Genuine Question Here

Forums are made for discussion. Having people leave because you/they disagree would be absolutely pointless.

Maybe at this point it would be better to shut down the forums. People can't agree politely and it seems like many have taken things to the extremes. We have people brigading with their private discords, small armies of alts doing the same.

Even without all of that, it's very rare to see people on here trying to find a compromise. People treat discussions like wars to the point where they're willing to outright lie to "win".

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

Forums are made for discussion. Having people leave because you/they disagree would be absolutely pointless.

Maybe at this point it would be better to shut down the forums. People can't agree politely and it seems like many have taken things to the extremes. We have people brigading with their private discords, small armies of alts doing the same.

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That first part is the idea that I hold as well but it's clear over the years things as they are doesn't seem to be working. One side doesn't seem to want a dialogue and attempts to push the other away from the space. Agreeing to disagree has become far less common and its just a war zone now.

Why I ask if those with negative opinions on the game simply want their own feedback space so they don't have to fight with the other side.

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

Maybe at this point it would be better to shut down the forums.

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I disagree.

I've made many friends here over the years, particularly individuals I would not have ordinarily encountered in-game due to being on a completely different server and region.

It's by no means a perfect place, though as far as places to discuss the game are concerned it's arguably the best of the lot.

Nobody needs to leave the forum and it doesn't need to be shut down.

It also strikes me as rather strange that there's recent attempts to lump people into 'sides', especially when quite often many of those being pushed into either 'side' are completely unaffiliated with one another.

The other thing with most forums is that there is an expected base level of people liking the thing that the forums are intended to discuss. Not in a "love every part of it or you're out" way, but in a well moderated forum there's going to be a point at which a moderator says "you've done nothing here but attack the game and people who enjoy the game; you are clearly not our target audience and you're making discussion difficult for the people we actually want to cater to". And then the person would have the choice of being more civil or leaving.

None of that is happening here. There's no control over negativity, it drives away the people who want a balanced forum for discussing the game, and it gets further and further entrenched because new arrivals decide this is an unpleasant place to be.

It's like if they were running a hotel or a restaurant. They can let everyone in, and let disruptive guests run riot and ruin the experience for everyone else, or they can say no to a small number of people and encourage more pleasant people to stay as a result.

And yeah, maybe the person with a negative opinion has some good ideas for improvement, but if they do nothing but hang around and berate the staff – and then berate the other patrons for daring to enjoy the place as it is – then all the good ideas and intentions don't matter. Doubly so if it's just a matter of personal taste.

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Originally Posted by IkaraGreydancer

That first part is the idea that I hold as well but it's clear over the years things as they are doesn't seem to be working. One side doesn't seem to want a dialogue and attempts to push the other away from the space. Agreeing to disagree has become far less common and its just a war zone now.

Why I ask if those with negative opinions on the game simply want their own feedback space so they don't have to fight with the other side.

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I don't want to point fingers but I think you're a bit biased as it's not just one side that's acting this way. Anyone that's level headed and reasonable is pretty tired of it all at this point. It's hard to tell what's real due to the alts though. People on both extremes seem to have all the time in the world to create alts to try to bait out the other side.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

It also strikes me as rather strange that there's recent attempts to lump people into 'sides', especially when quite often many of those being pushed into either 'side' are completely unaffiliated with one another.

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I mean I understand that most of us aren't some ven diagram of side a and side b, but there are "factions" on here, I guess. I'd like to think a good amount of us are just normal, reasonable people who have no agendas, who say what they feel whether they like something or dislike something but we've had a couple of people admit they have their own discords and that they likely brigade the forums. We know that certain groups of alts likely do the same.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I disagree.

I've made many friends here over the years, particularly individuals I would not have ordinarily encountered in-game due to being on a completely different server and region.

It's by no means a perfect place, though as far as places to discuss the game are concerned it's arguably the best of the lot.

Nobody needs to leave the forum and it doesn't need to be shut down.

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Then I'd have to ask. Why are certain viewpoints shunned off here in regards to the game? We all understand here that we're not going to always see eye to eye but there's a looming issue where more positive views are treated as lessers/game ruining. It's why I bring up the concept of separation

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

Anyone that's level headed and reasonable is pretty tired of it all at this point. It's hard to tell what's real due to the alts though. People on both extremes seem to have all the time in the world to create alts to try to bait out the other side.

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So much this. There are so many extremes from both sides on here that I often find myself not engaging in anything even though I want to. I just cannot be bothered to deal with the pettiness of it all. I just want people to talk about the game with, not have this weird war on proper forum etiquette to prove a point that the devs likely will never even see. It's exhausting. Physically, and mentally.

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

I don't want to point fingers but I think you're a bit biased as it's not just one side that's acting this way. Anyone that's level headed and reasonable is pretty tired of it all at this point. It's hard to tell what's real due to the alts though. People on both extremes seem to have all the time in the world to create alts to try to bait out the other side.

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Tbf I didnt't specify which side was doing what there. It happens on both but there is a clear lean to a particular side in that regard. I'd never say it's 100 to 0. I'll easily say I have some bias and can only go on what I see same goes for anyone. I'm often labeled a white knight/shill/troll etc. despite expressing my issues with the game before. But because I defend or are content with certain things others aren't I get the famous labels as do others. That does aid in souring the perception of the other side when you're called things that you aren't. It's not good for a healthy forum environment.

(Also don't know how to quote 2 people or I'd have added this to my post to Theodric so my apologies from the double post if it ends up being one).

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Originally Posted by IkaraGreydancer

(Also don't know how to quote 2 people or I'd have added this to my post to Theodric so my apologies from the double post if it ends up being one).

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This button on the far right below the like button

https://i.imgur.com/l61Gnvt.png

You can also hit "Reply with Quote" and copy that dialogue and then hit "Reply with Quote" again on a different post and paste it. That would be a manual multi qoute.

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Originally Posted by IkaraGreydancer

(Also don't know how to quote 2 people or I'd have added this to my post to Theodric so my apologies from the double post if it ends up being one).

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You either click the little "plus quote" icon in the lower right corner of the posts, then the red "reply to thread" button at the bottom of the page to get all the selected quotes at once, or you do it manually and copy-paste your first quote-and-reply into the next text box.

Quoted text is still just text. Cut it, paste it, delete out the irrelevant lines and images, split it in half and transplant a second copy of the quote coding tag at the beginning of the second half.