Please do NOT alter Dark Knight AF for female characters.

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Originally Posted by Empressia

Pretty sure OP didn't notice a huge massive "view quality improvement" between Scylla Robe worn by dudes and chicks toons

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In this example, the male version of the Scylla Robe is the changed version. The female version is the original.

Original Scylla Robe
http://i1.2pcdn.com/node14/image/art...h1825nzbir.jpg


With luck, the female DRK AF version would be like the female WAR AF and PLD AF versions.

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Originally Posted by BearGrylls

I'm on the other side of the fence. I want my male characters to have access to the more revealing versions that women get to wear. I'm disappointed by the lack of sexy man-cleavage on the Scylla set and the generic crafter body, aswell as others. So, I think both covered and uncovered options should be available to both genders.

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Considering how much cleavage the coatees reveal, I remember complaining when they were released that the male version was tame in comparison.

I agree, keep the default female "AF" armor the same as the male counterpart.


However, for those players who do like the sexy look, Ishgard is the perfect setting for a quest line such as:

~"Hildibrand and the Case of the Holy Armor"~

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Originally Posted by Wolf_Heartnet

I believe males and females should just get the same armor and then have customization on that armor to remove pieces of it. For example, male dragoon have the revealing features of the female dragoon set as a customization option - vice versa.

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Just like the /visor? So... /body should do it ^^ Nice suggestion!

They should try to get rid of some of those spikes and edges, you take enough damage already as a tank so there's no need to turn morning razor problems into all day problems just because you're feeling low on DARKNESS.

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Originally Posted by Zosimo

Really? People are worried about realism in a fantasy game? lol.

There are male version armors that are just as revealing as some of the female versions and not to mention there are some very feminine style armors in-game that males end up wearing due to the stats. When given those facts into account, I hope the female armor version shows a good amount of skin.

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Realism isn't what I'm asking for, otherwise I'd be complaining about the spikes, barbs, tattered cloth, and scraps of mail hanging everywhere. Those things add flavor, and the art direction of this game is one where realism holds limited ground at best. I don't have any real problem with revealing gear options at all (let's face it, we're a damn beautiful bunch, we've earned the right to show off. :p )

What I'm asking for is that this specific image, that of the iconic Dark Knight, is maintained for all characters. Revealed skin here would compromise the entire feel of it.

See, as much as I dislike it, I could make an allowance for the DRG AF because the job itself is flashy and flourishing (I play it too, and it's awesome fun.) For Dragoon, it's all about that lean, daredevil, razor-silhouetted look. They're not sturdy frontline scrappers, they're airborne living weapons.

That's very clearly not what they intend for Dark Knight. The artwork speaks of a purposeful, menacing iron presence, all humanity masked behind that intimidating black armor. Why compromise something that works so very well in the name of gratuitous cheesecake, when there'll undoubtedly be plenty other pieces of gear to serve that purpose?

Gotta say, I do appreciate that a lot of other posters here are on the same page.

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Originally Posted by Zosimo

Really? People are worried about realism in a fantasy game? lol...

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Glamours aside, it can be jarring to see certain types of armor exposing skin just for the sake of exposure. The DRG AF is the one that comes up most often for FFXIV, I mean come on.

As for the feminine armor that male characters wear for stats, there aren't a ton. I can't really even think of any off the top of my head. Robes aren't really feminine nor masculine. The Coliseum gear (just taking the name itself) makes perfect sense because gladiators in the coliseum wouldn't be wearing a full set of armor that protects everything. Uh, the "skirt" gear for males generally gives them pants (like foestriker). Et cetera.

In my opinion, there's a certain threshold of suspending disbelief for video games when it comes to armor. This game, for me at least, has done good job of actually keeping the armor aesthetics mostly fair between the sexes and it becomes rather apparent when certain pieces expose skin far more on females than on males. I mean if we got gear that looked like Cammy's outfit from Street Fighter in XIV it wouldn't fit and there would be a shitstorm forming about it.

As a career DRK in FFXI and a full time tanker in FFXIV I agree. Please do not alter the AF for Fell-knights of the female persuasion.

The DRK armor in FFXI was identical for male or female with appropriate fitting.

Please, no more hotpants for tanks!

If we want to show leg or expose our bellies to monsters we'll glamor something!

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Originally Posted by Felis

In this example, the male version of the Scylla Robe is the changed version. The female version is the original.

Original Scylla Robe
http://i1.2pcdn.com/node14/image/art...h1825nzbir.jpg


With luck, the female DRK AF version would be like the female WAR AF and PLD AF versions.

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Super original also had some cleavage:

http://i.imgur.com/rPjrVyZ.gif

Armor should be armor, and not expose spots that scream Stab me here! If it stays the same design, it'd be awesome.

Nope, I want more feminine gears for female characters.

Want to also say: There's a huge precedent in the FF series for the Dark Knight's look being one of total concealment, with the most famous one of all: Cecil from FF4.

http://i.imgur.com/YB4X1xH.jpg

His all-concealing armor actually served a narrative purpose, being the faceless enforcer of iron-fisted conquest that he was at the start of the game. Such a firm example of why the steel-enshrouded look serves the job so well speaks for itself, and should be preserved as such for all characters who play it in this game.

And as a caveat: He's got the form-fitted look going himself. That's fine. In this game there's some element of that in the female version of the WAR AF and it doesn't really hurt the image at all.

Show me them dark knight titties, gurl

The more skin you show as a lady tank, the better your defense is. That's just the MMORPG rule.

I'm kidding.

I actually dislike most clothes that are more revealing than the male counterpart. If it's something I'll have for awhile, it gets glamoured quickly.

Fun Fact: One week, I was trying to decide whether to get the daystar body or pants. The body would've been slightly better stat-wise, but I went with the legs because I'd have a giant panty shot with the body.

You shouldn't have chosen a fem cat then

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Originally Posted by Mahri

*snip*

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honestly I don't really think you've got anything to worry about, they designed a lot of the original AF armor back in 1.0 and were leaning heavily on sex appeal. Now their is still a big market for the gamers out their for that sexy appeal, doesn't bother me much, however a good portion of AF available atm is pretty much the same female and male, Monk, Warrior, Bard, Black Mage, Ninja. The white mage, summoner, scholar, and pally only differ by giving us skirts, or smaller undies for white mage. It's just to meet a bit of a standard between male and female. I understand however, not every women likes to wear a skirt, I'm one of them.

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Originally Posted by Esper

a good portion of AF available atm is pretty much the same female and male, Monk, Warrior, Bard, Black Mage, Ninja.

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Bard is not the same at all. It is really annoying that males got undershirt...

/bumped and supported. As a female, I have enough opportunities to feel vulnerable. I don't need that from my armor when I'm tanking!

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Originally Posted by Evangela

Nope, I want more feminine gears for female characters.

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What qualifies as "feminine"?

Exposing skin on armor doesn't exactly qualify it as being made "feminine" (DRG AF body for example). That's more like trying to make it more sexy on female characters. That's a big difference the way I see it.

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Originally Posted by Lori

You shouldn't have chosen a fem cat then

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See now, I wouldn't blame you for thinking that, looking around at what's popular for catgirl glamours, a yard or so of coverage just magically vanishes from every garment we equip, but I assure you that the ones who choose to dress as such have indeed chosen. :rolleyes:

If I log in one day and my huge GC coat that I like to wear has come mysteriously unbuttoned, only then shall we blame SE art team shenanigans.

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Originally Posted by Erendis

Bard is not the same at all. It is really annoying that males got undershirt...

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that's true I guess, on the shirt having an undershirt, didn't really think about it, doesn't bother me to much, the other items are all the same however, so, stating that it's not at all the same is a bit over zealous, and again, for women a little sex appeal didn't hurt the games numbers.

I like sexy/cute as much as anybody else, but having the differences in certain gears based on gender is just annoying.

Just make them all the same. @_@

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Originally Posted by Goufunaki

Just make them all the same. @_@

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Should make 1 androgynous, genderless race and force everyone to play it too.

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Originally Posted by Lori

You shouldn't have chosen a fem cat then

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I dislike playing male characters, and I like to make cute characters (of my personal opinion). That kind of only left me with Hyur or Miqo'te.

If the males can complain about not getting dresses, I get to complain about not having pants.

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Originally Posted by AyrJordan

The main role of female playable characters is for dudes that want to look at a sexy-looking character on their screen. If SE doesn't make Dark Knight AF sexier and more revealing, they are failing the majority of their consumer base. Being in the minority means accepting you won't get your way sometimes.

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I'd tread lightly on saying this is a minority, it's a battle that has been feuded over since before my time. Be it in comic books or television, etc. The truth is, if it grabs $ and attention, it can be utilized and has been. A women showing some skin, walking around in nearly nothing is of no exception anywhere else but reality.

Actually, demographics have shown that the FF series, at least in Japan, has a much heavier female following than most every other video game franchise, and MMORPGs in the west tend to have it split about 60/40, male playerbase being only slightly in favor when put in such perspective. It's very likely that this particular one, given the way it's marketed and due to the brand name following, is closer to 50/50.

Mind you, everyone's welcome to play it sexy regardless of real life gender. My point isn't that it shouldn't be in-game, just that this particular set of AF gear have the same amount of coverage in order to preserve the personality it exudes.

The idea behind the female exposed abdomen is to lure in attackers that wish to take advantage of a vulnerability. Normally a fighter would easily counter-attack while the unsuspecting attacker would be confident they have won with no 2nd thoughts, putting everything they have in the strike at the belly....

In the case of drg, the drg would simply die whether the abdomen is exposed or not.

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Originally Posted by Mahri

*snip*

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I'm pretty sure they try to keep that in mind as well, as stated before most were done in 1.- and there is even a bit of a quality difference in scholar and summoner, which were brand new to they system starting 2.0, skirts, but otherwise the same. (and it's hard to deny the fact that they would utilize whatever way they could get a school girl outfit in game....) Rogues gear doesn't even vary much compared to males if at all. (looking at pictures at least)

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Originally Posted by AyrJordan

The main role of female playable characters is for dudes that want to look at a sexy-looking character on their screen...

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While the majority of MMO players are probably male, there are a fair amount of actual female players. The male population is also probably split on this issue. And the players who want to look at a nice relatively exposed female body in the game may not be the majority of their entire consumer base. If it is the majority, it probably isn't by a large percentage.

The developers have clearly been treading lightly on this issue and playing it safe. FFXIV doesn't have the super skimpy outfits other MMOs have seen. I mean aside from smallclothes, underwear, and summer/swim gear, and various other vanity gear, there are few actual pieces of armor that are very revealing (the one that comes to mind most of the time is DRG AF, and that's been brought up several times on the forums if I recall). Could also bring up Coliseum Armors from Dzmael Darkhold, but those are likely based on actual coliseum armor from Roman times, as gladiators didn't wear full plate armor with pauldrons, gauntlets, fauld/tassets, cuisses, and greaves. They were essentially naked, perhaps with some clothing and maybe a small bit armor to guard their chests.

I'd love my middrift showing on my character here, personally.

Can we get a swap? Girls can get all the bulky armor while us guys show off for a change.

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Originally Posted by AyrJordan

Show me them dark knight titties, gurl

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^majority opinion

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Originally Posted by AyrJordan

^majority opinion

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^quotes himself, "hardcore" or.... hard ... something

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Originally Posted by File2ish

What qualifies as "feminine"?

Exposing skin on armor doesn't exactly qualify it as being made "feminine" (DRG AF body for example). That's more like trying to make it more sexy on female characters. That's a big difference the way I see it.

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something more fit to the body, showing off(note, not necessarily exposing) feminine curves and shape. Look at the difference between a "Male's" T-shirt and a "Women's" T-shirt, they're designed to accentuate, no? That's how I like my armor in my fantasy games. Not huge baggy armor that looks like I could fit three of myselves in it.

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Originally Posted by AyrJordan

^majority opinion

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http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/wikipedian_protester.png

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Originally Posted by Esper

I'm pretty sure they try to keep that in mind as well

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Oh yeah, and it's totally fair to have cute girly options, and they know it.

I think I know of just as many women IRL who play either scantily dressed or exceedingly cute characters (male and female, both ways) as I do guys with the same habits. The easy truth is that everyone loves to look at that now and then, and it is reason for neither shame nor bias. The only complaint I'd ever have is either poorly-executed use of titillating imagery (which is the reason for this thread) or poor gender representation within the story content, and this game dodges that pitfall gloriously well.

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Originally Posted by Esper

^quotes himself, "hardcore" or.... hard ... something

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He's trying awfully hard, isn't he? >_>

Don't worry about the troll.

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Originally Posted by FoxyAreku

I'd love my middrift showing on my character here, personally.

Can we get a swap? Girls can get all the bulky armor while us guys show off for a change.

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See, I wouldn't mind them doing this on a handful of sideline armor sets just to see how people set up their glamours.

Hell, look at the female swimsuits vs. male swimsuits. Questionably-supportive bikinis vs. straight-up fetish wear.

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Originally Posted by Mahri

50/50..

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citation needed

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Originally Posted by Ilitsa

something more fit to the body, showing off(note, not necessarily exposing) feminine curves and shape. Look at the difference between a "Male's" T-shirt and a "Women's" T-shirt, they're designed to accentuate, no? That's how I like my armor in my fantasy games. Not huge baggy armor that looks like I could fit three of myselves in it.

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I agree, not all armors in this game fit the curves of the female body and having the armors show the female form would make the armors look more feminine. I posted with the OP's post in mind, "cutting middrift" and "exposed cleavage" and whatnot for tank gear. (And I used DRG AF as an example as it has that big 'ol missing piece of abdomen armor).

By no means did I intend to give the idea that the armor should be formed in a huge baggy ("masculine"?) way like the Soldiery tank gear.

I like how it looks for females, I guess I'm one of the few who hopes they don't change it. I also thought the DRG armor is sexy on both male and female and liked that there was a difference. It's funny I've seen posts that say we don't have enough tastefully sexy wear, then there's the opposite like this topic.:confused:

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Originally Posted by Violyre

If the males can complain about not getting dresses, I get to complain about not having pants.

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Reminded me of this.
http://i.imgur.com/SJW5oNO.jpg

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Originally Posted by File2ish

By no means did I intend to give the idea that the armor should be formed in a huge baggy ("masculine"?) way like the Soldiery tank gear.

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See, I stand by my opinions on exposed skin...but I'll agree that putting girls in buff chiseled dudeplate looks precisely as silly as giving guys armor with built-in breasts. If you're gonna have that look you might as well go the whole way on both genders. That soldiery gear wouldn't be nearly as jarring if the breastplate were a smooth conventional one.