Arenvald - Garlean half-breed?

For talking to side characters at every opportunity before advancing the plot, one of my favourite scenes so far has been the quest (must have been in the lead-up to Ramuh) where you're in the Sylphlands and there are imposter versions of the Scions hanging around. Fun dialogue there!

Side note on Arenvald - I keep thinking he looks a lot like Scar from Fullmetal Alchemist. Dark skin, pale hair, X-shaped mark on his face, yellow shirt. Plus - I'm still only up to Heavensward, but - Ala Mhigo seems to be portrayed similarly to Ishval (Scar's homeland) as an invaded-and-destroyed nation. Could be coincidence, but enough similarities that I can't help wondering if it was deliberate, in a "let's make this minor NPC look like a character from something else" kind of way.

I think that's more from both Ishval and Ala Mhigo having similar real world roots.

Ala Mhigo, now that it's a more concrete place, is decidedly Turkish in it's inspiration.

So I was posting in another thread and it lead me to this one. I just read this and from what I remember being said in the story it holds true. Arenvald wears face paint to cover tbe scars his mother gave him. Scars that got there because she ripped out his third eye. So even half-breeds can be born with the eye. My guess is, though it is speculation, his mother wanted to love him, and ripped out the one obvious reminder. But as he aged he probably started resembling his father and that was too much to bear. This mimics real life in a frightening way if true. And sheds some new light on Arenvald. I don't think it's been indicated yet but he very much might view himself as a mistake or burden, and the Echo is the only thing telling him otherwise.

Arenvald never had a third eye. His mom was paranoid that he was growing one when he was a kid so she cut up his forehead to prevent the third eye from growing in (which wasn't there to begin with). She eventually threw him out of the house onto the streets of Ala Mhigo when he was still a kid because she hated looking at him. One of the main reasons that he's more compassionate towards Fordola is because he sees that both of them are stuck between being Ala Mhigan and still having ties to the Garleans. And he knows how bad that can turn out.

That said, he says that the best thing that ever happened to him was getting out of Ala Mhigo and joining the Scions and while he does want Ala Mhigo to be freed from Garlean rule, he also doesn't want to stay permanently in Ala Mhigo because he's got so many bad memories associated with the place.

https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/wiki/Arenvald

This is where i got the info and all but the last line matches the lore book. The last line appears to be added in response to recent info, like from 4.1. Now either the info was misconstrued, or its accurate. Either way us as the audience know very little about half-breeds, and for all we know they could look entirely like one parent but have a defining feature of another, like Hilda's ears. Plus, why would his mother think he was growing an eye? Its been established she took care of him for a bit before her emotions got the better of her. But from the way Arenvald talks, while he has no "love" for the woman, things were good before he was cast out. The eye could of been the trigger. Maybe it was an eye, maybe a pimple, we wont know until we get solid confirmation.

I wouldn't trust the wiki that much. As it is it's right there in the dialog from the 4.1 quest The Darkness Below:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arenvald

My father was in the imperial army, a man of Garlean blood. I trust you know what I mean when I say that my Ala Mhigan mother did not welcome my arrival?

As I grew, she would check my brow over and over, convinced that a spot on my skin was an emerging third eye─like the kind you see in pureblood Garleans. My mother did not care for this taunting reminder of my heritage, and took up a knife...
War paint serves to cover the scar.

In the end, she turned me out into the street, and I was left to haunt the alleyways of Ala Mhigo, a feral child who got what he needed through begging, cunning, or worse.

The best I can say about the years that followed is that I survived. But I hated the animal I'd become. Eventually, I left the city behind me, and joined a group of refugees bound for the other side of the Wall. It was then that I turned to adventuring, and that road led me into the company of the Scions.

---

And the 4.1 quest A Sultana's Strings:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arenvald

In case you're wondering, I'm not planning on staying in Ala Mhigo. Too many bad memories. And besides, I like my new life.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ObsidianFire

snip

---

This just proves what i said though.

half-breeds being able to grow third eyes would explain the massive variety of heights/proportions garleans were shown to come in based on the ones present on the prima vista.

I would have liked to have seen him make peace with his Garlean heritage rather than simply his Ala Mhigan side. Perhaps in the future he can interact with some Garlean civilians and see the better side of Garlemald. As it stands, his arc feels unfinished...though I suppose that could be intentional.

Gotta understand his mother was raped by a Garlean soldier. Arenwald was a walking, talking, dependant on her trigger. Her abuse towards him is just another in the long line of the violence Garleans got away with.

I don't think Arenwald needs to come to terms with his heritage at all. He's plenty accepted it. It's been part of his own healing process.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I would have liked to have seen him make peace with his Garlean heritage rather than simply his Ala Mhigan side. Perhaps in the future he can interact with some Garlean civilians and see the better side of Garlemald. As it stands, his arc feels unfinished...though I suppose that could be intentional.

---

Sure, see the better side of the country that produced his father the rapist.

I don't see how his arc feels unfinished. He's obviously come a long way from the "feral child" he described himself as, who was abused by his mother because his existance reminded her of her rapist. He's been accepted by the Resistance despite his fear that they wouldn't consider him truly Ala Mhigan. He's helped fight off the occupiers and been able to contribute to putting his country on a better footing financially. And despite everything that he's gone through, he's still capable of feeling empathy towards Fordola, and genuinely being a good person.

He's so dead.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rosenoire

He's so dead.

---

Don't forget he scraped by surviving Livia's raid upon the Scion old base by luck and is an echo gifted man that isn't called the WoL.

The target on him couldn't be brighter.

I think having him interact with Cid and Lucia would give him some nice development. They are the two known Garleans who actively fight for Eorzea. They could show him that true comrades wont care about your birth, but by what you do with the life you've been given.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eloah

I think having him interact with Cid and Lucia would give him some nice development. They are the two known Garleans who actively fight for Eorzea. They could show him that true comrades wont care about your birth, but by what you do with the life you've been given.

---

I think Arenvald knows that. Conrad states it in the beginning of Stormblood:

Arenvald:I’m here to fight for a free Ala Mhigo. For an Ala Mhigo where women like my mother are never made to suffer. I pray you grant me this honor.

Conrad: …You are a trueborn son of Gyr Abania, same as me. This is not my honor to grant, but yours to freely take. Welcome, brother.

I honestly don't understand the idea that Arenvald needs to have character development that involves him reconciling with Garleans. This is someone who was born under traumatic circumstances, and the notion that it's on him to make peace with his father's heritage of rape and abandonment is bordering on offensive, especially since the only reason for it seems to be to elide the atrocities that the Empire committed during the occupation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rosenoire

snip

---

I think my meaning got a little lost. It's not so much how they interact, but how they act. They are Garlean and don't hide it, but still command respect, and have come to terms with being individuals over an entire race/empire. To a degree Nero might be this too, bit thats still a gray area. Arenvald still has his issues, and although he identifies as Ala Mhigan, he still shows guilt for what Galemald has done, guilt he should not have. Cid and Lucia could help with that, thats what I was trying to imply.

And as far as for him making peace with his past. If history has taught us anything, people tend to hold onto very deep emotions for long periods of time, even if those emotions are "gifted" to us; like Arenvald's are. He needs closure. Technically by no way is it right, but his father never wronged him, specifically, but his mother did, yet he sides with her. And while I don't think the account of her "experiences" is false, they could be misaligned. We've encountered plenty of Garlean soldiers who, while not saints, are not bad people. For all we know this could of been his father. Neither we nor Arenvald know all the facts, we are just lumping his father and mother in with their respective countries, placing them in a negative and positive light respectively. Now I'm not denying the rape, as that is a sketchy subject to talk about. But for all we know his mother could of raped his father to try and up her station in life. The main reason to give him development is to show us his life, but also Garlemald society from a different perspective.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eloah

Stuff

---

While I'd love to explore the nicer sides of Garlemald, I don't think Arenvald is a good vehicle to explore it with. Arenvald's arc has already reached closure for the most part. He's had a traumatic, terrible life (child of heavily implied rape, survivor of child abuse/neglect, escaped his war-torn country, lost friends during Gaius' raid on the Scion HQ), but he's grown for it, and in the process become a noble hero. It's this growth that allowed him to not only relate to Fordola, but also inspire her to improve. If Arenvald were still gripping with his childhood problems, he wouldn't have been able to manage that feat. If anything, I think his relationship with Fordola is more likely to be explored than his past. He seems to have, on some level, reached closure on that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Claymore65

snip

---

Ah, but everything you just said is why he would be a good character to explore these issues. To bring in a one off character to explore them would be irritating. There are only three characters "left" with Ala Mhigan ties, and Arenvald is the only one who can explore what we've described; Lyse and Raubahn's ties differ. Though his relationship with Fordola is a good way to explore these issues and not have them get forced. Like sharing childhood stories, shows us his past but also his future with Fordola.

Also correct me if I am wrong, but did he escape Ala Mhigo actually? I though his mother escaped Ala when he was very young, maybe even still a baby? I thought when we first met him he indicated he's never been to Ala Mhigo proper. But I could be wrong. I might be mixing facts with people from Little Ala Mhigo. Even Lyse was only about 4 when she left, and now she's around 25, and Arenvald is 19.

Arenvald definetly grew up in Ala Mhigo. He eventually joined a faction of the Resistance that was trying to get over/under Balsaur's Wall and into Eorzea. They succeeded (around 1.0 I think, it's heavily implied it was during the same incident where Yda was killed). He started getting Echo visions which eventually led him to the Scions which he says was the best thing that ever happened to him. He specifically says that he isn't staying in Ala Mhigo because of all the shit he went though there, and most of it he attributes to native Ala Mhigans...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ObsidianFire

snip

---

Ah, okay. I wasn't too sure, but that makes sense; and it falls in line with him getting the Echo when he was young(er), similar to Ysayle.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eloah

But for all we know his mother could of raped his father to try and up her station in life. The main reason to give him development is to show us his life, but also Garlemald society from a different perspective.

---

Wow.

You really went there. That's some next-level victim blaming.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rosenoire

Sure, see the better side of the country that produced his father the rapist.

---

You must really loathe Limsa Lominsa, Ishgard, Doma and Ul'dah too, then, given that they've been shown to harbour individuals who engage in sexual assault and people smuggling. There's a Brass Blade shown to be doing just that in the early RDM quests. Ironically, he's a Highlander, if I recall correctly...so perhaps he originated from Ala Mhigo?

Though I suspect that you'll come up with some convenient excuse and refuse to hold the entirety of each nation's people accountable in the same way that a baffling number of posters (yourself included) do where Garlemald is concerned.

Thankfully we can take comfort in the simple fact that Garlemald as a whole is not rotten, so your point is...well, irrelevant.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

Though I suspect that you'll come up with some convenient excuse and refuse to hold the entirety of each nation's people accountable in the same way that a baffling number of posters (yourself included) do where Garlemald is concerned.

---

If you want to discuss civilly and ask to "agree to disagree", it would behoove you to stop sniping at people.

Provocation is not an excuse.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YianKutku

If you want to discuss civilly and ask to "agree to disagree", it would behoove you to stop sniping at people.

Provocation is not an excuse.

---

I'll be more inclined to bear that in mind when it's aimed at everybody who indulges in 'sniping' around these parts and not just one or two posters.

Furthermore, it wasn't intended to be 'sniping' so much as speculation as to the likely counter argument. Holding an entire nation responsible for the sins of a few is not a wise or fair decision at all. Garlemald needs to learn this yet so, too, does Eorzea and many of the posters around these parts. ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I'll be more inclined to bear that in mind when it's aimed at everybody who indulges in 'sniping' around these parts and not just one or two posters.

---

Still not an excuse. You may not be able to control how others post, but you can certainly control how you post.

Quote:

---

Furthermore, it wasn't intended to be 'sniping' so much as speculation as to the likely counter argument.

---

Whatever you call it, stop it. It's disruptive and unproductive.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by YianKutku

-snip-

---

Well, feel free to chat with me about it over Discord. We're both in the Mateus RP Discord server, I believe, so you should be able to send me a direct message. That'd certainly help keep this thread clear too and address any misunderstandings.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I'll be more inclined to bear that in mind when it's aimed at everybody who indulges in 'sniping' around these parts and not just one or two posters.

Furthermore, it wasn't intended to be 'sniping' so much as speculation as to the likely counter argument. Holding an entire nation responsible for the sins of a few is not a wise or fair decision at all. Garlemald needs to learn this yet so, too, does Eorzea and many of the posters around these parts. ;)

---

You keep saying there's this large mass of people that must hate everything about Garlemald and think all of its people are rotten, but I'm not seeing them. Outside of one person a while back that thought it was somehow a good idea to wipe all Garleans from existence, which is...clearly not a good thing?

I keep saying this, but I'm unsure if you've made the distinction: addressing and talking about the long list of injustices caused by the Empire is not mutually exclusive with also wanting more non-evil depictions of Garlemald. We're not talking about the wealth inequality of Ul'dah, the xenophobic tendencies that still linger within Gridania and Ishgard, the resulting problems of "civilizing" pirates Limsa has to deal with, or the isolationist mindsets of Sharlayan or Hingashi.

Obviously Rosenoire was not insinuating that Arenvald's father was somehow the sole representative of what Garlemald's all about. The point being made was that Arenvald has no reason to try getting in touch with that part of his ancestry because he's already come to terms with it and he already considers himself firmly Ala Mhigan. Other posters have done a much better job at pointing out why that's the case.

Eh, back when Regula first showed up many Garlean fans speculated that he would turn out to be a pretty decent guy and not the 'Kefka insert' that quite a few people were convinced that he would be. The theory that he would prove to be honourable ended up being the correct one, yet it was still downplayed at the time and some posters cannot help but paint Garlemald in the worst possible light at every possible turn.

I don't think anybody has ever suggested that everything Garlemald does is perfect, either. At the same time, though, they do have their justifications for their actions but discussing those reasons is pretty much impossible on this board at times simply due to the emotionally charged responses many have whenever nuances are involved. I prefer to discuss the lore through the eyes of cold, hard logic rather than through the eyes of modern day morality and biases. I like to understand why characters are doing what they are doing.

Which, of course, people are free to agree to disagree upon. I mean, at some point people need to admit that that really is the best route for us all to take. I'm exceptionally stubborn, on account of being British and ex-military.

I won't name any names, but certain posters have attempted to harass me in-game and even fake being me over on the FF14 sub-reddit in an effort to get me to stop posting here. So, if people find me to be overly defensive and 'snippy' then please at least bear that in mind. If people want to make a genuine effort to reach out to me and talk things over? They're free to do, preferably in-game or over Discord as such places are much better suited to doing so than this sub-forum.

I also role-play a Pureblood Garlean in-game. Someone who wants Garlemald to dial back the aggression in favour of focusing on prosperity instead. He's not the sort of guy to take pleasure in senseless violence and neither am I. Yet it is perfectly possible to criticise a faction's actions and understand where they're coming from at the same time. Numerous years of oppression and abuse forged Garlemald into what it is today. The lore book outright states that Pureblood Garleans were hardened by consequence of being forced to carve out for a living for themselves in a wasteland.

That doesn't excuse everything that they have done since, yet it's still not as black and white as many here like to portray.

TLDR: A lot of these back and forth disagreements simply appear to be down to misunderstandings. I'm happy to address that in-game. It seems like we're in agreement in regards to what we want out of Garlemald, anyway. :p

I don't care for Zenos. I want more characters along the lines of Regula.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

Eh, back when Regula first showed up many Garlean fans speculated that he would turn out to be a pretty decent guy and not the 'Kefka insert' that quite a few people were convinced that he would be. The theory that he would prove to be honourable ended up being the correct one, yet it was still downplayed at the time and some posters cannot help but paint Garlemald in the worst possible light at every possible turn.

---

Honestly, I think it's a damn shame that they offed Regula as early as they did. He and Gaius rank among some of my favorite villains. Likeable, understandable individuals, and ones that I felt rather sorry for buying the farm, but villains nonetheless.

Quote:

---

I don't think anybody has ever suggested that everything Garlemald does is perfect, either. At the same time, though, they do have their justifications for their actions but discussing those reasons is pretty much impossible on this board at times simply due to the emotionally charged responses many have whenever nuances are involved. I prefer to discuss the lore through the eyes of cold, hard logic rather than through the eyes of modern day morality and biases. I like to understand why characters are doing what they are doing.

Which, of course, people are free to agree to disagree upon. I mean, at some point people need to admit that that really is the best route for us all to take. I'm exceptionally stubborn, on account of being British and ex-military.

---

I also think that it's important to explore the more morally grey areas of the setting, but ultimately it is a final fantasy game, where forces of absolute good and evil unquestionably exist, and modern day sensibilities, while seeming a bit anachronistic in a seemingly fantasy setting, do exist in the setting. The Garlean Empire's military machine has been our enemy, but not quite the Garlean people themselves per se. And I'm hoping in the next expansion they make that distinction very prominent.

Quote:

---

I won't name any names, but certain posters have attempted to harass me in-game and even fake being me over on the FF14 sub-reddit in an effort to get me to stop posting here. So, if people find me to be overly defensive and 'snippy' then please at least bear that in mind. If people want to make a genuine effort to reach out to me and talk things over? They're free to do, preferably in-game or over Discord as such places are much better suited to doing so than this sub-forum.

---

That's...creepy, on their part. And I'm sorry you have to deal with that overly excessive nonsense people will go to just because they have too much time on their hands.

Quote:

---

I also role-play a Pureblood Garlean in-game. Someone who wants Garlemald to dial back the aggression in favour of focusing on prosperity instead. He's not the sort of guy to take pleasure in senseless violence and neither am I. Yet it is perfectly possible to criticise a faction's actions and understand where they're coming from at the same time. Numerous years of oppression and abuse forged Garlemald into what it is today. The lore book outright states that Pureblood Garleans were hardened by consequence of being forced to carve out for a living for themselves in a wasteland.

---

I also play as one, someone who fought on the losing side of the war of succession. Someone who isn't a defector and loves their country, but harbors an intense hatred of the "usurper" Varis. Loyalty to one's country versus loyalty to one's leaders are themes I like playing with that character.

Quote:

---

TLDR: A lot of these back and forth disagreements simply appear to be down to misunderstandings. I'm happy to address that in-game. It seems like we're in agreement in regards to what we want out of Garlemald, anyway. :p

---

I am 100% ready for the Illsabard expansion and dive into the myriad politics, society and landscape of the nation that we as the WoL have been at odds with for so many years. If only so we can get our inevitable magitek knight tank job.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rosenoire

Wow.

You really went there. That's some next-level victim blaming.

---

Wow.

I just reclicked on this thread and noticed your reply. Not sugar coating it, this post made you a Jackass. Way to take my words and twist them.

Also, thank you to the posters after the initial and prior to this post. While not exclusive, you appear to be defending individual posters and I appreciate that.

Back to the topic of Arenvald. I personally doubt that they'll kill him off. He's likely to become Lyse's replacement in the Scions. And if there's a time skip ala A Realm Reborn (doubtful as it is) he'll be the one hanging out in Gridania.

I doubt that they'll kill him off. He's something of a fan favourite now and lately that has translated into complete plot immunity.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I doubt that they'll kill him off. He's something of a fan favourite now and lately that has translated into complete plot immunity.

---

I'm honestly not so sure about that. Moenbryda was pretty well liked when she was introduced, and we all know she didn't up lasting for very long. Arenvald is kind of in a perfect "expendable" position. He's not important enough to count as a major Scion (and thus doesn't have as unique of a character model or outfit), but important enough that people might care if he actually dies. I could see him dying to save Fordola or something along those lines. Plus, his primary plot arc is more or less resolved so...yeah, I don't have high hopes for his survival. If he gets a more unique model or outfit, then it's more or less assured he'll survive.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I doubt that they'll kill him off. He's something of a fan favourite now and lately that has translated into complete plot immunity.

---

-Looks at Haurchefant.- Yeah no, the only character with the popularity super armor is Y'shtola currently, and thats because it got her the cross-over rep spot for XIV.

Which isn't to say he is slated to die, just his popularity won't do so. Plus he doesn't actually seem all that popular? Yeah people notice him now since he has more prominance but that doesn't translate to being popular.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Theodric

I doubt that they'll kill him off. He's something of a fan favourite now and lately that has translated into complete plot immunity.

---

Last I checked Edda was a fan favorite too, and well she was killed, lol.

On the subject of Garlemald, correct me if I'm wrong but outside of Cid, hasn't our main interaction with Garlemald been with it's military? Judging a country solely on the actions of their military seems skewed to say the least.

On Arenvald, having him become a sacrifice in Fordola redemption arc would fit kinda well, which sucks because I definately prefer Arenvald over Fordola.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SkyEdge1

On the subject of Garlemald, correct me if I'm wrong but outside of Cid, hasn't our main interaction with Garlemald been with it's military? Judging a country solely on the actions of their military seems skewed to say the least.

---

Aside from the Ironworks, we have Lucia (though she doesn't speak of it much) and the crew of the Prima Vista, though we've barely met them they have a fair bit to say about the state of Garlemald.