Dps long Que why!

If they made a job that was a tank and did DPS as well and healed , then people would be more inclined to be tanks . OF course they would rename the game to GW2 and it would just become one big Zerg .

Honestly its because tanks and healers typically are social creatures. I know I love being a healer because i love the social aspects and responsibilities that come with it. And as you get known on your server as being a reliable healer or tank the chances of you even needing to queue for anything diminish. For example in daoc, eq2 and wow when i logged in i had messages within a few moments asking if i had enough time for a dungeon run or what not from people i have healed in the past or my guilds. Healers and tanks if they are good and social rarely if ever have to queue just because they have a core group that always supplies them with groups as it is.

Every single mmo is like this lol

welcome to the world of mmo's young one.

You can never fix the lack of tanks and healers for a few reasons as listed by every other person who has posted so far.

Healers and Tanks are a special kind of player there willing to take charge of the party and put up with the blame for every thing on top of trying to save the party when another player screws up.

There is little to no point adding more tanks or healers since only the people all ready playing them will keep playing them after testing out the new classes.

There is no fix just going form 4 to 6 player party will just stress the tank and healer out more as it adds 2 more people that can screw every thing up and leave you trying to fix there mess.

Hell i have been told i am a bad tank for not tanking both adds in Garuda HM by a dps who don't know the fight.
I had a healer whine him self inside out over my gear saying it was not good enough dispite the fact no other healer had a problem with my gear on the same fight before or since.

Then people wounder why tanks are so rare.

Supply and demand lads. It is as simple as that.

For me, I don't mind for long queue when I play dps. I usually do something else like browsing or questing or DoH/DoL or something else to kill time.

I do play tanks time to time, mostly because there's something I want to pursue more often. But I have to admit, playing tanks kinda exhausting. lol
I remember that time when I finished Titan for my relic and only has like 200ish philos to buy the oil to complete relic quest. I jumped to WAR right away and burn 7 dungeons straight. It really burned me out, but I was satisfied that I can finish my relic after that.

Still... it really burns me out playing tank. lol

And there's healer role. I "could" play the role, but I always forewarned my party if they ever decide to force play the role that I'm just an average healer and no speed run stuff. And guess what? Even playing healer are more demanding than tanks.

So there you go: supply and demand. Want to play regular jobs? Get in the line! Wanna quick instance? Take up more responsibility when you tank / heal. lol

Though... I don't really mind tank / healing on lower level dungeons since it's so piss-easy with my relics. lol

I stopped Lancer to be a healer (due to queue times) and started tanking due to what I saw as weak tanking. I mainly play with FC as either role, but if no one is on I'll DF.

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Originally Posted by Vanroe

I would say the thing I hate the most about tanking is tabbing through enemies doing my threat combo on em to make sure aggro is held. If AoE aggro was easier to manage I would tank alot more...

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If DPS & Tank are attacking the same enemy, group aggro is not hard to maintain. The best is playing with friends that understand how you play, so you don't have to babysit by marking targets and rotating your combo. As a WAR I pump out 5-6 overthrows, then start BB combo while using Flash to maintain aggro/combo, then pump out more Overthrow so DPS can tear them up with AoE. Only aggro issues I've had are from +1 Bard. Only time I really get into rotating BB combo is if I'm out of TP.. Coil content may be different, I haven't tanked or healed it.

If they had double the amount of DPS In a group , imagine using AOE heal .. instant agro .

They would have to rework and balance a lot of things, its not just a matter of increasing HP . For example you could have 2 bards and 2 BLM in a WP speed run with 6 man group . That would be insanely quick vs a group with 1 BLM and 3 melee .

Healing queues are still too long.

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Originally Posted by bardaboo

The only way I can see this being fixed is if they increase the difficultly and added more dps slots. Making a 5 or 6 man dungeon run. Which would be great.

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I sent a suggestion in for this a few weeks ago. I suggest everyone else does the same.
6-man dungeons would take the queue times down a bit since you'd have a larger dps to tank ratio.

There are plenty of tanks, just no reason for us to use Duty Finder. I've said it once and I'll say it a thousand times, if you don't want to deal with queue times, or other randomness involved with Duty Finder, pay a tank to queue with you (or make a friend on your server/FC/LS...I know, socializing in an MMO may seem out of the box).

... or like I said, chill out and do something else while waiting. You can't be seriously out of stuff to do? Heck... even browsing internet already works as time killer. lol

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Originally Posted by Archona

There are plenty of tanks, just no reason for us to use Duty Finder. I've said it once and I'll say it a thousand times

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I have a fully geared paladin tank and I only run dungeons with LS/FC or the people on my friends list. The problem with Duty Finder is that the roles that are needed can find groups outside of duty finder much faster and to their specific liking.

Don't like running with Summoners? /sh for a group and exclude all Summoners.
Don't like running with Monks? /sh for a group and exclude all Monks.

FFXI all over again...

I don't need to run DF as tank , I did it a few times to learn and try out some crazy pulls but in my FC they are always shouting for Tanks and I can easily get speedrun group .

DF just doesn't give me good geared players or good combos BLM BRD WHM combo which is the winning combo for speedrun .

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Originally Posted by EmberRaine

I sent a suggestion in for this a few weeks ago. I suggest everyone else does the same.
6-man dungeons would take the queue times down a bit since you'd have a larger dps to tank ratio.

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Wouldn't work, even if they adjusted the dungeons this would just put a bigger burden on the tank and the healer.

Agreed, I played a dreadknight in Vanguard, and it would literally make me want to go to bed after some hours inside a hardcore dungeon.
Although I don't know where I fit into the whole equation, Ive played tanks and supports, but now in FF14 Im a dragoon, I agree that for one I have never and will never play a warrior(boring sounding) , I have played a pally but Im just kind of sick of em. If there were more tanking classes I may roll one IDK.

I have played DPS in every MMO until now because I didnt want the responsibility that lies on the tank. They have to know all fights, mark targets, lead. It is soooo much easier to sit back and DPS. But, like all DPSers, I have always had to deal with long queus. But, there is your tradeoff. If you want instant queues (and they ARE instantaneous most times), then you need to tank. And honestly, it is not as tough as I thought. There are guides on Youtube and other sites I study before entering an instance for the first time. I wish ALL people would do that, actually. I am really enjoying tanking and I would encourage more people to try it out.

I understand DPS have longer que times.. but this is ridiculous. I waited in que for 56mins for AV. Seriously, I took a screen shot and everything... Duty Finder was supposed to make it so we didn't have to wait for groups for hours but I find this takes about the same time. Not to mention, I finally get into a group for AV and they cant even take out the first pull without death ._.; ugh. We did finally beat AV but it took almost the entire timer and several deaths. (oh, and I forgot to talk to quest npc first so I have to do it again... yay fml lol)

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Originally Posted by Vespar

I understand DPS have longer que times.. but this is ridiculous. I waited in que for 56mins for AV. Seriously, I took a screen shot and everything... Duty Finder was supposed to make it so we didn't have to wait for groups for hours but I find this takes about the same time.

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it matches you with other people, if there is no Tank or Healer to be matched with you have to wait
What is you solution? The problem is not in DF, problem is that there is just not enough tanks

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Originally Posted by Vespar

I understand DPS have longer que times.. but this is ridiculous. I waited in que for 56mins for AV. Seriously, I took a screen shot and everything... Duty Finder was supposed to make it so we didn't have to wait for groups for hours but I find this takes about the same time. Not to mention, I finally get into a group for AV and they cant even take out the first pull without death ._.; ugh. We did finally beat AV but it took almost the entire timer and several deaths. (oh, and I forgot to talk to quest npc first so I have to do it again... yay fml lol)

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Nothing much can be done about the queue times though tbh. It's a problem with the community in the servers which u DF in. If the majority of players in the DF pool that you queue in are playing DPS, with a shortage of tanks and healers, it's definitely gonna equate to longer or impossible DF queue times.

Think of it this way:
World A has 30 DPS queueing for dungeon x.
World B has 50 DPS queueing for dungeon x.
World C has 20 DPS queueing for dungeon x.
Then you, as a DPS queue for dungeon x.
You are put in a queue of approx. no. 101.
Assuming each dungeon takes in 2 DPS at one go, you will need to wait for the appearance of 50 tanks and 50 healers throughout all the worlds that are queueing for said dungeon as well.

Of course this is an exaggeration but it's not exactly far off from the truth when you are playing at the peak hours of said worlds.
They're trying to fix this by implementing duty roulette in 2.1 to help people who are stuck with quests that require dungeons.

If you want to have a quick run through the storyline, I suggest going either tank or healer. Tank would be the more ideal choice as there is a definite shortage of tanks throughout all worlds right now.

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Originally Posted by Vespar

I understand DPS have longer que times.. but this is ridiculous. I waited in que for 56mins for AV. Seriously, I took a screen shot and everything... Duty Finder was supposed to make it so we didn't have to wait for groups for hours but I find this takes about the same time. Not to mention, I finally get into a group for AV and they cant even take out the first pull without death ._.; ugh. We did finally beat AV but it took almost the entire timer and several deaths. (oh, and I forgot to talk to quest npc first so I have to do it again... yay fml lol)

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Have to admit, AV is one of worst example of DFing. In the end, I had to do it with either LS or FC buddies. And since I had to do it at least 3 times, due to me being switching through GC, that's kinda a bit pain in the ass.

Thank goodness it's all over now. Each AV for 3 GCs done. lol

How are there people that still don't understand? There are plenty of players playing tanks and healers out there, we're just not using the Duty Finder, since we do not have to. There isn't a "tank shortage" at all, just a shortage of experienced and skilled players willing to carry random newbies in Duty Finder. Stop relying on the Duty Finder to make your parties for you. Yes its there for convenience, but no, it is by far the worst solution to your problems. Instead of waiting an hour for a queue next time, pay a geared player some gil to queue up with you.

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Originally Posted by Archona

How are there people that still don't understand? There are plenty of players playing tanks and healers out there, we're just not using the Duty Finder, since we do not have to. There isn't a "tank shortage" at all, just a shortage of experienced and skilled players willing to carry random newbies in Duty Finder. Stop relying on the Duty Finder to make your parties for you. Yes its there for convenience, but no, it is by far the worst solution to your problems. Instead of waiting an hour for a queue next time, pay a geared player some gil to queue up with you.

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Because there are still people like you who don't understand. Why do you keep advocating for paying a tank gil just so they can do the dungeon? People just need to make more friends in an MMORPG where they forgot the Ms because of the DF.

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Originally Posted by Zenien455

Why is that that dps classes get such a long que for instances. I know there are plenty
of tanks and heals and they get there ques quicker but when it comes to dps its like you wait 45min-close to 2hrs.

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Well ask yourself this how many tanks and healers do you see or know in your world/server compared to people playing dps? There will always be more dps bc most people feel like dps is more fun to play. This is why. Simple.

Also the new DF roullette will solve alot of these issues in patch 2.1. As more people will be queuing for their daily bonus.

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Originally Posted by Lemon8or

Because there are still people like you who don't understand. Why do you keep advocating for paying a tank gil just so they can do the dungeon? People just need to make more friends in an MMORPG where they forgot the Ms because of the DF.

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Because it is an immediate solution to the OP's problem. Yes you can make friends, that shouldn't need to be said, but chances are your friends have no reason to run you through Haukke Manor either, and you can't always bother your friends or your new FC mates with meaningless runs. I imagine the entire reason people complain about Duty Finder problems is that they don't have friends available who want to run these things either. What I'm saying is, when your friends are not there to run with you, the option to just pay someone else is there. You should never resort to the Duty Finder, and if you do you should know what you're in for in terms of queue times and player conflicts.

Opportunity cost. The time you spend in queue, wiping in dungeons because your tank is ungeared and clueless, waiting for AFKers to come back, arguing with the healer trying to spiritbond in all crafting gear, explaining fights to new DPS, downtime between runs, all that time can be spent doing other things. If you have limited playtime then it absolutely makes sense to pay a little bit to a geared tank to help run you through dungeons. Should you have friends in an MMO that help you? Of course. Will they always be there? Probably not.

We certainly do NOT need these "omg dps queues are longer than tank queues" posts popping up every week.

... and answers being repeated over and over again. Hope everyone gets it.

Case closed. lol

I just like tanking more than DPs & I enjoy instant queues, that's it.^^

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Originally Posted by BobbinT

... and answers being repeated over and over again. Hope everyone gets it.

Case closed. lol

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The worst part is...the OP never bothered to respond or chime in the dicussion...that alone is what I would have considered a waste of my time...but people like to get into heated conversations for no reason I guess <.<

I have found two ways to deal with this issue.

1) Get busy doing something else.. is not like you just sit down and wait.
2) When I am in a hurry I try to stick around the are near the entrance of the dungeon and just call in the General chat requesting people (not spamming I only send a message once every 5 - 10 minutes) this has got me a good response from nearby players usually decreasing my queue from from 1.5 to 2 h to just 30 min.

At lvl 50 most players shout for group or use FC . I myself use Derp Finder when Im learning new content so I can Derp and not worry about my rep .

Once I feel ive mastered the content then I show my skills and amaze my FC friends how great I am when they don't realise Ive murdered about 1000 DF players to master the dungeon hehe :)

No one wants to tank because tanks get all the abuse. I'm a dps and I've seen people be so bloody rude even when it wasn't tank's fault we wiped.

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Originally Posted by zdub303

This is the reprecussion of having 4 man parties. 50/50 dps to tank + healer ratio... There is a reason why EQ had 6 man parties. I assume the devs thought 4 man parties would be more casual as they required less players... but honestly all your doing is making it more noticeable when one of your dps sucks, making it more hardcore imo.

They really need to rethink the dps:tank ratio... maybe they should start to make dungeons 1 tank, 1 healer, 6 dps for 'casual dungeons' and 2/2/4 for harder ones.

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6 dps would just be insane. As Silver said, no tank or healer would get a party, waiting time long like hell, even worse than for DPS now. And 6 DPS? Why? For dungeons like Sastasha, Brayflox, Haukke, that's completely overrated and you'd finish the thing within the time of a WP SR. I see no point in that.

You want to do Boom boom much then you need to wait long

End of Story!

1 - tanks get insta ques, because game design makes tanking harder - they just plain get all the responsibility. Not enough people want to tank. Healer ques arent super fast during leveling.

2 - flexible party sizes based on what's in the que could be a solution. Lets say the ratio of tank to healers to dps is 1:1:3 they could let parties be bigger and buff mobs accordingly. I don't see any rason they couldn't let parties have 1 or 2 more members, and base the composition on who is registered in df. If tanks suddenly became super popular you could have a 3 tank, 1 healer, 2 dps party :p The problem with this, is it would probably make tanking LESS popular

You know i just became a archer on another server and have noticed that most dungeons so far may wait times average 45 minutes or more.
Rather crazy indeed, so i just go level up while i wait. lol

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1 - tanks get insta ques, because game design makes tanking harder - they just plain get all the responsibility. Not enough people want to tank. Healer ques arent super fast during leveling.

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dont' agree here. I play paladin and dont' think the class hard compared to what I hear about monks. Warriors kind of suck prepatch, post patch we'll see more tanks coming since warriors got big buff. Have only 1 viable tank jobs vs 5 viable dps jobs gonna hurt Q times.

In new patch, roles in short suppply will get bigger bonuses = tanks get more rewards than dps which is necessary. I'm scratching my head on why they allowed 1 bonus/24h/category. FATE grinding is unlimited. DF rewards shouldn't be so hardcapped.

Give lancer a tank job and I'd be all over tanking. Sword and board is boring, axes are goofy, polearms are where it's at. I love to tank but refuse to use a fighting style/weapon I don't find entertaining, so I picked a DPS class. Here's to hoping we get a lancer tank job sooner rather than later.

I imagine I'm not the only person who feels like this either.

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Originally Posted by Orophin

The healers and tanks are taking the path of least resistance while leveling up and grinding FATEs. Most of the people you're going to find in DF for leveling dungeons are going to be the minute amount of people who are actually going through the story for the first time.

Brayflox is probably the only dungeon people repeat since it has nice armor sets for each class type.

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Why you get tanks who cba to use flash more than once and single target spam rage with packs. Personally I did ~90% of levelling PLD to 50 in dungeons and leves, only really heavy fate grinded from 48 to 50. Warrior thats at 40 im doing the same. Would like to think it has made me a better tank overall as remember first time I did a dungeon with 2 dot everything happy SMNs + SCH. Started rough, learnt to compensate and cleared pretty well. Which gave me good experience of holding mobs with multiple AE damage going on. Tricks I picked up tanking dungeons on the path to 50 I would not have developed doing purely Fates.

I'll agree, some do run fates and then proceed to do pretty well at end game. Unfortunatelly many dont.


But in reply to the OP. DPS ques are long because many tanks prefer to run with statics or friends and thus reduces the already smaller number of tanks and healers in the DF ques. Also the truth of what the poster I quoted stated about FATEs, Hopefully the duty roullette will increase the pool of tanks and healers for random dungeons as to get the reward, you need to que solo. But we'll see.

For endgame there are several options you have:

1. Go somewhere (typically Mor Dhona) and look for a group (or even start one). I assume this will be even easier with the new DF and Party features released now. (I suggest you queue whilst doing this, just in case you get lucky and the instance pops).
2. Take up crafting, gathering or leveling an alt during DF waits.
3. Farm a crafting material, or materia.
4. Join a linkshell or join a FC and most likely you can arrange a run (multiple linkshells are awesome for this - I'm currently in 4 and was in 7).
5. Socialize - MMO's are social in nature, have a chat, help out a friend, just be an idiot and do something random.

For story based dungeons:

If you are experiencing long waits for a story instance then get out there and do some side quests, immerse yourself in the lore - it can only help to enhance the story you are currently in - and can also help you level/gain experience before the instance.

Alternatively you can do one of the things I mentioned for endgame.

Well i have been queuing now for over 3 hours trying to do titan Story,I can't progress and I am even level 40 so already over the level..yes I am DPS so I understand the queue time can get long but this is a joke ,not being able to progress the main story,yes i am in a FC but they all seem to be only interested in doing all the new quests...so us who are still working through the story are sc*wed..way to go