Is BLM truly simple?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

I use BLM and the highest I did on T6 was 424 with one bard that only does foes at the start. And the Highest on T9 was 380. Summoner is still better in all of the T9 phases bar the first one. I guess If you triple flare the add+boss on heavens fall then it's 50/50 but we use mage LB so our BLM can only get one flare off on that part since I just use a Raging strikes+x int pot boosted bane and a spur+rouse buffed enkindle and then immediately LB.

---

Won't lie, I've yet to see a BLM beat me in any phase on SMN in T9 and I've run with some of the best. SMN can dominate over every class in every single phase on T9.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Havenchild

Won't lie, I've yet to see a BLM beat me in any phase on SMN in T9 and I've run with some of the best. SMN can dominate over every class in every single phase on T9.

---

I did 476 with BLM on P1 though. P1 is basically a target dummy for BLM especially if you don't get meteors. and even if you DO get meteors you can just swiftcast Fire 1 or use AM for that and that's the only time on P1 where you will need to move.

But yea, I don't think I have seen a BLM do 400+ on T9 counting uptime.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

I did 476 with BLM on P1 though. P1 is basically a target dummy for BLM especially if you don't get meteors. and even if you DO get meteors you can just swiftcast Fire 1 or use AM for that and that's the only time on P1 where you will need to move.

But yea, I don't think I have seen a BLM do 400+ on T9 counting uptime.

---

Wow 476 is pretty high. Personally I cap out on T9 generally above 410, current highest was around 420. If you don't mind me asking what's your third phase like o.o?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

I use BLM and the highest I did on T6 was 424 with one bard that only does foes at the start. And the Highest on T9 was 380. Summoner is still better in all of the T9 phases bar the first one. I guess If you triple flare the add+boss on heavens fall then it's 50/50 but we use mage LB so our BLM can only get one flare off on that part since I just use a Raging strikes+x int pot boosted bane and a spur+rouse buffed enkindle and then immediately LB.

And I never said Turn 7 was a DPS race, I just said Summoner will always outdps BLM there assuming equal skill level, which it does.

---

Fair enough. Just wanted to say that it's definitely possible for BLMs to pull numbers similar to the ones you stated. I get to double flare the add and boss before LBing on T9 since I'm the only caster in our group, but that's pretty much offset by the subsequent 8-second Limit break and the fact that I have to mark in between GCDs.

Thing is though, just because you have a job at 50, doesn't mean you actually know how to play it.

I play both BLM and SMN (cleared 20+ T9s combined with my alt who is also BLM/SMN) , and I gotta say for turn9 SMN takes substantially less work to achieve high dps compared to BLM, but BLM if played perfectly will out DPS SMN just because of BLM raw single target DPS potential alone. That being said, throughout the whole fight unmerged and me doing LB3 everytime, my BLM and SMN both average about 345 DPS, with my SMN highest DPS record being 350+ and BLM highest 360+.

Most of the fights in coil SMN and BLM are both very competitive, with the exception of T8 where BLM will always win because of the shear single target DPS/MP sustainability difference.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

I use BLM and the highest I did on T6 was 424 with one bard that only does foes at the start. And the Highest on T9 was 380. Summoner is still better in all of the T9 phases bar the first one. I guess If you triple flare the add+boss on heavens fall then it's 50/50 but we use mage LB so our BLM can only get one flare off on that part since I just use a Raging strikes+x int pot boosted bane and a spur+rouse buffed enkindle and then immediately LB.

And I never said Turn 7 was a DPS race, I just said Summoner will always outdps BLM there assuming equal skill level, which it does.

---

well for a perspective since I play both BLM and SMN:

For both of these we used zerg boss method, as you can see we dont kill any slug at all.
T6 BLM w/ 115 weapon: http://i.imgur.com/QTvhPqO.png
T6 SMN w/ 115 weapon: http://i.imgur.com/kP6aVb7.png <------- for the record i've seen other people parse even higher.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jican

For those that are compairing Smn to BLm, just stop

---

They share a lot of the same gear, it is very possible for a player to be able to play both effectively.

Therefore if one is a clear-cut "better" or "easier for around the same DPS" to bring, I'm going to bring that. My alt has SMN and BLM both and I pretty much only SMN for T7 to kite and T9 to have an extra raise. If I have the choice I'm bringing BLM to everything.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Samano

well for a perspective since I play both BLM and SMN:

For both of these we used zerg boss method, as you can see we dont kill any slug at all.
T6 BLM w/ 115 weapon: http://i.imgur.com/QTvhPqO.png
T6 SMN w/ 115 weapon: http://i.imgur.com/kP6aVb7.png <------- for the record i've seen other people parse even higher.

---

What parser is that ? how are those numbers possible ? And how is the fight duration 3:50 ? Something iffy going on especially since you said your highest T9 pars on SMN was 350 and BLM 360.

Edit: Nvm just noticed you had two BRDs. Probably had Foes on the entire fight.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Havenchild

Wow 476 is pretty high. Personally I cap out on T9 generally above 410, current highest was around 420. If you don't mind me asking what's your third phase like o.o?

---

I haven't parsed third phase as BLM unfortunately but I will next week to see :P Personally if I am going as BLM, I would ask our melee to LB the boss instead to let me triple flare the add + boss with Raging Strikes which is a huge DPS spike. And there isn't much movement in that phase either. SMN is still way better on Golems and P4 though.

IIT: People who are bad with their mains complaining that BLM are overpowered.

With situations equal (i.e. RNG/skill/gear/same amount of buff's/songs etc), there isn't any reason a Monk or Summoner should be outdps'ed by a BLM in Second Coil Boss fight or Ramuh.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HaroldSaxon

IIT: People who are bad with their mains complaining that BLM are overpowered.

With situations equal (i.e. RNG/skill/gear/same amount of buff's/songs etc), there isn't any reason a Monk or Summoner should be outdps'ed by a BLM in Second Coil Boss fight or Ramuh.

---

Except for the fact that a BLM will always outdps SMN on T8 assuming equal skill level.

Most I did on T8 with SMN was 440 with I110 weapon and one bard that sings foes only at the start(And I have been told that's the highest on the server) while BLM can easily push 470-500.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

Most I did on T8 with SMN was 440 with I110 weapon and one bard that sings foes only at the start(And I have been told that's the highest on the server) while BLM can easily push 470-500.

---

lol at this, are we truly to believe that this unknown person you speak of knows the dps of every smn who has ever killed t8 on your server....

The amount of boasting that gets thrown around on these forums over what dps ppl can do on turns with certain classes is laughable! Soo much bull honkey being talked by soo many ppl about their leet dps.
And it is obv a blatant lie to stroke their own epeen.....

To the OP, blm rotation is simple(sort of) but its not as simple as ppl make out to play well. Play bard, its the simplest easiest dps job to play by a mile, and ppl don't even expect much from it either other than playing songs at the right time and holding down moderate dps for ur job.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ZechsRaganrock

lol at this, are we truly to believe that this unknown person you speak of knows the dps of every smn who has ever killed t8 on your server....

The amount of boasting that gets thrown around on these forums over what dps ppl can do on turns with certain classes is laughable! Soo much bull honkey being talked by soo many ppl about their leet dps.
And it is obv a blatant lie to stroke their own epeen.....

To the OP, blm rotation is simple(sort of) but its not as simple as ppl make out to play well. Play bard, its the simplest easiest dps job to play by a mile, and ppl don't even expect much from it either other than playing songs at the right time and holding down moderate dps for ur job.

---

Show me a pars of a SMN doing higher with an I110 weapon and Foes Requiem only at the start.

And no, obviously they weren't talking about EVERY SMN that beat T8, only the ones that matter.

I ask about ease of use, and people hijack the thread to argue about endgame DPS race with a class I didn't even mention *headshake*

Thank you to those of you who actually answered my question!

Blueyes, MNK is complicated to me because the combination of constant positioning plus all the skills used in the rotation is just too much for my fingers and my focus. (The same problem I have with DRG, and DRG has to move much less.) My other two main jobs are PLD and WHM, which both work well for me because they involve minimal moving and only 3 to 4 keys to press most of the time.

I will definitely give BLM a more indepth try (I only got it high enough for Swiftcast) because standing still and pressing one key a lot sounds grand to me. But I'll also continue leveling BRD, after the recommendations in this thread :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

What parser is that ? how are those numbers possible ? And how is the fight duration 3:50 ? Something iffy going on especially since you said your highest T9 pars on SMN was 350 and BLM 360.

Edit: Nvm just noticed you had two BRDs. Probably had Foes on the entire fight.

---

It's ACT w/ FFXIV plugins. 350-360 DPS T9 parse is including the downtime when she phase changes/megaflare, merged parse on T9 both jobs can do 420+ easy and if you're talking about the the first phase alone, I've done 500+ by the time nael jumps/phase change.

3 minutes 30 seconds ish duration on T6 is very common, especially on top level FCs btw, may be your first time seeing it but a lot of people have done it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Samano

It's ACT w/ FFXIV plugins. 350-360 DPS T9 parse is including the downtime when she phase changes/megaflare, merged parse on T9 both jobs can do 420+ easy and if you're talking about the the first phase alone, I've done 500+ by the time nael jumps/phase change.

3 minutes 30 seconds ish duration on T6 is very common, especially on top level FCs btw, may be your first time seeing it but a lot of people have done it.

---

The 400 is including downtime too. And I didn't notice you had two bards at first which is why I thought those numbers weren't possible since I specifically said I only had one bard that does Foes at the start.

What's your DPS on T8 again ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

And no, obviously they weren't talking about EVERY SMN that beat T8, only the ones that matter.

---

I laugh everytime I see someone say "that matters" when talking about a video game. "In content that matters", "In guilds that matter", "on bosses that matter", -- lmao.
Its a video game! Nothing truly matters, except having fun! You really ought to say "only the ones that I personally care about" instead. Thats what you really mean. You can act like the stuff you care about is all "that matters" but in reality some lvl15 player's glamour gear "matters" every bit as much as your T9 kill. Because its just pixels on a screen, and they are just having fun playing a video game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

The 400 is including downtime too. And I didn't notice you had two bards at first which is why I thought those numbers weren't possible since I specifically said I only had one bard that does Foes at the start.

What's your DPS on T8 again ?

---

T8 SMN highest is around 450 iirc, and BLM 509 DPS. What parser are you using? I find 400 DPS unmerged on T9 is hard to believe. Get what's everyone using, ACT.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Samano

T8 SMN highest is around 450 iirc, and BLM 509 DPS. What parser are you using? I find 400 DPS unmerged on T9 is hard to believe. Get what's everyone using, ACT.

---

It is ACT. Reason I didn't recognize it is because it's usually our tank/BRD parsing.

And like I said, I did 440 with SMN without HA weapon and one bard, so my numbers on T9 are definitely possible especially since we use two bards on T9.

Why are you guys still debating about end-game shits? OP clearly only ask for general stuff and he hasn't even capped yet. It would still be a very long journey before his BLM could touch 2nd coil.

Realize your own boundaries, because clearly some of you went overboard.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BobbinT

Why are you guys still debating about end-game shits? OP clearly only ask for general stuff and he hasn't even capped yet. It would still be a very long journey before his BLM could touch 2nd coil.

Realize your own boundaries, because clearly some of you went overboard.

---

Because threads don't evolve and only the OP matters, right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheTen

I ask about ease of use, and people hijack the thread to argue about endgame DPS race with a class I didn't even mention *headshake*

Thank you to those of you who actually answered my question!

Blueyes, MNK is complicated to me because the combination of constant positioning plus all the skills used in the rotation is just too much for my fingers and my focus. (The same problem I have with DRG, and DRG has to move much less.) My other two main jobs are PLD and WHM, which both work well for me because they involve minimal moving and only 3 to 4 keys to press most of the time.

I will definitely give BLM a more indepth try (I only got it high enough for Swiftcast) because standing still and pressing one key a lot sounds grand to me. But I'll also continue leveling BRD, after the recommendations in this thread :)

---

That should be a good way to go for you then. Both jobs should fit your wanted playstyle well. I would level them both at the same time if you have the time. I enjoy both A LOT, although my BRD is significantly farther behind my BLM atm.

Have fun!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KitanaiKoneko

This. While BLM may be a "simple" job to play, it takes a lot of player skill to bring out its dps potential in a movement or mechanic heavy fight.

---

U mean a lot of "mercy of RNG"? heavy movement or static movement fights, BLM DPS is more about firestarter procs aka RNG. U ever experienced very very low firestarter procs in static movement fights that makes ur DPS dipped down to heavy movement fights DPS scale?

I have and it surks...

I have gone a whole fire phase with no FS proc. Then the next phase with 2 or 3.

Dat RNG

I would level the BLM to 50, since you already have leveled it for swiftcast. My main is PLD, and later I leveled WHM since I had to level it for Stoneskin. Later I leveled the BLM since I already had leveled it for Swiftcast. Later I leveld Bard to see a ranged high mobility class.

I enjoy quite much the BLM, dungeons usually are much more relaxed. PLD needs more work and knowing everything, WHM is more relaxed but can have high stress moments and BLM is more relaxed generally, but also is one-shot much easier. As you also play PLD and WHM you'll see they are very different classes and you focus in different things.

Usually the tank is always looking at the enemy list, has to be aware of everything, pick up enemies, place the bosses, not lose hate, etc. The WHM will be looking mainly at the party list and also keeps an eye on everything. The BLM will many times have no enemy list until you have attacked, has to take care about mp management, rotations, buffs, etc. and also very important not to pull enmity off the tank. Taking care of choosing your target, decide if you use or not AoE attacks so you don't steal enmity off the tank or when they are not useful, using the DoTs if possible, knowing when you don't have time to cast and use scathe, etc. is an important part of the job as you are leveling up.

Quelling strikes is very important for a BLM so you'll eventually level the Bard too. Both are ranged but they are very different, since Bard has more mobility and DoTs and buffs are very important, and has also the songs. I think you will enjoy playing both.

My SCH and SMN are only level 34, so I can't tell about difficulty. I think micro managing and placing the pet is an added difficulty, at least for me in this moment, but in low level places you'll probably survive letting the pet live its life and worrying only about yourself. But it's not how it's supposed to be played.

End game is different than dungeons, all players are supposed to try and obtain the best of the class, if possible, and that is not easy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SeraviEdalborez

Because threads don't evolve and only the OP matters, right?

---

Actually. yes.

Quote:

---

Please keep all posts on topic. Making off topic posts will only cause confusion and miscommunication.

---

is the very first General Forum Rule.

Thanks for the continued input! I am hoping to eventually enter end-end-game (as in 2nd turn) and do well (not just 'okay'), and that will be much more feasible for me if the basic gameplay of the Job doesn't already overwhelm me. It's good to hear that this may be possible for me.

To be a good BLM, first one need to know fully details of all the mechanic existed in the fight. Keep calm and keep your mind open. Narrow vision is a big NO NO for any class, but especially BLM if you want to be good. So as for OP, if you are the type that get panicked easily, I should not recommend Blm as a class for you. But if you still want to play as a Caster, maybe SMN is a better choice as they can still DPS while having a break in between.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Empressia

U mean a lot of "mercy of RNG"? heavy movement or static movement fights, BLM DPS is more about firestarter procs aka RNG. U ever experienced very very low firestarter procs in static movement fights that makes ur DPS dipped down to heavy movement fights DPS scale?

---

BLM DPS is not at the mercy of RNG. Getting or not getting a FS proc isn't a massive boost to your overall DPS. It normalizes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheTen

is the very first General Forum Rule.

---

Which gets broken on a daily basis with nobody caring about it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SeraviEdalborez

BLM DPS is not at the mercy of RNG. Getting or not getting a FS proc isn't a massive boost to your overall DPS. It normalizes.

---

Let the crucifixion begin....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jican

Let the crucifixion begin....

---

He's right though. It would only be a massive boost if the duration of the fight is very short. But in a fight like T8 procs and crits balance each other out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jican

Let the crucifixion begin....

---

lol he is right that the damage normalizes, what matters more is skill consistency which many people mistake for bad rng.

BLM damage does normalize generally, but make no mistake it's the one class you can easily be +10% to +15% the regular damage on an exceptional run, against a single target. Most other DPS can only rely on outstanding and unreasonable crits to get even +5% base damage if the CDs and rotation were done the same way as before over 4 minutes or more, but a great (read: lucky) BLM run can lead to +50 DPS over a normal one.

Typically though it will in fact normalize within a few %.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

And I never said Turn 7 was a DPS race, I just said Summoner will always outdps BLM there assuming equal skill level, which it does.

---

not sure about that, i saw someone do 470 on t7 can smn do that?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by OneWingedSora

What parser is that ? how are those numbers possible ? And how is the fight duration 3:50 ? Something iffy going on especially since you said your highest T9 pars on SMN was 350 and BLM 360.

Edit: Nvm just noticed you had two BRDs. Probably had Foes on the entire fight.

---

here parse with one brd

"thats not my parse btw"

http://i.imgur.com/QsQcwHk.png

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Samano

T8 SMN highest is around 450 iirc, and BLM 509 DPS. What parser are you using? I find 400 DPS unmerged on T9 is hard to believe. Get what's everyone using, ACT.

---

^ pretty much

only parsers i saw with 400+ on t9 were merged

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gildarts

not sure about that, i saw someone do 470 on t7 can smn do that?

---

With enough MP, Foe's, and not having to kite, very likely. Unfortunately most groups put their SMN on kiting duty and it's much much harder to see what they can do.

That said MP is a concern in T7 if you go full throttle. The multi-DoTing is killer and the fight's duration is long enough. SMN would need Ballad to bring out its potential, a big no no.

right what this dude above me said, if summoners arent kiting and spewing dots everywhere they WILL beat blms in this fight. they have tons of advantages one is that getting targeted with shriek doesnt take a dump on their dps, two they can multi dot to a great degree (they can at certain points in a fight have 5 dot sets going at once thanks to contagion + bane in the archer phase.) and at other times have two dot sets going. the constant in and out + shrieks make blm hard to optimize for this fight and multi dotting on blm is not as strong as it on summoner (it does however have its merit)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KitanaiKoneko

This. While BLM may be a "simple" job to play, it takes a lot of player skill to bring out its dps potential in a movement or mechanic heavy fight.

---

You mean
>Move 2m to the side
>Start casting again
?

I'm just curious to see where all this "player skill" is coming from. I was under the impression that positioning was important for any class. With that said, I guess MNK would be the "most advanced" because of GL Stacks and movement?
This community needs a dictionary...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mjytresz

You mean
>Move 2m to the side
>Start casting again
?

---

For the average player (much less average caster) in this game, that's asking a fucking lot.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mjytresz

You mean
>Move 2m to the side
>Start casting again
?

I'm just curious to see where all this "player skill" is coming from. I was under the impression that positioning was important for any class. With that said, I guess MNK would be the "most advanced" because of GL Stacks and movement?
This community needs a dictionary...

---

The minimizing movement aspect is actually a bit more complex than that. Most movement in the game can be handled in one of three ways:

1. Dodging at minimal loss with pre-knowledge of the dodgeable attack's timing, saving a Swiftcast/Firestarter for when you must move, moving out preemptively during a proc/Swiftcast, Aetherial Manipulation to a safe target, or moving mid-cast to keep your cast. Titan is by far the best example; with enough attention you can know exactly when he's going to do a Weight of the Land and be prepared seconds in advance.
2. Using CDs to specifically counter the attack. Manawall in Titan at scripted times, Iron Chariot in T9, Divebombs in T5 (it's not only a shield but it's a DPS increase), Manaward for tethers in T6, saving Swiftcast for key moments you will be forced to move like Ifrit EM ... etc etc
3. General douchebaggery. The gray area where you take a non-lethal hit on purpose and choose your GCD's worth over a healer's, or make someone else (or everyone!) move for you for mechanics like T6 tethers, or not stacking for Thermal in T9. Basically, things that are selfish in the name of less movement (and don't get me wrong, this can not only be effective it can be easily worthwhile raid-DPS wise). Hell, it's more DPS to camp the middle in T7 with your healers than going off to the side, but that's one of those dark areas even I won't cross.

Then there are more specific tricks, like using Aetherial Manipulation as you're sliding in Leviathan, or camping the outer edge of p1 Titan HM rocks exploding, that separate the less experienced from the experienced.

tl;dr - Due to the scripted nature of the fights you can usually do a lot more about movement than just move to the side. Sometimes it takes a lot of repetition of the fight to learn how to deal with this, and sometimes there's not really THAT much you can do to counter certain things you have to dodge, but there's usually something you can do in the long run.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mjytresz

You mean
>Move 2m to the side
>Start casting again
?

I'm just curious to see where all this "player skill" is coming from. I was under the impression that positioning was important for any class. With that said, I guess MNK would be the "most advanced" because of GL Stacks and movement?
This community needs a dictionary...

---

How are GL stacks more complicated than UI/AF?
-Use an attack from column 1
-Use an attack from column 2
-Use an attack from column 3
-Move 90 degrees around the mob

Or for tanking:
-Hit same 3 buttons in order
-Use a defense buff

Or healing:
-Heal the tank
-AoE heal the party
-Move 2m to the side

The "skill" comes with breaking from the rotation and using additional abilities. The biggest part of that comes from experience in the fight, and anticipating what is about to happen.