Further proof that the market wards are a festival of failure.

Keep the Market Wards but add an Auction House. This way, Retainers can serve as Storage + Bazaar NPCs and are worth the $1 extra.

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Originally Posted by Dyne

The market wards is much more realistic than an auction house with npc to peddle your goods instead of items magically appearing on your inventory. Of course, you wouldn't care, you want everything NOW, NOW, NOW, ME, ME, ME, NOW, NOW, NOW.

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Realism sucks.

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Originally Posted by Dyne

The market wards is much more realistic than an auction house with npc to peddle your goods instead of items magically appearing on your inventory. Of course, you wouldn't care, you want everything NOW, NOW, NOW, ME, ME, ME, NOW, NOW, NOW.

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That's why we're playing a game. To get unique and exciting experiences of a fantasy world, without the inconveniences of reality.

I really just don't want a bidding auction...

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Originally Posted by Akira-Niji

It's clear one of the core tenets behind building XIV this time around was designing ways to curb RMT from exploiting and taking over the player's market. Releasing and refining the market wards first allowed the player's to establish control over the economy. Sure, it was both risky, unintuitive and revolutionary for an MMO. But an auction house system first would have allowed RMT to exploit, inflate, and control the economy from the start.

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I don't know what to think under Yoshida, but I know Tanaka would have shot the game in the face if it hindered RMT without changing some of the other things in place (which is why things turned out the way they did in FFXI--they let the bad rarity-dependent system continue to live while sawing off the legs of "fun" and convenience").

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Originally Posted by Dyne

The market wards is much more realistic than an auction house with npc to peddle your goods instead of items magically appearing on your inventory. Of course, you wouldn't care, you want everything NOW, NOW, NOW, ME, ME, ME, NOW, NOW, NOW.

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Yeah when I go to the mall I see a whole bunch of zombies standing around, I walk up to each one and open their backpacks and rummage through their goods...better yet I go to giant doors at the ends of the mall and look through a list of items for sale and when I see the one I want the retainers that carry it carry up a big white board with a star on it. The realism is uncanny between real malls and retainers its amazing.

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Originally Posted by Dynamis

I just spent the better part of two days mining up mats to sell and make myself a little gil. Since SE's refusal to implement an auction house I'm force to use their market ward system. No my bazzar is not an option. Hoping someone that needs the item I'm selling just happens to check my bazzar? Are you kidding?

Unfortunately, there is not one inch of free realistate in the masons ward to summon my retainer. My only option now is to pay a huge tax on my sales by summoning my retainer in another ward.

If there is no room to summon a retainer now in the correct ward, what is it going to be like when/if they release a PS3 version of the game?

By representing every sale point in the game with a character, SE has doomed this system to failure. If you don't believe that, go visit your Battlecraft ward.

I know there are some people that will defend the market wards till the end of time but the majority of the players in this game wish it would just go away. I'm one of them.

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Go to Limsa and sell your stuff there

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Originally Posted by Dynamis

No my bazzar is not an option.

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Actually it is a perfectly logical option. I sell most my Botany materials sitting at the Carpenters guild, and Weavers guild. "As an alchemist I retain all my alchemy ingredients"

I have no issue selling the items it's just anoying I have to be AFK to sell my items. Then again I never have had any issues using the market wards either. The Woodcutters ward has always been fairly roomy.

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Originally Posted by Dynamis

I just spent the better part of two days mining up mats to sell and make myself a little gil. Since SE's refusal to implement an auction house I'm force to use their market ward system. No my bazzar is not an option. Hoping someone that needs the item I'm selling just happens to check my bazzar? Are you kidding?

Unfortunately, there is not one inch of free realistate in the masons ward to summon my retainer. My only option now is to pay a huge tax on my sales by summoning my retainer in another ward.

If there is no room to summon a retainer now in the correct ward, what is it going to be like when/if they release a PS3 version of the game?

By representing every sale point in the game with a character, SE has doomed this system to failure. If you don't believe that, go visit your Battlecraft ward.

I know there are some people that will defend the market wards till the end of time but the majority of the players in this game wish it would just go away. I'm one of them.

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melodramatic much? not saying market wards are fine as is but they function well enough while they do other stuff that are 'perceived problems'. I think auction houses are retarded, but that's me. So you're upset you can't set your retainer in mason's ward, you do know you can put it in any ward, and the search will show what ward you're in? You pay a lil more in taxes but it's inconsequential.

Market Wards were a horrible idea... but through a bit of tweaking by the new team them work fine for now. In the future I do hope for another way for players to buy their gear from other players, because market wards are a bit cumbersome and annoying for their simple purpose.

Part of the problem for this actually happening is alot to do with how they failed to make the good people equally distribute they're population between each of the three city states, altho the visual aspect of seeing blank Npcs with bazaars isnt much of a needed part of the game.

I used to be in total favour of a market ward system but really with the strain it puts on the server, not being able to summon retainers where you'd like forcing Higher tax's, and the frequent market crash's( altho it has improved) i really dont mind making it more simplfied with just a click and buy, the game wouldnt suffer losing the visual zombie npcs standing around in the wards.

I don't use wards.. I think I'm not smart enough to use them. I cant find my retainer. I have to lease a stand to find it. I never know what items to sell or what items to keep cause I dont know the value of items. When I try to sell I go to search counter and I have to decide if I sell for the lowest I see (10k) or the highest I see (120k). If i want to get rid of the item I have to sell low.. but I dont want to loose money. I go back to the retainer... and I lost it again... I find it... I forgot what I was selling and how much I was selling it for... Then I have to check the price of the items that are not selling, and I wonder if they are too high or they are just being sold in the wrong market... so I get fustrated... and I feel dumb, and I go outside and npc everything but shards and crystals.

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Originally Posted by Akira-Niji

It has been stated that the upcoming auction house system will work in conjunction with the market wards.

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Could you please, (or anyone else) give a link where SE said that there will be an auction house?
Perhaps I missed something. All I've seen was "Examination of an auction house system" so far in Yoshida-san's letter.

it seems like everyone is on the same page with scrapping the visual representation/cosmetic aspect of the market wards.

is there anyone in defense of actually seeing wards full of zombie npcs? state your case now so we can point and laugh at you :D


also, a suggestion to the devs:

1) scrap the wards, but not the retainers.
2) add player housing
3) retainers will be the new caretakers of the homes (ie. moogles in FFXI)
4) allow players to open up their private housing as shops
5) create an auction house that draws data from these private shops.
6) ???
7) PROFIT. (we know this is what you want) lol

SE look at me, look at me in my eyes. DO THIS. do it right now. look at me. now look at your playerbase. now look at me again. your playerbase is now DIAMONDS.

Personally I like the entire Idea of market wards. For sure improvements need to be made. What they need to do is improve what they have and join it with an AH type system for those who do not what to use it.

I invision a large outside markplace, Maybe a town center type setting with a large fountain in the middle and all the retainers in a ring on the outside. Increase space dramaticly, clean it up and not allow large clumps of retainers, and have a search NPC/counter in the middle.

I also think that items for DoW/DoM should be more leaning toward the AH system/over the counter, and where browsing and shopping is good is for the crafters. I don't mind looking through NPC's for Mat's, but when I want a sword, just give it to me!


My 2 gil

What if the search item would search in all Cities Wards, so if the item your searching is not in uldah but it is in limsa you can go there or ask a friend that is there to buy it and deliver it you your.. oh wait.. we dont have Mail boxes yet..
nvm

How is there no room in the mason's ward? I can see battle ward, the tailors' wards, and crystal ward but mason's? It's usually got like 30 people in it last I went in, and I'm a smith!

Maybe the bot alts have gotten out of hand, time to THIN the HERD.

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Originally Posted by Dyne

Implementing a global teleport and search function just for market wards will alleviate all that congestion of uldah wards. Also, instead of giving people more retainers or adding another ward category, they should just increase the amount of items the retainers can sell.

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This is what I've been proposing all along. ^^ I think it would help a lot.
I also like your idea of allowing a retainer to sell more items. The market wards are far from a lost cause right now. SE still has many things they haven't tried yet to improve the wards. People are coming up with many good ideas. Giving up now would be a little cowardly. I hope they do try all that they can before giving up.

I'd be in favor of it if it were something like Tempest described. but right now it's basically a bunch of lifeless.. no I'm sorry, foot twitching zombies crammed into a space as small as the Phantom Train in Dissidia 012. (the most cramped stage if you haven't played it)

structurally speaking wards should have been circular in design instead of long and rectangular. but you know.. also... they should not exist ;) at least as they are now.

Are people still defending Market Wards?

I agree with increase in retainer sell capacity. I think an increase to overall inventory capacity for the retainer would not hurt. Add tabs to further sort our materials held therein. Lower to 1 retainer for the sake of being able to place a retainer in the ward you need to sell in (mainly that problem can be dealt with by having the other 2 cities markets regain a populous greater than 20) I also do not contend with the counter idea. But a mandatory auction? No thanks, let me see your sale price so I don't overbid or sit there for a while..

"Can i get it for this much? No... and now? No... alright I will pay the current prices... no. I wonder how much the next person is asking... Argh, /l Hey is this a good price? Nvm I'll check (insert site of your choice)" Or see the sale price and purchase if its good for you. Yes, please.

Somehow I can already see the rebuttal of, "how is looking through a list to star several retainers in different wards any faster?" but I am not saying it is. It's definitely a work in progress, I just don't want to see the implementation of ONLY auctioning perhaps they will have both. AH will be the flea market for deals maybe?

People like to cry on everything.

we hope our tears will bring the game back to life. (see all Disney's Rapunzel)

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Originally Posted by Neptune

I kind of favor the market ward system but a wow cloned auction house in their own UI would probably be best.

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U may dont know but the Auction House isnt invented by WoW. There were Auction Houses long before WoW, like everything WoW has.

Hmm I have six retainers myself. Market wards are full because the game is still free. I opened two extra accounts just to sell stuff.

I am sure there are a lot of people that has more than one char.

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Originally Posted by Dynamis

I just spent the better part of two days mining up mats to sell and make myself a little gil. Since SE's refusal to implement an auction house I'm force to use their market ward system. No my bazzar is not an option. Hoping someone that needs the item I'm selling just happens to check my bazzar? Are you kidding?

Unfortunately, there is not one inch of free realistate in the masons ward to summon my retainer. My only option now is to pay a huge tax on my sales by summoning my retainer in another ward.

If there is no room to summon a retainer now in the correct ward, what is it going to be like when/if they release a PS3 version of the game?

By representing every sale point in the game with a character, SE has doomed this system to failure. If you don't believe that, go visit your Battlecraft ward.

I know there are some people that will defend the market wards till the end of time but the majority of the players in this game wish it would just go away. I'm one of them.

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The Tax difference of selling stuff in a non-optimal ward isnt THAT big, not big enough to cry about at least. Ive sold an item and eaten a 400k tax on it before

Also if a ward is full, usually the stands are open and you can use a stand still. i did that last night just because i was to lazy to load into a different ward. Only thing i hate about ward system is boucning around to the different wards hunting for stuff, but its part of the game now so i deal with it. Whether they change the system to an AH or keep it as is im fine with it.

I'm perfectly fine with an auction house if it's in the form of actual auctions. I can do without the one-stop glorified NPC ultra-merchant nonsense, however.

If done correctly market wards can work just as well. Unfortunately, their current implementation and backend systems simply aren't up to the task. But I would rather see them spend the effort to streamline and fix the current system rather than waste effort building a redundant system.

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Originally Posted by Wolfie

And this is exactly what I've been posting about. If they no longer render the retainers, there will no longer be a need for separate zones, complex menus, single item searches, etc. It will solve like 90% of the problems with Market Wards.

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There will always be a menu system, this being final fantasy and all, as well as this being made to work on a console. I just wish it were more responsive, i hate when i try to invite someone to my party from my social list i have to wait wait a good 3-5secs before i can actually invite them. Or when i pick recipe i SP on theres a good 1-2sec delay for it to actualy be able to be selected, sure its just a few seconds, but its just annoying hehe

the majority of players don't sell their crap in the correct ward anyway, so why does it matter?

Most players hate the MWs big news. Se doesn't listen to user feedback and announces that they're madly in love with MW and want to keep it for ever and ever, even bigger news. >__>

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Originally Posted by Nabiri

Could you please, (or anyone else) give a link where SE said that there will be an auction house?
Perhaps I missed something. All I've seen was "Examination of an auction house system" so far in Yoshida-san's letter.

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That's a lie.

I'm still concerned that the mason's ward is full.
That's a big freaking problem that needs addressed if there's so much mining **** on the market that it's full.
I can't have that.

If SE had actually wanted the Market Wards to work, they would have done away with all the individual wards, and settled for one gigantic ward. Every retain would gets a stall (or multiple retainers would share a stall) with the wonderful benefit of it looking very aesthetically pleasing and organized and not this fustercluck of retainers, bunched together in a tiny little space.

Item searches would work in the same manner as quests: a bright flashing yellow arrow on the mini-map directs you towards the retainer of interest (who is a blinking red dot) in this Mega Ward. We still would have complained about not having an Auction House, but at least we could have better understood why they did what they did.


And for every developer that thought the Market Wards was an acceptable idea, I curse you to grocery shopping at a store where its entire inventory has been placed in small, unmarked cardboard boxes. May you wander up and down countless isles, forced to open each box individually, hoping beyond hoping that this one is the one that contains a loaf a bread for a reasonable price. Because the last loaf of bread you found, 50 boxes back, cost a hundred dollars. Per slice.

And after hours of fruitless searching, may you finally find it, mixed together with a jug of milk, and a carton of orange juice, in the refrigerated section.

Good day.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

I'm still concerned that the mason's ward is full.
That's a big freaking problem that needs addressed if there's so much mining **** on the market that it's full.
I can't have that.

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Go through that ward and see just how many of those retainers are actually selling ore, stone, and gemstones. The fact that the tax isn't more restrictive is why nobody puts stuff in the correct ward. It's not worth the effort to zone into the correct one.

I think this is what SE should do:

Players can purchase from a market board, much like the list we have currently. No auctions, just listed prices. People buying from the board pay a sales/convenience tax. Or they can zone into player housing to purchase off the player's retainer without a tax. They could even use the zone point for the current market wards as the point for the housing. Sellers should continue to pay a merchant tax regardless of how the item sells.

Not only do I think it is a good compromise between those that hate the wards and those that like the retainers system, but I think it will have the added benefit of deterring players from hiding behind the anonymity of their retainers to price gouge their server. Everyone will know what player is overcharging for items since you have to visit their house to buy from their retainer.

I think they should keep the retainers but keep them only for personal storage and allow them to be summoned at certain camp locations. I agree with the above posts that the wards are already too full with them and what will happen when more people play.

To solve the market ward over population you should have an NPC behind each counter at the bazaar representing different items being sold at that bazaar. Similar to the NPC’s located in the main cities. The difference is that you go to these NPC’s to list your merchandise for sale limiting you to maybe 10-20 items at any given time. You would have one NPC for everyone to list their items and collect your earnings from. From this NPC your items should be automatically placed in the correct ward. If I wanted to purchase a bow and arrows I would go up to the Archers counter in the Battlecraft ward and all the bows and arrows that people had up for sale would be listed here for whatever price a person had listed it at. I think this would also do away with the item search list that is accessible when you enter the wards. All you would have to do instead is go to the proper ward and find the correct (clearly labeled) counter and check for the merchandise you wanted to purchase. With this wards could be kept small and yet it would be easier and faster to find the items you are looking for no matter how large the communities population got.

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Originally Posted by Doho

also, a suggestion to the devs:

1) scrap the wards, but not the retainers.
2) add player housing
3) retainers will be the new caretakers of the homes (ie. moogles in FFXI)
4) allow players to open up their private housing as shops
5) create an auction house that draws data from these private shops.
6) ???
7) PROFIT. (we know this is what you want) lol

SE look at me, look at me in my eyes. DO THIS. do it right now. look at me. now look at your playerbase. now look at me again. your playerbase is now DIAMONDS.

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This is pretty much what I'd like to see...

- Player improvable store property (starts as lemonade stand - grows to full on shop)
- Ability to display items/etc that you actually crafted - not pre-made every look a like
- Quest/buy extras for shop like crafting support (buy an anvil, etc...)

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And for every developer that thought the Market Wards was an acceptable idea, I curse you to grocery shopping at a store where its entire inventory has been placed in small, unmarked cardboard boxes. May you wander up and down countless isles, forced to open each box individually, hoping beyond hoping that this one is the one that contains a loaf a bread for a reasonable price. Because the last loaf of bread you found, 50 boxes back, cost a hundred dollars. Per slice.

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Or you know you can run up to the cashier and ask them where the loaf of bread is so they can mark the box for you :P.

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Originally Posted by Naylia

This is pretty much what I'd like to see...

- Player improvable store property (starts as lemonade stand - grows to full on shop)
- Ability to display items/etc that you actually crafted - not pre-made every look a like
- Quest/buy extras for shop like crafting support (buy an anvil, etc...)

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+∞ to this.

If there was a good way to have your "shop" improve the more items you've sold, or the more gil you've made, à la Recettear -- basically, making selling its own mini game that as you rank up, you can sell more items at once, lessen the tax you incur, or whatever -- without it being exploited (like having your friend's buy items from your shop and then giving paying them back), I would be all over this.

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Originally Posted by Dubont

the majority of players don't sell their crap in the correct ward anyway, so why does it matter?

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but if your retainer is selling an assorted mix of items, for example: some ore, a few pieces of armor and some corral, is there a correct ward to sell your stuff in? Or should you only sell stuff for that ward? Cause no matter which ward you end up choosing, some of what is being sold will be in the wrong place. (I haven't sold anything in the wards since December, so I honestly don't know if this has changed.)

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Originally Posted by normalforce

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if your retainer is selling an assorted mix of items, for example: some ore, a few pieces of armor and some corral, is there a correct ward to sell your stuff in? Or should you only sell stuff for that ward? Cause no matter which ward you end up choosing, some of what is being sold will be in the wrong place. (I haven't sold anything in the wards since December, so I honestly don't know if this has changed.)

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No, that's pretty much the way it goes. Doesn't help, though, when you only want to sell one type of item, but you can't do it in the right ward, because that ward is full.