Improved Dungeon Looting

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

This whole comment is based on selfishness.
You say im wrong however this is my idea, just because you dont agree dosnt make me wrong. You also dont "NEED" to glamour stuff, you dont "NEED" to make materia, and you dont "NEED" to sell it. When you "NEED" and item from a level 15 dungeon when your level 50 your just being a dick. (UNLESS no one actually NEEDS it)
Also your hypocritical, there is no "fairness" in rolling need on anything. Roll greed and play fair.

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Okay then I have a better suggestion then:rolleyes:

Remove everything! No glamors, no Novus, no spiritbonding, and every wepaon and armor would look the exact same, be absolutely free and the Grand Companies would disband making seals useless, as well as the removal of the need button for everything. After all IF we didn't "NEED" it, SE wouldn't have added it into the game :rolleyes:

Would that make you feel better OP?:rolleyes:

FYI in case you missed the smilies, I was being sarcastic. There is no way I'm advocating the removal of content to satisfy someone's selfish whims

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Originally Posted by Zakalwe

Don't *need* materia? Sir, you have a rude awakening in store for you when you get to the Novus relic weapon grind.

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Who said i was actually going to get it? To much Grind for not enough Pew Pew.
Also funny trolls are funny :)

This morning I ran Tota Rok with a DF group. I was on THM. Both me and the ACN were actually leveled for the dungeon. Possibly the tank too since he was GLD, but he doesn't play into the story. The SCH however was in glamoured DL gear. 2nd boss goes down. Two mage gears drop. None of them were upgrades for me, so I pass both. ACN lots Need on both. Wins one item, but loses on the monocle. ACN calls the SCH out on it and asks why he Needed the gear when he's level 50? SCH simply replies, "glamour." ACN says that's a pretty douchy thing to do, which I agreed with him that it was.

A vote kick was initiated for cheating. Since this wasn't cheating, just being a jerk, I voted no. Vote passed anyway, so maybe the tank agreed the SCH was a jerk.

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Originally Posted by Amelia_Pond_Behemoth

A vote kick was initiated for cheating. Since this wasn't cheating, just being a jerk, I voted no. Vote passed anyway, so maybe the tank agreed the SCH was a jerk.

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Whenever stuff like that drops and I can need I just use greed, but if wanted I don't see why not need if you really wanted to. I do believe it is more polite to greed or pass if you see that another player can use the gear but by no means is it a rule in a DF.

I'm going to just reply to this with an example.

A while back, I made a new character. I'm an RPer, so it's extremely important to me to get just the right outfit - particularly for this character, one whose visual style was clear and specific in my mind, and I needed the foestriker's skirt to complete it. NO other piece of gear looked right on him, despite trying on almost everything I could think of. I began farming dungeons at level 15, and by the time I finally saw it, I was level 30 conjurer (the class I had initially begun running as, going for the acolyte's skirt, which I ended up not liking once I actually saw it on him), and level 29 pugilist, both leveled solely on those dungeon runs from 15 onwards. It took 35 runs to see it drop once. Hours upon hours of farming and headaches, all for that single, specific piece of gear that I happened to outlevel because I was working so hard to get it.

Tell me again how I deserved it less because of my level?

I don't agree with this. I run dungeons for glamours and if they happen to be better for me that's just a bonus.
Also you only use gaer you get from dungeons for like a week max (if you don't play very often) as gear is replaced in a really quick pace in this game. While glamours would stay longer.
Also at level 50 you get free gear anyway so you're gonna replace all of the gear you already got by doing your job quests and collecting mythstones (which basically is free gear. You could get full ilvl 90 in less than a week)

This thread is stemmed from hypocrisy.

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

This whole comment is based on selfishness.
You say im wrong however this is my idea, just because you dont agree dosnt make me wrong. You also dont "NEED" to glamour stuff, you dont "NEED" to make materia, and you dont "NEED" to sell it. When you "NEED" and item from a level 15 dungeon when your level 50 your just being a dick. (UNLESS no one actually NEEDS it)
Also your hypocritical, there is no "fairness" in rolling need on anything. Roll greed and play fair.

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Aesthetics ARE the game for some people. What puts your needs above the needs of others? Selfishness is throwing a hissy fit because you weren't lucky enough to outroll someone else.

if the brd chest finally drops (140140140 experts and still to see it drop!) im going to need it right away , and its a chest that i will not wear it in battle is just for glamour but guess what? if u want to being able to "NEED" it , do experts as bard , ppl get mad when ppl roll for glamour.

i wanted the CT healer robe ....so i did CT as sch for 2 days until i got it ^o^, when i did, some1 in the party said , but u dont need that u have a better chest ......:rolleyes: yes i have a better chest....however here im healing your sorry 1$"!!$! and resurrecting u every other boss.....when i dont need any gear from CT (other than the robe for glamour)

if only i was able to press need on my tanks i will go as tank , but i cant so i have to endure the queue and the lame drop rate of some items (chest pieces in experts ugh...enough crafting crap !!!! >.>)

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Originally Posted by Amelia_Pond_Behemoth

A vote kick was initiated for cheating. Since this wasn't cheating, just being a jerk, I voted no. Vote passed anyway, so maybe the tank agreed the SCH was a jerk.

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This vote, is an abuse of the system. To need on something is NOT cheating, MAYBE Harassing but not even that.

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I needed on Tank gear and was called outright a douche. To which I stopped the run and said "Who says I DON'T need it? My Paladin needs this, I am tanking as Warrior in Warrior only equipment, because my Paladin wouldn't be able to tank this yet."

You want something, play the class. Don't expect people to pass on something they want, they did the dungeon with you and deserve any loot as much as every other member of this run.

Since I am not a loot hoarder, I will greed everything, and only need on things I actuually want/need. Why not passing? Often it hits the floor; I rather use it to sb, seals or glamour than see it hit the floor.

Can someone got a dev's thoughts on needing for anything but your class or removing the need button? I don't have enough cheese for the whinefest

Lower level dungeon gear is a nice way to get extra GC seals while doing roulette. Not to mention that some of it can actually be sold for decent gil at the MB.

Not to mention that some of us also want the stuff for glamours.

So no, while stuff is useful for me I'll keep using Need for it.

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

Can someone got a dev's thoughts on needing for anything but your class or removing the need button? I don't have enough cheese for the whinefest

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I honesty dont think they will voice their opinion as they probably never read this section in the first place.If they did i would be happy to know where they stand on things.

So basically a selfish person complaining that other people are selfish.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7otf1LNVV1r7d12n.gif

okay...

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Originally Posted by Gaddes

So basically a selfish person complaining that other people are selfish.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7otf1LNVV1r7d12n.gif

okay...

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Any one who plays this game with any number of dungeon equips is greedy and selfish. Also yes. if you even have the slightest bit of wanting something your selfish.

lol, if you want the gear so badly then there's a simple answer; be that class so you can Need on it. You don't get to decide how other people handle their items or their gaming lifestyle. If you choose to exp all your classes at the same time in the same level ranges, that's your choice... other people do things their own way. If they want to use their gear, sell it, trade for seals or probably eventually desynth it for materials, that's their right. You could also always try asking politely if they wouldn't mind Greeding rather than Needing to give you a better shot. But just because you don't like what they do with their stuff doesn't mean your demands are any more worthy.

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

Any one who plays this game with any number of dungeon equips is greedy and selfish. Also yes. if you even have the slightest bit of wanting something your selfish.

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Congratulations, by stating that everyone (by definition including you) is inherently selfish you just added more than enough hypocripsy to defeat your own point.

Also you also stat that as soon as anyone gets even 1 gear from coil they should just cancel their sub now since it would be selfish for then to continue on playing and we can't have that now can we?:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

Congratulations, by stating that everyone (by definition including you) is inherently selfish you just added more than enough hypocripsy to defeat your own point.

Also you also stat that as soon as anyone gets even 1 gear from coil they should just cancel their sub now since it would be selfish for then to continue on playing and we can't have that now can we?:rolleyes:

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1. being greedy or selfish dose not void the point and if you forgot what that point was then let me recap for you
point:
To removed the ability for players X levels above equipment to NEED it.
2. if people ditched as soon as they got a single shred of armor they would miss out on other possible chance's
3. There are other reasons for people to do dungeons/raids than equipment
4. your own post contradicts your own arguments multiple times and even includes your self in to the hypocrisy.

Edit
Im out of comments for today so ill comment when i can.
And its player level not Item level, also this does not STOP you from rolling just stops you from rolling need to make it more fair to lower levels.

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

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I'm already being a hypocrite by posting in thread full of 'em. No sence try thing to fix it since SE's and most MMO's fanbases rival Sonic in frequency of comparing about any change to anything at all ever.

Even if your proposed option were to be implemented. All it would do is have people come in with worse gear to abuse the system. So the only reasonable solution would be removing the ability to need at all, regardless of level.

But what do you care? You see everybody who disagrees with you as strawmen and hypocrites, getting SE to close the thread would be easier then convince you that what you're suggesting is a bad idea.

It's funny to see this topic keep coming up with people like the OP acting like they only get one chance at drops. Instead of posting here and then wasting time replying and keeping up with it, just run the dungeon again. Let's be real; even if what you are asking for is implemented, you still have to deal with RNG and you still might have to run a dungeon multiple times to get what you want even if no one rolls against you. If all you want is to get gear in as few runs as possible, just be honest about it instead of trying to pin the blame on 50s who have the right to roll need just as much as you do.

I shall keep needing/greeding everything I can get my hands on no matter what dungeon level it is, unless someone asks for it and actually needs it.

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

1. being greedy or selfish dose not void the point and if you forgot what that point was then let me recap for you
point:
To removed the ability for players X levels above equipment to NEED it.
2. if people ditched as soon as they got a single shred of armor they would miss out on other possible chance's
3. There are other reasons for people to do dungeons/raids than equipment
4. your own post contradicts your own arguments multiple times and even includes your self in to the hypocrisy.

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Even if I accepted this as a problem, I don't see this as solving the problem at all. I could just equip lower-level equipment (since it's synced down anyway) and continue to collect the equipment that I don't "need". Besides, having been on both sides of the issue I don't see one player's need greater than other - both contributed to completing the content so both should be allowed a chance at the reward.

EDIT: Wait, you're suggesting that if their main level is over... what, the item level? Or the required level to equip the item? They can't need it? So if I'm level 34 and a level 22 item drops that's better than what I have, I wouldn't be allowed to roll on it?

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Originally Posted by FelisC

Even if I accepted this as a problem, I don't see this as solving the problem at all. I could just equip lower-level equipment (since it's synced down anyway) and continue to collect the equipment that I don't "need". Besides, having been on both sides of the issue I don't see one player's need greater than other - both contributed to completing the content so both should be allowed a chance at the reward.

EDIT: Wait, you're suggesting that if their main level is over... what, the item level? Or the required level to equip the item? They can't need it? So if I'm level 34 and a level 22 item drops that's better than what I have, I wouldn't be allowed to roll on it?

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Player level not Item level, also this does not STOP you from rolling just stops you from rolling need to make it more fair to lower levels. I have NO IDEA why people where thinking i was talking about item level. such a flawed idea would be inconceivable and irresponsible.

If I'm running a dungeon and needing on low level equipment i am probably specifically running the dungeon to get that piece of equipment for glamours.

And in the interest of not being there for 30+ runs that are a minimum of 30 minutes each I am going to need on it if i can.

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Originally Posted by Nephera

If I'm running a dungeon and needing on low level equipment i am probably specifically running the dungeon to get that piece of equipment for glamours.

And in the interest of not being there for 30+ runs that are a minimum of 30 minutes each I am going to need on it if i can.

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Personally i feel this is an issue that may harm the games development. Level 50's Needing low level equipment easily dentures low level players and may even harm their opinion of people. No offense, if i was a player in your dungeon id ditch because people like you are disgusting. For a game to keep running it needs new players. When you attack the new player base directly by forcing them to have to run the dungeon you so very much want to avoid your basically doing the same thing to them your trying to avoid.

As people said in previous page's "run dungeons with people to know if you want gear." This way your not harming players who need to develop.

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

Personally i feel this is an issue that may harm the games development. Level 50's Needing low level equipment easily dentures low level players and may even harm their opinion of people.

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I got through my first class on mostly crafted sets. and while dungeon pieces are good for about 10 levels after the dungeon they're certainly not necessary to progress from 1-50

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

No offense, if i was a player in your dungeon id ditch because people like you are disgusting.

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That's fine, that is your right. But do keep in mind you might be hurting other players in the dungeon that might just want to get through the dungeon because the rest of the campaign is gated by it. Particularly if you are the tank or healer.

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

When you attack the new player base directly by forcing them to have to run the dungeon you so very much want to avoid your basically doing the same thing to them your trying to avoid.

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One of us is going to have to do the dungeon multiple times either way.

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

As people said in previous page's "run dungeons with people to know if you want gear." This way your not harming players who need to develop.

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I run in a small guild, they're not always available.

[QUOTE=Oxidine;2230319.... so level 50's dont just run low level dungeons and need all the gear and prevent any one else from getting it.[/QUOTE]

Nobody lower than 50 technically needs anything regardless. It's *nice* to have, sure, but if you are truely behind in some part you can always grab a white item from an npc. None of this gear is relevant past x number of hours anyway. That said, I've never really seen this as a problem, most people do greed, and even if they need you still have a high chance of getting the item, nobody can prevent you from getting something outright.

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Originally Posted by Oxidine

1. being greedy or selfish dose not void the point and if you forgot what that point was then let me recap for you
point:
To removed the ability for players X levels above equipment to NEED it.

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This is horribly flawed logic, please just stop. Where exactly do we set the bar? I ran level 15 dungeons over and over trying to get a Foestriker Skirt, by the time I saw it drop I was already level 20. Being that I'm now higher than the level of the item I can no longer need on it?

If you put in the work then you deserve a shot at the spoils, I pass 85% of the gear that comes through the loot pool but if I'm after something and I can lot on it I'll be damned if your "needs" will take precedence. The game is built around multiple jobs, if the roulette tossed me in a dungeon on monk that dropped a piece of gear I could use on the bard I'm leveling then yet I will need on it.

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Originally Posted by Paruza

Nobody lower than 50 technically needs anything regardless. It's *nice* to have, sure, but if you are truely behind in some part you can always grab a white item from an npc. None of this gear is relevant past x number of hours anyway. That said, I've never really seen this as a problem, most people do greed, and even if they need you still have a high chance of getting the item, nobody can prevent you from getting something outright.

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Its not a big issue YET, however with the increasing amount of players hitting end game and requiring such large sums of materia or other use's for the items such as the new system to get materials from equipment, people will start abusing this.

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Originally Posted by Paruza

Nobody lower than 50 technically needs anything regardless. It's *nice* to have, sure, but if you are truely behind in some part you can always grab a white item from an npc.

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This is exactly why i want this done. Even if it dosnt affect me.