Phoenix down should be usable in Normal trials and raids

Instead of Phoenix Down they should have given all Healers Reraise / Auto-life.

I have to write at least 10 characters, but I just want to say

No.

There's nothing wrong with wiping
ff14 players need to realize this, you'll never get better if you can just get piggybacked by a tank using phoenix down

This thread is kinda funny, people were all yelling at SE for giving us phoenix downs in content, they did for light parties, but now people are against it for trials and raids.
Or I guess i'm doing a goomba fallacy here?

This would be fairly reasonable really I don't think anyone else is thinking normal raids were the height of DT new patch content and they needed to be protected from PF.

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

There's nothing wrong with wiping
ff14 players need to realize this, you'll never get better if you can just get piggybacked by a tank using phoenix down

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Giving a contingency for recoverability in the event both healers get trounced does not negate people from getting better. Especially when it has a 6 minute cooldown.

tbh I think people should be punished for their incompetence so they can actually learn, and the best way to achieve that is them dying to their incompetence and making everyone else rather exhausted in their presence. Eventually, they'll learn.

/e: That is to say, we shouldn't be carrying deadweight over the finish line. Phoenix Downs encourage bad habits in trials/raids where people seem to think they just gotta be a body. Not even a warm body.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Reimmi

There's nothing wrong with wiping
ff14 players need to realize this, you'll never get better if you can just get piggybacked by a tank using phoenix down

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It is less about being carried by a tank and more about whether the run is salvageable without restarting from the beginning. Granted, there is nothing wrong with wiping, but if we can pick people up without having to start again, that would be a better choice.

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Originally Posted by Valence

This thread is kinda funny, people were all yelling at SE for giving us phoenix downs in content, they did for light parties, but now people are against it for trials and raids.
Or I guess i'm doing a goomba fallacy here?

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"The community" doesn't exist. Many, many people are expressing many, many opinions and some are heard more than others.

The lack of raise items was perfectly fine with me but I had no reason to voice that opinion until now.

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Originally Posted by Aidorouge

I assume its because some people felt light party content was getting harder in Dawntrail, which necessitated Phoenix Down use in their eyes with how often people were dying (this IS the expansion that gave us all those infamous "30 minutes of the tank soloing the final dungeon boss"), whereas people still routinely call 8-man content "too easy" so allowing Phoenix Downs "dumbs it down further" to them. Doubly so when there's an increased amount of revives already available from the 2nd healer along with a chance of having SMN/RDM in there.

Now that I think about it though... weren't there incidents of tanks soloing DT trials and normal raids too while the rest of the party was on the floor? Or was it strictly 4-man dungeons?

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8 man content is harder than dungeons. Especially 8 man raids. Wipes happen a lot more frequently in there. But it's still the same baseline of difficulty bracket (story level content), that's like extreme trials vs late savage fights in their own difficulty bracket (challenging content).

And yes of course you can solo trials and raids as tanks, but like for dungeons it depends if those encounters have stack markers or not (soft body checks). Those tend to flatten tanks if they're the only ones still standing. So to make it more egregious sometimes you have the tanks continue tanking to show off, and it lasts for ages until a stack marker comes back, and they wipe, and waste everyone's time.