowered. Was playing on a Vanilla WoW server a few days ago and people in chat were complaining the starting mobs were too hard. Reminder, WoW was considered the "baby's MMO" and now even basic low level mobs are too hard for some MMO players.

If you can't afford in the midst of a swarm and regeneration hp faster than they deal damage they are too hard!

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Originally Posted by Ayuhra

I worry that having every mob be "hard" will make Heavensward tedious. Like the Sylphlands.

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Not every mob will be difficult, just every mob in specific areas in the zone will be difficult.

They still need to make them actually worth killing somehow (in ways other than EXP, because otherwise that's going to be pointless for level 60s), or else people are just going to do the same thing they do in places like Sapsa and Zahar'ak; they'll just run.

If all they do is stick worthless beefgates everywhere, that's not exactly an improvement over the current system.

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Originally Posted by Deusteele

They never said anything about scaling experience up with monster difficulty. So if you're thinking that camp/grind parties are going to make a come back, we can break out the "you're gonna be disappointed" image right about now. They're gating access to the expansion zones through the MSQ. What makes you think they are going to create a separate leveling path?

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I hate to break it to you, but group grinding was present in FFXIV 1.0. It's not an entirely new leveling path - it'd actually be the return of one that was already established in the game. I won't take your negative Nancy attitude impact the possibilities I'm excited about - nice try though!

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Originally Posted by Airinya

I hate to break it to you, but group grinding was present in FFXIV 1.0. It's not an entirely new leveling path - it'd actually be the return of one that was already established in the game. I won't take your negative Nancy attitude impact the possibilities I'm excited about - nice try though!

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Here's a downer Dave thought for you instead. If killing mobs was tweaked to actually reward more reasonable amounts of xp for group grinding, then the primary form of RMT combat leveling (underground teleporting thaumaturge spam) would be empowered to new heights. I doubt SE will implement higher xp for that reason alone.

Of course, SE could just patch out whatever exploit RMT use to teleport underground, but we know that won't happen.