Yo, SE, Is it true?

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

FFXIII-2 actually looks freaking epic to me, and I love XIII

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Damn skippy.

Very hip Square, very hip: http://youtu.be/Oe3Hh8nvn4k

They should have never added Enix in the first place >.>. After they joined forces, the games started to be come less... Intimate.... Well they started to suck more. FF7 and prior were all awesome. After that, not as awesome, but still good. Same goes for the rest of the games they created/published. I don't think going back to being squaresoft is going to do much now tho. They've already been tainted.

I mean, Enix games by themselves were great, and Squaresoft games by themselves were great, but together.. not so good.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

http://www.dualpixels.com/profiles/b...randing-effort

Are you going to drop Enix from your brand name and re brand just as "Square"

Also For people who do not know what Square Enix Makes... They produced a list lol.





Why not, Go ahead an like this post if you think this is a good idea for Square. I think it is.

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I'm down for them to change back to Squaresoft

Actually if they go back to just being Square, thats kinda back to basics. Went from Square, to Squaresoft, to something with EA or Eidos, to Square Enix I think.

"A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet," or something, right? The games have nothing to do with the name they're produced under but rather by the team which creates the game. The original team behind the old games is not working on the new games - they've added new members while others have been removed.

Whether they're called Squaresoft, Square, Square-Enix, or Hippoplotimaritimus they're still going to make the same games that their teams come up with.

I just hope they bring in some good people on the future games to hopefully counteract the downward slope of game quality.

I think they should just be called Enix, considering Dragon Quest games seem to be the only ones worth buying.

Ooooooooooooooooooooooh!

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Originally Posted by Gramul

I think they should just be called Enix, considering Dragon Quest games seem to be the only ones worth buying.

Ooooooooooooooooooooooh!

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They would if they stop putting them on the DS ><

Changing a name won't bring back the great masters of RPG creation from the dead, nor will it cause those who are alive, but left due to company changes to flock back to this company.

R.I.P. RPGs and what they once represented.

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Originally Posted by Archadius

Changing a name won't bring back the great masters of RPG creation from the dead, nor will it cause those who are alive, but left due to company changes to flock back to this company.

R.I.P. RPGs and what they once represented.

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Again? What masters? Everyone of the Major Credited Members from SE for every final Fantasy 1-X are still with the company EXCEPT Sakaguchi and a few programmmers. All the designers and writers for the most part still work there and are manager or vice presidents/execs of a development team.

Our Linkshell has the rights to "Squaresoft".

SE would have to buy it off us with phat loots. Maybe even release me the Samurai class, and I might cut a deal.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

All the designers and writers for the most part still work there [..]

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Maybe that's the problem.
Final Fantasy has been such a long story, maybe the point is reached where those writers and designers can't pull any more great stories and character designs out of their heads.
You know, like with movies with too many sequels..
Maybe it's time to produce the last, FINAL Fantasy title?

Haha, I can't believe I just said that.
Actually, I still enjoy newer titles, at least in story and design (not so much the gameplay mechanics) but with everyone ranting how games became sooo bad since Squaresoft became Square Enix, this would make sense, wouldn't it?

Oh well, I hope they keep on making new FF titles, for at least I enjoy them:)

Edit:
Forgot I'm on your blacklist, Cairdeas, so you can't read my comment -_-

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

Again? What masters? Everyone of the Major Credited Members from SE for every final Fantasy 1-X are still with the company EXCEPT Sakaguchi and a few programmmers. All the designers and writers for the most part still work there and are manager or vice presidents/execs of a development team.

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Yet still the company hands out garbage. If what you say is true, then what is causing this problem? Are they letting the wrong people run the show now? Does the new guy get to write the script for FFXV, FFXVI, FFXVII, KH3, etc?

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Originally Posted by Archadius

Yet still the company hands out garbage. If what you say is true, then what is causing this problem? Are they letting the wrong people run the show now? Does the new guy get to write the script for FFXV, FFXVI, FFXVII, KH3, etc?

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That's pretty subjective. With the exception of XIV, i'd say all their games in recent years have sold pretty excellently, and whilst a couple had some slightly below average responses (FFXIII was slammed by a vocal minority, whilst lots of people still enjoyed it, myself included. XII had some issues involving an overly complex and political story, but again, was well received by a lot of people), the generally are producing a pretty good quality of game.

Furthermore, it seems like they're realising shit is hitting the fan by neglecting the opinions of the consumer base and falling behind in terms of gameplay and technical ability (outside graphical quality), and they're trying to sort this out and doing a pretty decent job of it. XIII-2 and XIV are good examples of this.

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Originally Posted by Archadius

Yet still the company hands out garbage. If what you say is true, then what is causing this problem? Are they letting the wrong people run the show now? Does the new guy get to write the script for FFXV, FFXVI, FFXVII, KH3, etc?

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Ok heres the difference.

10 years ago Squaresoft was not a PUBLISHER. They were only a Developer. Square PUBLISHED through EA and only Published Squaresoft game (Under the name Square EA)

Now a days Square Enix is a developer and a Publisher. But they publish for other companies too (Cavia, gas power games, eidos, and Activision (In Japan).)

The reason "SE" seems to be pushing out so much crap isn't because THEY pushed out crap its because people they had contracts with for publishing did. Thats why they dropped a bunch of developers and games in april. Because they were tired of pushing out bad games from third rate developers.

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Originally Posted by Sephr

That's pretty subjective. With the exception of XIV, i'd say all their games in recent years have sold pretty excellently, and whilst a couple had some slightly below average responses (FFXIII was slammed by a vocal minority, whilst lots of people still enjoyed it, myself included. XII had some issues involving an overly complex and political story, but again, was well received by a lot of people), the generally are producing a pretty good quality of game.

Furthermore, it seems like they're realising shit is hitting the fan by neglecting the opinions of the consumer base and falling behind in terms of gameplay and technical ability (outside graphical quality), and they're trying to sort this out and doing a pretty decent job of it. XIII-2 and XIV are good examples of this.

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I try not to base it on sales, because honestly, you can hype the crap out of anything and sell billions of copies. It doesn't mean the game is actually good.

I commend their efforts in redesigning FFXIV and still have hope for it. It's the single player, offline RPGs that I miss. You will not find anything like the games we used to play out there. FFX-2, FFXII, FFXIII, the KH spinoff games (non-numbered), spinoff FF and related games for NDS, some Dragon Quest titles, etc... These are all games are was rather disappointed with. While most of them structurally sound, they lacked the RPG nostalgia, captivating storyline, and general immersion into the game that old-school RPGs provided.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

They say they lost 55 million on lost investment for the games they dropped do to quality.

The ones I could find were Gunloco, Project Dropship, and a few "Unnamed projects"

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Gunloco reminds me of brink, so if it played the same... yeah I could see it getting dropped. That could be 10 million alone considering it was getting close to release.

However this begs the question, what is going on as SE?


PS. FF13-2 is looking pretty meh to me. I think it has some quick time events (which people don't really like) which is a step backwards.

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Originally Posted by Reika

I mean, Enix games by themselves were great, and Squaresoft games by themselves were great, but together.. not so good.

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Yeah but square was on shaky ground by the time of the merger. FF:SW stank. FF:U wasn't that great either. And those were both pre-merger.

FFX was great if you ask me (a last hurrah?), but I think when the merger happened, I think their egos or vision got too big for them to handle. I was hoping for better after DQ8 (a great game as well) but it never materialized. Basically the kid locked in the candy store woke up with a few extra pounds and a killer toothache.

When they said after the merger that they didn't want to do any more romantically themed FF games I was like huh? Whether you cared for it or not, those themes really helped the characters develop in the respective stories. What would have FF4 been without Cecil and Rosa and a jealous Kain?

I say:

1. Get back to good stories.
2. Romance is good. Time for a harem comedy? Time for the female love interest to be the main villain and you have to decide whether to kill her for her crimes or try to save her from herself?
3. Character Development (storywise) is good.
4. Stop it with the save the world nonsense, it's too cliche. Maybe make it about two rival kingdoms or something smaller.
5. Bring back the traditional summons but in a non-freaky way (FF13 was freaky but I wouldn't mind shiva staying twins).
6. Maybe it's time for a little more story branching.
7. Try to give the players a few more options in how to approach things. Like give us a choice of 3 places were we can fight a boss, but each one has advantages and drawbacks over the others.
8. Stop trying to make movies or interactive movies and get back to making games.


BTW, square started in 1983, square EA didn't happen until 1998.

Please speak for yourself, I loved X2, XII, and XIII.

Still Nier has probably been my most favorite game from SE in the last 5 years.

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PS. FF13-2 is looking pretty meh to me. I think it has some quick time events (which people don't really like) which is a step backwards.

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The quick time events happen in combat, they actually look like fun, Kinda like a mix of the Advent Children Fights and God of War. They are just extentions on things like the Trigger system from FFVIII

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

Ok heres the difference.

10 years ago Squaresoft was not a PUBLISHER. They were only a Developer. Square PUBLISHED through EA and only Published Squaresoft game (Under the name Square EA)

Now a days Square Enix is a developer and a Publisher. But they publish for other companies too (Cavia, gas power games, eidos, and Activision (In Japan).)

The reason "SE" seems to be pushing out so much crap isn't because THEY pushed out crap its because people they had contracts with for publishing did. Thats why they dropped a bunch of developers and games in april. Because they were tired of pushing out bad games from third rate developers.

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I seriously hope you're right. But would they honestly have let small developers work on their big name titles like KH series, FF series, DQ series, etc (pre-April)?

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

Rebranding back to Square Soft by be a conflict of interest. As it was the name of them when they were only a Developer (EA published them back then) When they rebranded to Square EA It was because they were doing the publishing for EA in Japan, EA split and Square and Enix Merged. Square being its own permanent developer and publisher.


So Rebranding back to Square Soft which was a developers only name would be... a poor choice. I feel the Square Brand on its own is strong enough as a Publisher Name.

Especially if they go back to the classic RED A style logo.

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Not exactly true, Square Soft did publish a bunch of their games and for other companies too Like Breath of Fire which they published in NA for Capcom(1994). It was only in 2003 that Square and EA did a joint venture where EA would publish Square's games in NA and Square EA's games in Asia.

Here's a list of games published under the Square Soft Brand name.

http://www.allgame.com/company.php?i...&tab=published

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Originally Posted by Onidemon

Not exactly true, Square Soft did publish a bunch of their games and for other companies too Like Breath of Fire which they published in NA for Capcom(1994). It was only in 2003 that Square and EA did a joint venture where EA would publish Square's games in NA and Square EA's games in Asia.

Here's a list of games published under the Square Soft Brand name.

http://www.allgame.com/company.php?i...&tab=published

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Uh, a Huge chunk of those games were published by Square EA not Square Soft

As a gaming writer I'm always amazed how a slow news day makes some feellow writers go all out in rather baseless speculation, and how much some take that speculation seriously.

The filing for the Square trademark doesn't indicate much by itself, it's most probably just one of those very common defensive trademarking moves that companies do to avoid other upstart companies to use brands similar to theirs.

Many commonly refer to Square Enix as "Square" so it's only natural for them to file for the trademark, otherwise anyone could create a softco, call it square, and cause cofusion. With defensive trademarking SE covers it's rear from such an occurrence.

Not saying that it's impossible for them to rebrand, but it's very unlikely (rebranding an established big business costs a LOT, and SE isn't exactly finding money hanging from trees nowadays), and a trademark filing is really too little to go out on a leg and spread rumors.

Guess some "writers" aren't creative enough to just write some decent editorial or opinion piece when it's a slow news day.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

As a gaming writer I'm always amazed how a slow news day makes some feellow writers go all out in rather baseless speculation, and how much some take that speculation seriously.

The filing for the Square trademark doesn't indicate much by itself, it's most probably just one of those very common defensive trademarking moves that companies do to avoid other upstart companies to use brands similar to theirs.

Many commonly refer to Square Enix as "Square" so it's only natural for them to file for the trademark, otherwise anyone could create a softco, call it square, and cause cofusion. With defensive trademarking SE covers it's rear from such an occurrence.

Not saying that it's impossible for them to rebrand, but it's very unlikely (rebranding an established big business costs a LOT, and SE isn't exactly finding money hanging from trees nowadays), and a trademark filing is really too little to go out on a leg and spread rumors.

Guess some writers aren't creative enough to just write some decent editorial when it's a slow news day.

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I love when people say SE is not making money as if they only make video games. >.>

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

I love when people say SE is not making money as if they only make video games. >.>

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SE is making money, BUT it's not exactly their best period, money-wise. Engaging in a rebranding operation of little value (it actually makes the name more generic and less recognizable, and it's not even a return to the past of nostalgic value, as it'd be missing the "soft" ) that would cost a crapton of money (it's not just a matter of changing a logo), when you're not making money in excess, wouldn't make much sense.

Not that it would make much sense even if they were bathing in 1000 yen bills, considering that, again, a rebranding like that would be absolutely ineffective under any point of view.

I put this rumor at a 1% possibility, for the effort, and honestly it makes me chuckle that someone that deems himself a gaming writer would not know of defensive trademarking, which is very, very common in the gaming industry.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

Uh, a Huge chunk of those games were published by Square EA not Square Soft

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Reallly..... care to say which ones and preferably post links with proof because all i see is games published by Square... the oldest games in that list are 3 years before the Square EA joint venture...


EDIT: so bottom line you're wrong, Square Soft was not only a developer, they did publish quite a lot of games under that brand name ...so ya...

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Originally Posted by Onidemon

Reallly..... care to say which ones and preferably post links with proof because all i see is games published by Square... the oldest games in that list are 3 years before the Square EA joint venture...


EDIT: so bottom line you're wrong, Square Soft was not only a developer, they did publish quite a lot of games under that brand name ...so ya...

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Specifically off the top of my head I know Parasite Eve.
VII, VII, Tactics, The Bouncer, Brave Fencer Musashi, Ehrgeiz: God Bless The Ring and some of the others I believe.

Also, You have to understand A lot of the games actually published by Square Electronic Arts were labled "Squaresoft" because that was part of their contract. But the boot up screen for the game itself would always say "Published by: Square Electronic Arts" This was especially true on the software they made in house or by half owned developers like Dream Factory

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

Specifically off the top of my head I know Parasite Eve.
VII, VII, Tactics, The Bouncer, Brave Fencer Musashi, Ehrgeiz: God Bless The Ring and some of the others I believe.

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So far, I've looked up Parasite Eve, VII, and Brave Fencer Musashi, and what I'm finding says all were published by Square Soft in Japan (I know Wikipedia isn't always right, buuuuuuuut....). VII seems to have been published by Sony in the US, and the other two were published by Square EA in the US.

So to say that Square EA published a lot of those titles. Yes, they did, in the US--but it looks like Square Soft was its own publisher domestically for those titles.

Over time, the edges of this so-called SQUARE have become worn around the edges with name change after name change that even Namingway has no longer become excited with making a new name. The SQUARE has become a circle now with its neverending remakes. I understand the profit, but it leaves people without time to make something of quality.

But I digress, Keeping it simple with SQUARE will be easier on the paperwork for its employee's all over the planet.

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Originally Posted by trinta

So far, I've looked up Parasite Eve, VII, and Brave Fencer Musashi, and what I'm finding says all were published by Square Soft in Japan (I know Wikipedia isn't always right, buuuuuuuut....). VII seems to have been published by Sony in the US, and the other two were published by Square EA in the US.

So to say that Square EA published a lot of those titles. Yes, they did, in the US--but it looks like Square Soft was its own publisher domestically for those titles.

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For their own developed games yes. They didn't publish very many if any (Besides BoF) other developers games unless they owned a huge chunk of that developer (DreamFactory)

So Square Soft wasn't a "developer only" name, as you said? That's all I'm getting at.

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Originally Posted by Atoli

Maybe that's the problem.
Final Fantasy has been such a long story, maybe the point is reached where those writers and designers can't pull any more great stories and character designs out of their heads.
You know, like with movies with too many sequels..
Maybe it's time to produce the last, FINAL Fantasy title?

Haha, I can't believe I just said that.
Actually, I still enjoy newer titles, at least in story and design (not so much the gameplay mechanics) but with everyone ranting how games became sooo bad since Squaresoft became Square Enix, this would make sense, wouldn't it?

Oh well, I hope they keep on making new FF titles, for at least I enjoy them:)

Edit:
Forgot I'm on your blacklist, Cairdeas, so you can't read my comment -_-

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That's like saying Nintendo needs to make the last Mario or Zelda game because they've been produced for 20+ years.

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Originally Posted by trinta

So Square Soft wasn't a "developer only" name, as you said? That's all I'm getting at.

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Self Publishing under you Developers name doesn't make you a publisher.

It would be the same as if I wrote a book, printed it at a self publishing facility and sold it for profit. I would not be a publisher like ACE.

They didn't really start Publishing other peoples stuff till the Square EA partnership then when they bought Enix they start publishing tons of people.

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Originally Posted by NefarioCall

Normally i would agree with this idea,
But Enix ...
I would be very displeased to see this name lost.
It would be dishonorable and disrespectful.
it is ENIX.

Maybe go take a look at the list of games Enix made before Square swallowed em up eh?>
It would be an even tilt to say that Enix should just drop Square and rebrand as Enix.
Square Enix is fine.

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This is exactly how I feel about it. I'd be all for the name change, if it meant Enix was splitting off from them and becoming their own entity again. At least then we might see some shiny Enix IPs getting some love. I like the FFs as much as anyone else I suppose, but the amount of series that get to play 3rd chair to them is just sad, and it seems to me that Final Fantasy is all the Square side has been interested in tricking out for the last... oh, decade or so?

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

Specifically off the top of my head I know Parasite Eve.
VII, VII, Tactics, The Bouncer, Brave Fencer Musashi, Ehrgeiz: God Bless The Ring and some of the others I believe.

Also, You have to understand A lot of the games actually published by Square Electronic Arts were labled "Squaresoft" because that was part of their contract. But the boot up screen for the game itself would always say "Published by: Square Electronic Arts" This was especially true on the software they made in house or by half owned developers like Dream Factory

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Final Fantasy Tactics: Sony
Final Fantasy VII: actually published by Sony, not Square nor EA. The PC version was published by Eidos.
Parasite Eve: published by Square EA
Final Fantasy VIII:Published by Square EA
Brave fencer musashi: Square EA
The bouncer: Square EA

After doing some research and checking from multiple sources this is the most accurate info for these titles.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

Self Publishing under you Developers name doesn't make you a publisher.

It would be the same as if I wrote a book, printed it at a self publishing facility and sold it for profit. I would not be a publisher like ACE.

They didn't really start Publishing other peoples stuff till the Square EA partnership then when they bought Enix they start publishing tons of people.

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in 1994 Sqaure Soft published Breath of Fire for Capcom in NA, that would make them a publisher.

Yeah I think "Square" It reminds me more of squaresoft in the past its short and to the point, sounds modern. I'm all in.

From what I remember, they were simply Square at start, then they merged Sunsoft and then became Squaresoft. Then their finances led to to merging with Enix to become Square-Enix.

Yea.. Unless they carve the cancer that is Enix out of their corporation it wont matter..

Thanks for trying..

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Originally Posted by Velhart

From what I remember, they were simply Square at start, then they merged Sunsoft and then became Squaresoft. Then their finances led to to merging with Enix to become Square-Enix.

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It could be... it was also always refered to as Square even in back when it was Square Soft, it's just that the name Square Soft bring quite some good memories from the Snes days...

The problem I have with SquareEnix is that Square and Enix had different ideologies when it came to RPGs, and merging them caused such a design clash it's not even funny.