Relics are too easy to get

It's almost like the more you practice something, the better you get at it, and the easier that particular task becomes. This will surely revolutionize everything we understand about how learning works. Good work OP.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by v_jones

It's almost like the more you practice something, the better you get at it, and the easier that particular task becomes. This will surely revolutionize everything we understand about how learning works. Good work OP.

---

QFT \(^^)/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by v_jones

It's almost like the more you practice something, the better you get at it, and the easier that particular task becomes. This will surely revolutionize everything we understand about how learning works. Good work OP.

---

haha, that says it all.

+1

Let us compare the amound of treads about how hard it is to how easy it is.

Hmm...

I see alot more treads about that it is unfairly difficult than that it is too easy. I myself wait to play it and the relic quest until I get crafting to 50 so I can make myself some nice armor and my own relic bases. Nothing beats playing the entire game instand of just parts of it :)

But congratz, you are one of few who did not buy your win like a noob :) Hooray! You have to have some actuall skills :)

Also, do not compare this to World of Facerolls. It is not nearly as easy as WoW has became on later days..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lunavi

Let us compare the amound of treads about how hard it is to how easy it is.

Hmm...

I see alot more treads about that it is unfairly difficult than that it is too easy. I myself wait to play it and the relic quest until I get crafting to 50 so I can make myself some nice armor and my own relic bases. Nothing beats playing the entire game instand of just parts of it :)

But congratz, you are one of few who did not buy your win like a noob :) Hooray! You have to have some actuall skills :)

Also, do not compare this to World of Facerolls. It is not nearly as easy as WoW has became on later days..

---

Oh, shut up.

It's easier to get a relic than it is to get a legendary in WoW.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Filenotfound

if i wanted to play wow, id go play that...

---

Go play WoW back when AQ40 was released. Go try C'Thun, or when the Twin Emps were bugged to be unbeatable (They were anyway. Warlock tank ftw) Seriously, I hate WoW too, but you people scream to have everything more difficult and then complain when you can't do it. Just go cry somewhere else.

Relic are easy to get member in my fc almost got all of them....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Filenotfound

this game is already WAY too easy...
and ive heard that primals are getting nerfed? WHAT!?

---

show my your turn 5 down screenshot or stop posting bs :)


and ofc content should be easier and easier as long as ppl farm their gear. how should bad players their gear otherwise? u have to feed teh dumb with archievments. its like in RL

No Titan is not hard, granted my FC ended up sorta carrying me, but I still say he's not hard. What makes Titan hard, IMO.. lag and latency. There are so many times I was out of landslide, actually got another spell completly cast then suddenly hit by it and pushed off the ledge, or the bombs, I run out of them yet still got hit because the server lag/latency registered me somewhere else.

It's not Titan that needs a nerf, it's the latency needs a fix.

This game would never make profit if SE would pack it full with close to impossible stuff. Sure, a few select elitists like OP and others posting in this thread would have a blast but the greater mass would be discontent and stop subbing. It's not like SE is making this game for lulz - they need to make some money on it and the easiest and fastest way is to go mainstream. Sure, I understand that it's not easy to balance a game to offer enough easy and hard content but if the company wants to see those $$$ it will inevitably tip over to the easy side.

Can you 4 man it with a WAR tank in ak gear?

The only hard thing about Titan is how much you depend upon other people to do what they're supposed to be doing. In all the dungeons before Titan and the primals before him as well, if people are playing sloppy, dieing, etc., it's not a wipe. You can generally recover easily enough, and you never feel like the mistakes made were because the fight was too tough or anything. You just felt like "well, we messed up there, we don't do that again" and move on to win.

When I fought Titan and won, I didn't do anything differently than when I fought him and lost. The difference is that the people I was relying on for the group effort did what they are supposed to. It's not a "hard" fight by the sense of traditional difficulty (though it certainly is quite a few steps above everything that had come before), but the punishment for making a mistake is vastly disproportionate to the rest of the game. I know latency is a factor for some people, but the fight is what it is.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Filenotfound

the relic+1 is the best weapon in game (better then majority of all coil weapons).
this game is already WAY too easy...

---

So you downed turn 5 without the glitch?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Filenotfound

this game is already WAY too easy...

---

http://www.cat-mario.com/

Relics are so easy to get, that's why I spent all day doing Titan and not one group was successful. I've had literally 4 groups that got as far as Phase 5. Titan HM is not hard because it is actually hard, it is hard for all the wrong reasons. Latency, unbalanced cast timers, poor position programming, HP is unbalanced, phases are unbalanced, no gearscore/gear check. All of these punish players for the wrong reasons and some of these take the win out of players control.

It'll take too long to list out every change so I'm just going to go ahead and list the smaller things that need to be implemented so that the content is ACCESSIBLE (not overnerfed, easy or anything like that)

require average ilvl - Too often I see many groups coming into Titan with AF1 gear mixed in with some greens/whites. Not even the good AK greens either, I'm talkin 47's and quartermaster gear (indicative of the fate grinders). Requiring average ilvl filters out those who shouldn't be there. Even in WoW they had these filters in place so I'm not exactly sure why, in a game that's designed around modern elements (mostly from WoW) that it's not a part of the game.

adjust cast timers - weight of the land needs to be adjusted by .5 to 1 second to account for latency and control issues. On a controller, you have to move your finger back to the stick and not only that, but move in perfect direction. On a KB, as a healer you have to move your fingers from the F keys or number keys to get back to the movement keys. This means that the only way to avoid weight of the land is knowing when it comes and already running when it is being put down.

reduce heart HP - Limit break lv3 is required, therefore this is very restrictive on what you can do from phases 1-3. Phase 1 requires auto-attack and nothing else. Phases 2-3 require slow dps in order to build the limit necessary to reach level 3. High dps literally does not matter from phase 1-3 and is actually a detriment (since limit cannot be built in time). Heart HP needs to be reduced so that it can be viable with a level 1 or 2 limit break (preferably 2). I would say about 15-20% reduction.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by coffeerox

Stuff that is wrong.

---

There is an incredible amount wrong with this post. First and most importantly level 3 limit is not required, first time I did Titan we ran three healers and still had plenty of dps with a level 1 limit. Secondly, use wasd and your mouse and you don't have to "move your hand" at any point while fighting. I hope this was just a troll post because if not..yeah.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by coffeerox

Relics are so easy to get, that's why I spent all day doing Titan and not one group was successful. I've had literally 4 groups that got as far as Phase 5. Titan HM is not hard because it is actually hard, it is hard for all the wrong reasons. Latency, unbalanced cast timers, poor position programming, HP is unbalanced, phases are unbalanced, no gearscore/gear check. All of these punish players for the wrong reasons and some of these take the win out of players control.

---

Yet there are teams out there 5 manning Titan without a hitch......

Excuses, making bad players 1337 since 1984.

In a good group I can easily get to the last phase with my 2 AF1 + 4 AK + 2 DL + blank gear. I just need the DL cowl to get the HP max a bit higher to survive stomps.
Avoiding AoEs is easy as sheet even on PS3 from south Italy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Subucnimorning

There is an incredible amount wrong with this post. First and most importantly level 3 limit is not required, first time I did Titan we ran three healers and still had plenty of dps with a level 1 limit. Secondly, use wasd and your mouse and you don't have to "move your hand" at any point while fighting. I hope this was just a troll post because if not..yeah.

---

First of all, I am talking about a general situation which does not involve or factor specialized groups such as pre-made or FC. When balancing the game, you have to consider all parties involved, or to put it simply, the whole, the bigger picture. That also means that you have to balance for duty finder as well. The changes I proposed makes it accessible the way it should be. All content should not be locked to only FC or pre-made groups and it is this concept that has made World of Warcraft so successful. It's that way for a reason.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by coffeerox

On a KB, as a healer you have to move your fingers from the F keys or number keys to get back to the movement keys.

---

Rebind your key to something else.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by coffeerox

reduce heart HP - Limit break lv3 is required,

---

LB is not "required" in all cases, especially not LB3. The only time you could possibly need LB3 is if you have 3 healers & bad DPS, or if your DPS are dead during heart (aka bad dps).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Subucnimorning

Secondly, use wasd and your mouse and you don't have to "move your hand" at any point while fighting.

---

Also as described earlier, there's more than just PC players, but there are also controller players too. Similar to the concept I wrote about in my last post, they can't just balance for keyboard players but they have to balance for both keyboard AND controller players as well. The moving my hand/finger thing holds true even in the SLIGHTEST movement. When Weight of the Land appears, you already have to be moving in order to avoid it successfully, sometimes even if you are already moving, you are moving the long way out. This means that in situations where you slightly move your fingers (kb example: moving fingers up to 1-4, cont example: d-pad) you have to move it back to your directionals and by that time it's too late. I did it all day yesterday and have been moving out of stuff all day and I found that these were the most glaring problems.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by coffeerox

First of all, I am talking about a general situation which does not involve or factor specialized groups such as pre-made or FC. When balancing the game, you have to consider all parties involved, or to put it simply, the whole, the bigger picture. That also means that you have to balance for duty finder as well. The changes I proposed makes it accessible the way it should be. All content should not be locked to only FC or pre-made groups and it is this concept that has made World of Warcraft so successful. It's that way for a reason.

---

Actually my first few runs at Titan were pug groups that were wiping post heart using lb1. So, no I don't think you have a valid point. It is obviously doable by much more than just premade groups. The only thing I would agree with is to adjust the DF to not use two tanks for the fight.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Subucnimorning

snip

---

You are welcome to your opinions however I find that most of the time (and I am involved heavily in balance discussions) that people have tunnel vision mindset and that most of the time, people go off of anecdotal evidence rather than considering the fine details and the entirety of the issue.

Just because you or a group of people you run with can do it, doesn't mean other people can. if that's the case, then everyone would have Titan down by now. But people don't. There's entire threads this very minute about how frustrated people are. Just because your first few runs did it using lb1 doesn't mean other groups can do that. It changes on a group by group basis because people are not similarly geared. That's part of the reason why I recommended an average ilvl check before entering the dungeon.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Subucnimorning

Actually my first few runs at Titan were pug groups that were wiping post heart using lb1. So, no I don't think you have a valid point. It is obviously doable by much more than just premade groups. The only thing I would agree with is to adjust the DF to not use two tanks for the fight.

---

Actually, I would change the fight to encourage taking a second tank. Instead of just DPSing the heart, make Titan rip out his heart, throw it on the ground, and watch a clone spawn from it that hits way too hard for a single tank to tank both or for a DPS to tank the clone. Additionally, up the damage on Mountain Buster / Table Flip but have it be able to be split between two tanks, and reduce Titan's overall HP a little bit.

The main problem with the fight is that it encourages taking only one tank, and that creates a problem for tanks trying to clear it by allowing only half as many tanks to get through it, and often times a group looking for members will just use a tank who has already done the fight before. The content should be rebalanced to accommodate bringing the same number of each class through the content as every other content usually does: 2 tanks, 2 healers, 4 DPS. There's no reason for this fight to create a bottleneck for tanks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NovaLevossida

Actually, I would change the fight to encourage taking a second tank.

---

Completely agreed. It's a huge design flaw and I'm surprised that they missed that but yet the Hydra fight took this into account (which wasn't even on the DF and a lot easier)

They could implement the scenario you wrote about or they could have some sort of debuff where MT and OT would bounce aggro off to each other. There was a fight in WOTLK that had this mechanic (Gormok, Trial of the Crusader)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raiz_Cineris

Yet there are teams out there 5 manning Titan without a hitch......

Excuses, making bad players 1337 since 1984.

---

Raiz put that massive schlong away before you take out someones eye....

Pretty much any premade with good gear/skill could 5 man it as i mentioned earlier in this very thread in some pages earlier but the difficulty is higher for those who dont have relic +1's with partial af2/allegan parts which is mostly the kind of 5 mans you are referring to.

My kingdom to the 1st 5man group that beats it in full item level 60's. Now thats what you call a challange bro, not this walking around in full or close to full item level 90 nonsense. i'm aware that many are failing to the mechanics of the fight itself but your boast about these 5man groups plays on gear versus dps race which would be titans constant stomps and heart phase.

Do you feel a little taller for your comment now Raiz?

67 replies?? Really? I posted this in another thread and its relevant so ill post it again here.

The OP is clearly a troll. I don't know if this community 1) enjoys posting on obvious troll threads for some unknown reason 2) really think that the OP is being serious.

If you think the person is making a ridiculous statement and they are saying something that is moronic the best thing you can do is...not post at all. Don't give these morons the attention they crave. They post these things so they get a rise out of people. They live for that. The more you people feed these trolls, the more they will keep polluting the forums with this nonsense.

Now that groups on my server are selling full runs from Chimera all the way through Titan, I'll have to agree.

Not everyone took advantage of the maintenance reset exploit to get their +1.

I though I read that relics will be required for crystal tower. Or that they were thinking it should be the minimum Ilevel required to enter. Better start working on it now cause the way its set up your 50 classes are expected to have a relic. Thats probably why there not too time consuming or hard to get. Im currently on garuda something I though was easy cause I have won it many times, but all my groups keep dying.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Randalthor

67 replies?? Really? I posted this in another thread and its relevant so ill post it again here.

The OP is clearly a troll. I don't know if this community 1) enjoys posting on obvious troll threads for some unknown reason 2) really think that the OP is being serious.

If you think the person is making a ridiculous statement and they are saying something that is moronic the best thing you can do is...not post at all. Don't give these morons the attention they crave. They post these things so they get a rise out of people. They live for that. The more you people feed these trolls, the more they will keep polluting the forums with this nonsense.

---

Good observation and conclusion, I would agree.

There's always a thread out there to compare and contrast game-difficulty VS time-commitment. It's a MMO, everybody is not going to be the same so can we just stop it.

=========

I would think of it like a offline Final Fantasy game and play the way you want with the tips & tricks the community will offer to make it easy to understand & execute.

The community is morphing into an essence of hardcore critique rather than conforming to game playing regulation.

I doubt SE is planning to "nerf" the cam but only add tool (or a step-ladder)to improve gameplay. If only IRL I can "nerf" my school-loan or my electric bill. Can I please have a "nerf" on gas prices!

It doesn't bother me too much really, people can pay for a Titan carry and run into coil getting wiped all weeks long, endgame is more about static and skills.

AMEN sabaoth it's definitely a "look how awesome I am post", get off your high horse filen :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Syncness

Considering Relic+1 is the BiS, it is indeed a too easy to get (especially considering it's a weapon).

Take the other ilvl 90 counterpart, drops from bloody Twintania.

---

This. What is the point of even downing Twintania at this point if all we get are weapons on par or in some cases MODERATELY better aside from bragging rights and continuation to the eventual turn 6?

Edit: obviously the missing Allagan armor/accessories too.

4-5 man Titan run your having a laugh. These posts are just getting pointless not everyone spammed their way through the story some of us actually took our time and are enjoying the game. I don't care when I get my relic I prefer just playing with my friends and enjoying myself. Just another elitist epeening saying look at me blah blah.

I agree relics are too easy to obtain.

Consider how much freaking out there would be if in order to complete your relic, there was a step involving killing something (anything) in coil.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by glim

funny how people always say that WoW is an easy game, yet probably has only finished the content via raid finder.

---

Indeed, i once saw a guy saying wow was to easy and then i asked him if he had done heroic raids, he then proceeded to say he hadn't tried heroic because they were too hard. Couldn't quite make sense of that but errr...... Wow is the hardest MMO at the minute and probably will be forever >.>

And as far as i know now, you have to get the gear drops from raids and your valor points let you upgrade the said gear :P I don't play anymore but i have a friend who raids heroics lol :D