Atma Grind Needs Some Changes...

You can buy dark matter for gil at a shop in new gridania.

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Originally Posted by Aldracity

Or, more specifically: The fatal problem with Atmas is that there is no sense of achievement whatsoever up until the Atma actually drops. I am literally wasting time, burning through Gil to keep up with equipment repair costs, and the FATEs themselves are even wasting your Challenge log because of the EXP bonuses!

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You're doing it wrong. If I've used up 4/5 gold or 9/10 total FATEs on a level 50, I'll switch back to a low level for the bonus. You can even manipulate it to only having to do one fight instead of two.

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Originally Posted by Amelia_Pond_Behemoth

You're doing it wrong. If I've used up 4/5 gold or 9/10 total FATEs on a level 50, I'll switch back to a low level for the bonus. You can even manipulate it to only having to do one fight instead of two.

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does that really work?! Can I do some of a Fate on a relic carrier, then switch to a low level job, finish the fate, get exp for my low level job, and still get atma?

I decided to quit trying to grind Atma after 2.3 when they released a plethora of other weapons that are not only better, but also are more enjoyable to obtain. This reasoning has just been further boosted by my obtaining an Unidentified Allagan Tombstone after beating ST again (which I enjoy) and I'll have enough Letters for Liberator in two weeks. Then theres's the fact that Atma isn't even that good and is only a stepping stone for Animus, which is a lot better, but still painful to get.

brought it up before bring it up again all the atmas should have been 2 star crafting item requiring mats from other lvl 50 1 star craft items plus an extensive SB grind instead of just RNG. a week of working on it get your atma this would get players on board with leveling up crafts giving them more to do and players with 50 crafts to get all crafts at 50 and material enhanced to actually make it. then your looking at what 12 weeks all ur atma if you do it every day for each week. not too bad of a grind if you ask me it would appease the ones who want something that takes a long time it would be totally fair to all players where rng isn't and it shows people progress which is the biggest thing I think.

Atma IMO wasn't bad at all, and I found it p. fun to do. It also gave me something to work on one dailies were completed.

The idea itself, to grind for a weapon and feeling that it's earned as well as helping players with fates is good but the current system is quite flawed. Personally I would have no problems grinding if I could see results but RNG is just stupid as you could do stuff for hours without accomplishing anything whilst someone else did it for 5 minutes and got the reward. Also why not let players level their character while grinding for Atma? Even with RNG something is still accomplished, also for those that already have all 50 it would be nice if the gil reward was increased or some alternative reward added so that it at least isn't pure wasted time.
I gave up on atma because of the RNG, but if I could skip atma I would do the grind heavy animus and novus, atm I'll just get my soldiery wep instead as I can waste less time getting that and not relying on the RNG god.

Yes, I too think Atma is one of the worst things they could ever come up with. I enjoyed more doing the entire 9 Animus books than collecting a single Atma. I remember the Southern Thanalan one, it literally took me 3 days almost nonstop. I got around 70k seals before the stupid atma of the scorpion dropped, I think I did around 300+ fates only for that one. When I see people saying that they did +300 fates FOR ALL 12 it makes me rage to dangerous levels.

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Originally Posted by Bucy

does that really work?! Can I do some of a Fate on a relic carrier, then switch to a low level job, finish the fate, get exp for my low level job, and still get atma?

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No, you'll have to go one FATE without your high level job. You'd need to be on your low level job before the FATE begins.

For those saying that the animus isn't so bad, I agree. Even though it is long, you can clearly plan out and plot your progress towards getting the weapon. That is simply not possible with the atma fate grind.

There are three potential issues besides the low drop rates:
1) Some zones are just really big, and by the time you reach a fate, it may already be completed.
2) Too many people in one zone results in not getting full credit for all the fates participated in, thus increasing the grind duration.
3) Too few people means fates take too long, thus increasing the grind duration.

I dont know, Id take a quest for each atma to kill 100 fates in each area of the overworld over the way it is now. It would take some doing to complete 100 fates for each and every atma but at least I can see a quantifiable end to it. How it is now, its merely a slot machine pull. Some people are super lucky and some people are super not. There are people who completed the whole thing in about an hour or two, others spent that same hour or two and didnt get squat. Myself... I sat in an area for over 4 hours before one actually dropped for me. I havent bothered to go any further in the chain. The books themselves should have been the grind, since they really are.You work for the points to spend to buy them then have to do a series of things to finish it. The whole atma part could have been made easier because honestly you are putting forth all that effort for really zero reward. You dont even make the weapon better, it just gets a different little glowy effect. Really? Oh and the privilege to grind out books.

Of course people will defend it by saying it was meant to make you smash your monitor in frustration after the thousandth fate with no atma. No effort, no reward. Right? Bollocks!

Right now Atma and hunting are probably the two most repetitive activities in the game. I've never really seen anything quite like them since the olden days of MMORPGs where designers didn't really know any better and examples of good alternative systems didn't exist.

If they want to develop content that is going to last players between pushes, they really should look at Path of Exile or some parts of ArcheAge, not old Final Fantasy XI or Everquest.

well, to those who have gotten lucky on there atma stones /salute. Myself, I am 2/12 and have spent total time of 12 hours(ish) in Upper La Nosca trying to get the Atma of the Water-bearer. Watched 5 people join my group, and get it (2 of them at the same time). /sigh and here I go back to the grind.

Thing is the relic quest pre 2.2 was a brilliant quest line. At the end of it you really felt like you'd accomplished something especially when your in gear just above minimum for Titan hm. Then you realise that after the brilliant quest line your now stuck in an endless ranged grind before an even bigger grind for myth then alexandrite. Just think it's a shame they took this route as it did show so much potential at the beginning. And people want it because it's continuelly upgradable and it's linked to your class. Personally I can't be bothered with atma so I'd rather get all my 50's up to the 90 weapon and there gear close to 100.

I hoped the relic grind (at least atma) would be toned down with this patch. People who want the best relic right away can grind like crazy. Meanwhile everyone else could have their relics 2-3 upgrades behind without too much grinding.

What's wrong with increasing atma drop rates to 25% per fate? Or dropping myth books from 1500 to 250? Don't make that large of a jump all at once, but ease down the grind over time.

I too liked the Titan HM approach for relics. (Titan HM was too hard for the gear pugs had, but it was still the right idea.) It let people who were inbetween casual and hardcore have some fun progression. Zenith weapons were a reasonable amount of work and skill for reasonably powerful weapons. The grind after Zenith is miserable and should be nerfed.

Let raiders show off, let grinders show off, but don't discourage the majority of players from upgrading relics.

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Originally Posted by Firepower

I would hope to assume that Yoshi will be making the Atma part much quicker or easier in 2.4 as it then becomes outdated content. I believe he mentioned that he did not want to make Atma or Animus easier at the moment as it would potentially upset people who put all the hard work in already.

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I have my novus. I have absolutely ZERO problem with them nerfing the Atma grind. The rest of the quest is tolerable, but the RNG atma fest was the worst.

Although, even if you handed out atmas for just talking to the quest guy, the balance is still out of whack. I got my UAT+Sand for one of my alts 3 days after 2.3 :/

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Originally Posted by IndigoHawk

What's wrong with increasing atma drop rates to 25% per fate? Or dropping myth books from 1500 to 250? Don't make that large of a jump all at once, but ease down the grind over time.

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If it was 25%, I'd get Atma for all my jobs. I'd be down for this.

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Originally Posted by Giantbane

I have my novus. I have absolutely ZERO problem with them nerfing the Atma grind. The rest of the quest is tolerable, but the RNG atma fest was the worst.

Although, even if you handed out atmas for just talking to the quest guy, the balance is still out of whack. I got my UAT+Sand for one of my alts 3 days after 2.3 :/

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I absolutely *hated* Animus. I thought it was so annoying to have to sit and wait for my fate to spawn for up to 4 hours, but they did fix that so it can't be horrible now.

It is funny that after 4 months since patch 2.2 more and more people are leaving FF14 because of the sole factor of the Atma Grind and again the only people defending it are the Elitist. If you go to http://xivsoul.com/ and look at the stats on the game, you will notice since the last time SE published any facts about their game's population that is has that they have not gained that many players into the game but have actually lost active subscribers since patch 2.2 with this free weekend as prove of it! Most of the people on facebook and twitter I talk to including several of my friends have stated they left solely for the reason of the Atma grind and on the direction on where the game is going....not the FF14 we came to love but a clone of the irritating and campfest that was FF11 which only the most hardcore elitist fanboys enjoyed while the rest of us casuals leave for something more useful with our time in another game!

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Originally Posted by Exstal

I absolutely *hated* Animus. I thought it was so annoying to have to sit and wait for my fate to spawn for up to 4 hours, but they did fix that so it can't be horrible now.

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Also sucks, but at least I could just camp the area and do something else outside of the game while waiting. So in my mind it was better than fate spamming (although not *great* by any means). I don't know if they're all fixed either, Seps can still take a very long time even after the patch.

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Originally Posted by IndigoHawk

What's wrong with increasing atma drop rates to 25% per fate? Or dropping myth books from 1500 to 250? Don't make that large of a jump all at once, but ease down the grind over time.

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Hell, even if it were 5% you'd be getting atma one out of every 20 fates (on average) instead of out of every 50-100 fates (or whatever abysmal drop rate it currently is)

I don't know if the myth is a big deal any more. Myth rains from the sky in 2.3 with the increased roulette amounts, first run bonuses, hunts and pvp.

SE is in a tough spot now. Cater too much to casuals and there is no reason to play because there is no endgame, but cater too much to hardcores and you lose all your subs.

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Originally Posted by Giantbane

Also sucks, but at least I could just camp the area and do something else outside of the game while waiting.

Although it's not that much better. Seps can still take a very long time even after the patch.

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I hope the massively nerf Animus by 2.4 because doing that on Ninja is going to make me pretty angry.

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Originally Posted by Exstal

SE is in a tough spot now. Cater too much to casuals and there is no reason to play because there is no endgame, but cater too much to hardcores and you lose all your subs.



I hope the massively nerf Animus by 2.4 because doing that on Ninja is going to make me pretty angry.

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Some people are farming already a new set of atma stones for Ninja to be ready with 2.4, like me. Still 6 stones until a complete new stone set.
And what have you against the Animus part?
myth farming? got fixed with 2.3 (you can get the myths in 1-2 days without doing brayflox hm grind)
the 2 FATEs each book? can be fixed with a shorter repop time

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Originally Posted by Exstal

I hope the massively nerf Animus by 2.4 because doing that on Ninja is going to make me pretty angry.

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I believe the official word was "farm your atma and alexandrite for Ninja now" before 2.4 hits.

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Originally Posted by Felis

Some people are farming already a new set of atma stones for Ninja to be ready with 2.4, like me. Still 6 stones until a complete new stone set.
And what have you against the Animus part?
myth farming? got fixed with 2.3 (you can get the myths in 1-2 days without doing brayflox hm grind)
the 2 FATEs each book? can be fixed with a shorter repop time

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It was 3 fates per book and Animus took much longer to obtain than Atma, on average 8 hours per fate spawning whereas my first Atma grind took less than 30 hours, second only being 22.

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Originally Posted by Giantbane

I believe the official word was "farm your atma and alexandrite for Ninja now" before 2.4 hits.

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http://i.imgur.com/PERrfb9.jpg

I ain't slackin'

http://i.imgur.com/WF8kdq7.jpg

If they speed people through the Atma part then killing and claiming kills on mobs/ actually getting to the fates for the animus books might be even worse. Like the hunts are now only on a smaller scale.

As it stands now i can politely ask for people to kinda hold the fates needed for the books and it actually happens.

Who says, the way you obtain your ninja relic + upgrades, is the same as for all other classes?

*trollface*

I still would be in for: Low atma droprate, but not connected to fates (or only fates in level 45+ zones), but killing mobs that fit the name Boar->Boar, Archer->Beastmen Archers and so on

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Originally Posted by Xairos

If they speed people through the Atma part then killing and claiming kills on mobs/ actually getting to the fates for the animus books might be even worse. Like the hunts are now only on a smaller scale.

As it stands now i can politely ask for people to kinda hold the fates needed for the books and it actually happens.

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Seriously, there's only like 4 fates that are particularly egregious as part of the Animus quest. Seps, Taken, Surprise and Tower of Power come to mind. Don't remember any of the other ones taking too long to show up, so even if you miss it, it's not too long till it shows up again. And it would actually be nice to have more people on the quest for Four Winds. Even surprise or taken would be nice to have the help. Success on either of those fates is not a given if you're playing solo. I don't think some extra people doing these fates is going to completely ruin it.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

How does this help at all if you already got all the jobs to 50 most Legacy players already had all the jobs to 50.

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You aren't the only people playing the game you know. There's a LOT more non-legacy people than legacy people in case you didn't noticed. I'm not saying your plight should be ignored, but don't argue against a good suggestion just because you have spent the last two years doing nothing but leveling.

You know, it would be nice to have an end game that doesn't devolve into the developers making a grinding difficulty curve in fear that the masses will migrate away from their game. That's really all this atma and hunting nonsense is coming down to in the end and no one, not even the people doing the things, would argue that the experience wouldn't be better if they could just get it over with instead of having it drag out for endless hours.

Hi All,

Agreed that the Atma grind is horrendous (even though I have my Novus), and besides general "grind complaints" the OP and others bring up some good points that FEWER people are doing FATEs, which means it takes even longer for those working on their Atma stones to get them (and some FATEs just aren't soloable). Here are 2 ideas for Fixes to the Atma grind brought up a few months ago when it started:

1. Increase Percentage(%) Chance for Atma Stone drop for Every FATE in the Zone you've Completed, Until it Finally Drops.

Let's say the starting % Drop Rate is 1%. If you do a FATE and nothing drops, Square should add, say, +1% to your chance, so the NEXT FATE you do now has 2% chance. So at the most, you'd have to do 99 FATEs in the zone (+1% x 99 tries) to finally get your Atma Stone (if you had the worst luck).

This allows Yoshi P to keep that "Random Number Generator" / "Lottery" feel and grind (ugh), while providing a safety (and sanity) net for Players. So if you have bad luck, at least eventually you'll get the Atma to drop within a reasonable amount of time. The Actual # can be balanced to whatever feels fair (+2%, +5%, etc.).


2. Allow Any Player with an Atma, Animus or Novus version of the Weapon doing FATEs to still get a chance at Atma Drops.

This will *increase* the number of Players participating in FATEs around the world, since Animus / Novus players will want to farm for Alexandrite drop chances, *and* can work on their 2nd, 3rd+ Jobs' Atma Stones.

It's a Win-Win for everyone, and brings people back to doing FATEs a bit more than it is now.

Thanks.