Band-Aid fix on hunts didn't work

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Originally Posted by Geracia2

how to solve this problem:
1. turn shout text off
2. if in a party notify the party and no other, if solo skip to step 3
3. kill the NM.

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... except they made the hunt targets not killable solo by the average player...

Had a very awesome and fully cooperative hunt session on exodus after the servers went back up. 10 A's down within an hour for more than 8 groups of people. IT IS REAL.

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Originally Posted by Sygmaelle

Had a very awesome and fully cooperative hunt session on exodus after the servers went back up. 10 A's down within an hour for more than 8 groups of people. IT IS REAL.

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Yes it's real when most people are at school or work and aren't around to take everything away from you.
I'd love to hear how this works out tonight when everyone is on at peak hours :/

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Originally Posted by Sygmaelle

Had a very awesome and fully cooperative hunt session on exodus after the servers went back up. 10 A's down within an hour for more than 8 groups of people. IT IS REAL.

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Feels good knowing you're going up against other parties and that rush of trying to get to an elite before others. Whether they use radar or not, they still have to know where/when elites spawn to even stand a chance of claiming them against the more organized parties.

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Yes it's real when most people are at school or work and aren't around to take everything away from you.
I'd love to hear how this works out tonight when everyone is on at peak hours :/

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You re in the right I think and thats the beauty of havin different people playin at different timezones, you just have to know when they do play ! Mmorpg :D

But more seriously even if they buffed up the monsters its still goin down pretty fast. That said havin a lot of groups all workin together toward a common goal do bring back these really sweet memories of massive FATE farm in Cohertas a week after the release, when people were doin that kind of things too.

Again its just a question of different kind of mentalities. You cant expect everyone to be that nice when it come down to personnal interest, there will always be more than not desirable "side effects" here

On a pure Hunt related topic its just about knowin when the A spawn and findin a "time" that can be suitable for you in regard of what kind of condition you want to have in order to have fun. Not sayin that you should do a sort of priority toward a game but if its needed for "you" ... one unique system cant be perfectly designed for everyone, sadly.

I ran into a Rank B today with a swarm of people on it. It was around 60% when I entered. It lasted about 30 seconds so I was able to get in a fair amount of rotations into it enough to gold any FATE and my reward, 1 seal, 3 myth, 1 soldiery. "Eased Contribution" yeah right...

This'd work better if they were just FATEs since they're just unmarked FATEs as it is without the system adjustment that make them work.

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Originally Posted by Nyalia

... except they made the hunt targets not killable solo by the average player...

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No, they just gave them more HP. They don't hit any harder at all.

I have no hunting LS and my FC is small so I generally have to hunt solo. Only way I'm able to get any credit is to be first to pull.

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Originally Posted by ispano

No, they just gave them more HP. They don't hit any harder at all.

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What it does do is make it harder for a solo player to kill it before the mob shows up and forces a reset on you then killing your credit for the kill.

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Originally Posted by RavinousKurohi

What it does do is make it harder for a solo player to kill it before the mob shows up and forces a reset on you then killing your credit for the kill.

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Maybe the solo player should stop being selfish and share the mob with the horde

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Originally Posted by Illya

Maybe the solo player should stop being selfish and share the mob with the horde

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Pretty sure it's the other way around

The only option for SE is to make individual evaluation for the rewards, it's a win/win for everyone.

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Originally Posted by Illya

Maybe the solo player should stop being selfish and share the mob with the horde

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'cause getting 1 seal, 3 myth, and 1 soldiery is so worth my time.

When they were previewing this content, it was said that "most would be soloable at ilvl90". I found the bear in N Shroud last week and solod it and it was the only fun I've had with the Hunt.

Tried to do an A without being in a party.
Gets upset that he didn't get full credit.
LOLWUT .-.

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Originally Posted by Anubis_Nephthys

Tried to do an A without being in a party.
Gets upset that he didn't get full credit.
LOLWUT .-.

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Honestly, I think it's great that they not only buffed the HP of B, A and S rank marks, they further promoted group play, which is lacking in some areas. They have a long way to go before the system is decent, but at least they are working on it. The hotfix was only a Band-Aid, but it's certainly better than doing nothing.

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Originally Posted by Anubis_Nephthys

Tried to do an A without being in a party.
Gets upset that he didn't get full credit.
LOLWUT .-.

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You can do FATEs and get full credit without being in a party so why should Hunts be any different?

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Originally Posted by Anubis_Nephthys

Tried to do an A without being in a party.
Gets upset that he didn't get full credit.
LOLWUT .-.

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"Which reminds me, I know a lot of players have been concerned this will be like back in the day, where one player or party would claim an enemy, and lock everyone else out from getting a reward. You'll be happy to know that the Hunt was not designed with any such claiming system in mind. In fact, some of the elite marks are so powerful, it would be in your best interest to shout for help before trying to lay a hand on them. I've also heard the more elusive elite marks drop rare items as well. These rare items are distributed on a player-by-player basis, so don't hesitate to reach for a helping hand."

Where does it say players are required to be in a party to receive credit? In fact it's stated as the opposite. Also tell me how am I suppose to join a party while i'm queued up for DF and doing hunts while I wait?

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Originally Posted by La_Dava

The only option for SE is to make individual evaluation for the rewards, it's a win/win for everyone.

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On paper this is good but when you're expected to wait for the entire server to so up and you get maybe one or two action in before it dies you're performance suffers. In my opinion, right now FATE > Hunt. In fact if there was another practical way to get the allied gear set without needing grind dailies for 542 days, I would never look at hunts again.

I only just found out (the hard way) today that the weekly elite only gives you a bonus reward if you get full credit. Doing enough damage to get a small amount of marks won't even get you the weekly bonus reward, and it's marked as not killed in the KIs.

Rude, SE.

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Originally Posted by faris

I only just found out (the hard way) today that the weekly elite only gives you a bonus reward if you get full credit. Doing enough damage to get a small amount of marks won't even get you the weekly bonus reward, and it's marked as not killed in the KIs.

Rude, SE.

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To be fair, the entire way SE calculates contributions is kind of bad. Unless someone is part of a group even if they help kill something they get very little reward most of the time. If that person dies, they get an even worse reward. So far I've yet to see this system encourage group play. The only thing it seems to do is bring about resentment.

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Originally Posted by Illya

Maybe the solo player should stop being selfish and share the mob with the horde

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Maybe the lazy-ass horde should go find their own mobs instead of AFKing in revtoll until someone calls over LS.

The only thing this patch has done was make it almost impossible to get full credit unless you claim or hunt in a full party, which really sucks since i only hunt with one person. I really thought SE would make hunts better but now it's even worse.

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Originally Posted by DeceptionsWrath

The only thing this patch has done was make it almost impossible to get full credit unless you claim or hunt in a full party, which really sucks since i only hunt with one person. I really thought SE would make hunts better but now it's even worse.

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Yeah, I feel like this is the real problem with the system.

Group hunting got a little better and if you aren't supernetworked (but still playing with a decent group of hunters) the rapidly-closing noose of "get there in time" the second even one person finds a single thing is a little looser now.

However, an axe has been brutally put in the back of solo/duo hunting, because these hunters were reliant on the fast kill times and low HP pools of B-ranks they find out on their own to get what was already a paltry sum of seals. Now it's basically unviable to begin with. The bill system should be alleviating this, but it isn't.

This hunt is just like the HNM LS in FFXI, locking out causal players who pay same amount of money but just don't have the spare time to spend!

Well I give up on hunts and just going to work on Frontlines. At least if there is drama, I can hit someone :)

Just announced a mark. People came, I called for a party, nothing.
Someone pulled, so I engaged solo.
Few enough people though that I seem to have actually got in enough damage to get full credit!
...

Or I would have, except another party showed up at the end and reset it.

No big deal, still probably enough HP now to accomodate everyone there.

...
Except another party came in at the end and reset it.

Repeat 5 more times and the thing explodes, resulting in 1 seal.

Increasing the HP was great, but not enough... Either
A) Credit should not be reset on mob reset.
B) Mobs should not be CAPABLE of being reset.
C) Whoever finds the mob should get an absolute claim to full rewards.
D) Only the first X number of people to engage should be permitted to attack or contribute.
or
E) Some combination of the above.

As it stands, I'm going to walk past any of these mobs I see because this is ridiculous.
I was one of the biggest proponents of them staying open world, but something has to change or this isn't even worth doing.

I totally agree with you Dark-Savior. As of now i totally regret leaving my auto-renew on. I loved the ideas of NMs and thought omg, finally some content to get endgame gear without needing to run dungeons all week and they go and ruin it. Just killed Marraco, which i found by the way. I shout location since i was solo, and people show up and claim it. No big deal, its full health and i have plenty of time to get full credit..... Nope! 3 minutes of cure spamming the PLD and casting medica II nets me 2 allied seals 8 myth and 2 sol. I'm done, hunts are not worth my time now. Thank you SE for killing the one thing i liked about 2.3.

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Originally Posted by DeceptionsWrath

I totally agree with you Dark-Savior. As of now i totally regret leaving my auto-renew on. I loved the ideas of NMs and thought omg, finally some content to get endgame gear without needing to run dungeons all week and they go and ruin it. Just killed Marraco, which i found by the way. I shout location since i was solo, and people show up and claim it. No big deal, its full health and i have plenty of time to get full credit..... Nope! 3 minutes of cure spamming the PLD and casting medica II nets me 2 allied seals 8 myth and 2 sol. I'm done, hunts are not worth my time now. Thank you SE for killing the one thing i liked about 2.3.

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In before you get impaled by white knights with lances, with words "...... you should have join a party" craved on it.

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Originally Posted by HumsterMKX

In before you get impaled by white knights with lances, with words "...... you should have join a party" craved on it.

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lol Well the way i see it, this game is both solo play and group play. If i do a class or job quest it's solo. If i do a dungeon, it's group play, and until this so called patch they did yesterday hunts were both solo and group play. But now it's just group play it seems, which is very disappointing for someone like me who prefers to do stuff with just a friend or two.

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Originally Posted by Dark-Saviour

Just announced a mark. People came, I called for a party, nothing.
Someone pulled, so I engaged solo.
Few enough people though that I seem to have actually got in enough damage to get full credit!
...

Or I would have, except another party showed up at the end and reset it.

No big deal, still probably enough HP now to accomodate everyone there.

...
Except another party came in at the end and reset it.

Repeat 5 more times and the thing explodes, resulting in 1 seal.

Increasing the HP was great, but not enough... Either
A) Credit should not be reset on mob reset.
B) Mobs should not be CAPABLE of being reset.
C) Whoever finds the mob should get an absolute claim to full rewards.
D) Only the first X number of people to engage should be permitted to attack or contribute.
or
E) Some combination of the above.

As it stands, I'm going to walk past any of these mobs I see because this is ridiculous.
I was one of the biggest proponents of them staying open world, but something has to change or this isn't even worth doing.

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and thats why i stoped bothering , its a frustrating experience , and gotta love the shout chat meanwhile :rolleyes:

Daily hunts are soloable.

In the trailer, there was a party for the b ranked hunt shown.

I'm not sure where the confusion is.

Producer already said A and S ranks are tough cookies that you better call for help and join a party in the live letter before 2.3.

You expect A and S ranks, equivalent to NM/HNM class monsters to be SOLO-ABLE? REALLY? Which MMO have open world NM/HNM bosses not being zerg'd down by multiple parties but being solo-able or managed by a few chaps?

Yes this game has solo-play and group play, but this is a MMORPG so this means that this game is by large a group play.

Complaining that you have to join a group for a MMORPG is like... IDK - go play your single player console RPG game then :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Ooshima

Producer already said A and S ranks are tough cookies that you better call for help and join a party in the live letter before 2.3.

You expect A and S ranks, equivalent to NM/HNM class monsters to be SOLO-ABLE? REALLY? Which MMO have open world NM/HNM bosses not being zerg'd down by multiple parties but being solo-able or managed by a few chaps?

Yes this game has solo-play and group play, but this is a MMORPG so this means that this game is by large a group play.

Complaining that you have to join a group for a MMORPG is like... IDK - go play your single player console RPG game then :rolleyes:

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Ok so..... My point was not to solo the NMs completely, but to be able to participate by myself and still get credit, which is not the case since the patch. Infact i have not been able to get more than 2 allied seals 8 myth and 2 sol per hunt even on A class hunts. And please get out of her with your childish console insults.

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Originally Posted by DeceptionsWrath

Ok so..... My point was not to solo the NMs completely, but to be able to participate by myself and still get credit, which is not the case since the patch.

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You are still rewarded with seals, just that the amount differs. One of the chap in the hunting LS I am in couldn't get a party during the wee/off-peak hours and was able to get 12 seals out of a max of 20 from an A rank last night.

Situation may differ from server to server and the time frame you play in. Do remember that this is still the second week of Patch 2.3 - once the rushers who finish rushing what they wanted, the hype will die down and solo players will have more chance to claim more seals with lesser crowd zerg'n the marks down.

This isn't something specific to FFXIV only. Any new content there will be a rush. SE raised the HP of the mobs which does help - I do see more people able to reach in time for the marks because they take longer to die. But it may not, or I would say, could not solve the hype issue because of the sheer amount of players interested in the rewards. Unless you make marks having ridiculous HP like 100 million, then maybe you can go solo during the hype period. If not, as already advised by the producers, you are highly encouraged to join a party. It is not that difficult to join or even start a party anyways. There are so many players around.

And you wonder about my comment about single player console games? What's so difficult in getting a party or starting one? I can't see any difference in solo-ing a mark and being in a party to deal with the mark. Being in a party you might meet players with hunt LS access and share with you mark locations and in turn, means more marks for you. It is only beneficial. For those who fear dramas, not even dramas like coil loot or lousy DPS etc to deal with. I can't really even see why would one not want to be in a party to kill marks, other than you personally insist to do solo, which is then, this content isn't designed to be a solo content nor a MMO at all is meant pretty much for solo. And thus, if one likes solo gaming so much, single player consoles are for that.

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Originally Posted by Krr

Maybe the lazy-ass horde should go find their own mobs instead of AFKing in revtoll until someone calls over LS.

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You mean like my 8-man PF group was doing last night right up until maintenance hit? Quit assuming that just because there's a large group that they were sitting around playing Go Fish and waiting on LS call.

First off OP, if your doing hunts on SMN, and things are dying less then like 20 seconds, you should switch off SMN and go to your BLM, (if your going out of party).
On average BLMs, and BRDs for DPS, have the highest potential to get the highest gains on all ranks that last less then 20 seconds. On BLM on B and A ranks, both dying roughly in the same time on my server, I can still get full credit out of a party assuming I'm there when its first pulled. Raging Strikes+ Fires and Double Flare rotation pretty much solidifies you on contribution for both.

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Originally Posted by Ooshima

Producer already said A and S ranks are tough cookies that you better call for help and join a party in the live letter before 2.3.

You expect A and S ranks, equivalent to NM/HNM class monsters to be SOLO-ABLE? REALLY? Which MMO have open world NM/HNM bosses not being zerg'd down by multiple parties but being solo-able or managed by a few chaps?

Yes this game has solo-play and group play, but this is a MMORPG so this means that this game is by large a group play.

Complaining that you have to join a group for a MMORPG is like... IDK - go play your single player console RPG game then :rolleyes:

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Please, read the live letter and show me where it says it's mandatory to join a party? Second why do you think you have to be in a party to be social? I have no issue pulling it when only 4 to 8 players show up except when the rest of the self entitled horde show up screaming because I we didn't wait. Also as I stated you can't be in a party if queued up for DF. I know it hard for someone like you to understand but some of us are doing hunts as a pass time while we do other things in the open world. We are gathering, doing treasure maps, guildleve, FATE for atma, Animus books, Beastmen dailies, and sightseeing. I'm not logging in with the solo purpose to grind hunts.

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Originally Posted by Havenchild

First off OP, if your doing hunts on SMN, and things are dying less then like 20 seconds, you should switch off SMN and go to your BLM, (if your going out of party).
On average BLMs, and BRDs for DPS, have the highest potential to get the highest gains on all ranks that last less then 20 seconds. On BLM on B and A ranks, both dying roughly in the same time on my server, I can still get full credit out of a party assuming I'm there when its first pulled. Raging Strikes+ Fires and Double Flare rotation pretty much solidifies you on contribution for both.

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My key issue is I shouldn't have too change over. We shouldn't get blisted from the community because we are using Hunts like the devs envisioned, "Rank B maximum HP has been raised from solo to light party level, Rank A maximum HP has been raised from light party to full party level.". We should get reward without the need to be in a party, "some of the elite marks are so powerful, it would be in your best interest to shout for help before trying to lay a hand on them."

Either the devs need to fix this or we need to change the our mind set on how A and B should be handled because right now 30 people on light party/full party content isn't working.

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Originally Posted by Dyvid

My key issue is I shouldn't have too change over. We shouldn't get blisted from the community because we are using Hunts like the devs envisioned, "Rank B maximum HP has been raised from solo to light party level, Rank A maximum HP has been raised from light party to full party level.". We should get reward without the need to be in a party, "some of the elite marks are so powerful, it would be in your best interest to shout for help before trying to lay a hand on them."

Either the devs need to fix this or we need to change the our mind set on how A and B should be handled because right now 30 people on light party/full party content isn't working.

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Well I understand the shouldn't have to switch mindset, but SMNs in particular don't spike till about 20 seconds assuming you have the proper beginning rotation. If the mob dies before that, you are a pretty minuscule "weight" vs the other DPS that when fully buffed open miles higher then your class, hence there "weight" is higher.

People wish for more coordination with hunts. The content is not designed the way it's claimed to be as we all know full well. While you can certainly do the things SE states with the party sizes, that just a base recommendation. However, that's only speaking to what it's tuned for. It doesn't account for the enormous amount of people that approach each hunt as I'm sure you're aware of.

Your getting Blisted likely because you're pulling early while not giving others reasonable time to approach something, giving off the impression of not sharing, and while you may not be in the wrong mechanically speaking, your wrong in ethics, because everyone could profit from the same mob. Pulling something like Naul, (the most sought after B rank due to mark bills) on your own is a sense of douche baggery well realized because its so sought after.

Of course you also stated with an undertone of "I shouldn't have to party to get full credit". Honestly if that's true then you have two choices. Be main tank the entire life duration, or burn the thing down to the ground. You have the ability to do the second, and its your BLM.

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Originally Posted by Havenchild

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So it's wrong ethically to not wait until everyone that needs the mob arrives? Let us take Naul for example because it's a good one. He's a B rank (designed for Light Party) which is in high need by the entire server. How long should we wait to pull? 15 minutes? 30 minutes? 1 Hour? No matter what someone is going to miss out. As someone stated already it took 7 tries to get full credit on Naul because they couldn't do enough damage due to the massive amount of people. You might call it selfish to pull an A rank mob after 8 people show up but I think it's selfish to make the first 8 wait for another 30 people and not get the rewards they deserve.

This system is fundamentally flawed because it's damn if you do damn if you don't. This is why players voted against it in favor of more instance content and no claim system why back in 2010. People may hate FATE with a passion but it works. Mobs show up on map so people don't need third party apps to find them and they have HP based on last number of players that fought them.

Hunts die too fast:
30 seconds and it's over for an A rank.
For an S rank, 1-2minutes and it's over

No credit for people popping S Ranks:
You can spend 2 hours trying to pop an S rank, and end up with less marks than people who randomly showed up after you did all the legwork

Hunts disappear:
At least on Balmung, nearly everybody still has to deal with the infamous "invisible NM"
Multiple times during almost any A or S rank fight the Mob disappears. Even when people tone down the settings, they still disappear

No full credit even if there entire time:
with so many people killing the hunt mobs, even if a full party spams entire fight and does max dmg they can, they often get less than the max reward

Fate-Tied Hunts:
Too many trolls. Ppl joke about how they are ruining the fates for people. And then say "if you don't like it don't hunt"

Too many trolls in general:
people shouting fake hunt positions
people pulling right away (even if you found the mob and were waiting for others)
people resetting and pk'ing people

Tons of cheating:
Because "radar isn't any different from looking around" (even though it obviously is) and SE hasn't said anything, nearly everyone is using radar to find mobs.

Overall, hunts will probably go down in history as one of the worst mechanics in any MMO. Literally, they fail at nearly every point. Great concept, horrible follow-through.

already a number of people I know have left the game because they are tired of all the hunt-related drama spamming every zone.

Sadly this could be fixed easily using any of the following:
1. 7min invulnerability on hunt mobs when they pop
2. twenty times the HP
3. 100 mark cap per day
4. announcement in zone for a and b hunt mobs. worldwide announcement for s rank mobs
5. increase daily hunt to 105 per day (so 1 full upgrade per week if soloing)

The system really is bad. Been looking for hunts for 3 hours tonight in multiple full parties and have 20 seals to show for it. When I turned up for the only S of the night the mob was invisible until it dropped down dead, then its corpse appeared.