Proposal: A Solution to Third Party Tool Problem

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

This is not necessarily the case. If the game would have an official addon API then the devs would have the full control what is allowed and what is not. The situation in World of Warcraft is a special one. The addon API is very huge and the addons have access to literary everything. But there also other MMOs with addons. And in those MMOs the situation does not get out of hand.


Cheers

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Yep. ESO for example. it uses a LUA Framework which is still highly restricted.
As far as I know. it also is a read only framework

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

This is not necessarily the case. If the game would have an official addon API then the devs would have the full control what is allowed and what is not. The situation in World of Warcraft is a special one. The addon API is very huge and the addons have access to literary everything. But there also other MMOs with addons. And in those MMOs the situation does not get out of hand.


Cheers

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I'd rather FF14 just make an official addon browser. Save them the developer time. There is no way FF14 will implement even half of DelvUI's functionality any time soon. I doubt they can even do it by next decade.

Most of the vetted plugins on XIVLauncher (i.e. not random ones on GitHub) don't give any gameplay advantage in the first place. All they do is improve comfort.

Things like chat bubbles or having larger fonts on your ability cooldowns should already be in the game at this point.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

This is not necessarily the case. If the game would have an official addon API then the devs would have the full control what is allowed and what is not. The situation in World of Warcraft is a special one. The addon API is very huge and the addons have access to literary everything. But there also other MMOs with addons. And in those MMOs the situation does not get out of hand.

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This still relies on Square Enix taking a stance on what tools are acceptable and those that aren't. At the end of the day, the vast majority of third party tools in the entire toolset are never going to be deemed acceptable so an official plugin framework would still results in a lot of lost functionality for many users.

Not to mention that a lot of the problem also relies on the fact Square Enix seemingly have very few if any client-side mechanisms to detect or prevent the use of these tools. An official plugin framework doesn't really solve the wider problem in this discussion as the existing tools would continue to work.

This entire discussion on third party tools is a useless loop of people getting upset at those using it and people getting upset at the prospect of them going away. Until Square Enix just come out and say they're adding a kernel level anti-cheat like Riot Vanguard (used in Valorant and League of Legends) or something of that nature, the situation will never change and you'll be able to keep using these plugins without Square Enix knowing about it.

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Originally Posted by Johners

This still relies on Square Enix taking a stance on what tools are acceptable and those that aren't. At the end of the day, the vast majority of third party tools in the entire toolset are never going to be deemed acceptable so an official plugin framework would still results in a lot of lost functionality for many users.

Not to mention that a lot of the problem also relies on the fact Square Enix seemingly have very few if any client-side mechanisms to detect or prevent the use of these tools. An official plugin framework doesn't really solve the wider problem in this discussion as the existing tools would continue to work.

This entire discussion on third party tools is a useless loop of people getting upset at those using it and people getting upset at the prospect of them going away. Until Square Enix just come out and say they're adding a kernel level anti-cheat like Riot Vanguard (used in Valorant and League of Legends) or something of that nature, the situation will never change and you'll be able to keep using these plugins without Square Enix knowing about it.

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No. They need to take a stance on which information they are willing to provide. not which tools are using them or how they use them. It is a massive difference

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Originally Posted by Reelos

No. They need to take a stance on which information they are willing to provide. not which tools are using them or how they use them. It is a massive difference

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I should add, that this would also be groundwork for those detection mechanisms. since they can then start to create a watcher for the game's data.

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Originally Posted by Johners

This entire discussion on third party tools is a useless loop of people getting upset at those using it and people getting upset at the prospect of them going away. Until Square Enix just come out and say they're adding a kernel level anti-cheat like Riot Vanguard (used in Valorant and League of Legends) or something of that nature, the situation will never change and you'll be able to keep using these plugins without Square Enix knowing about it.

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You are not wrong about that. I gotta add this then. I am not mad. I am as annoyed by this loop as you are. What I am trying to is break this loop. Since there would be clearity which we are lacking right now

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Johners

This still relies on Square Enix taking a stance on what tools are acceptable and those that aren't. At the end of the day, the vast majority of third party tools in the entire toolset are never going to be deemed acceptable so an official plugin framework would still results in a lot of lost functionality for many users.

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Yes and no. Some functionality like parsers would not work anymore. But otoh you could have new functionality, which is not in the current mods. :)

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Originally Posted by Johners

Not to mention that a lot of the problem also relies on the fact Square Enix seemingly have very few if any client-side mechanisms to detect or prevent the use of these tools. An official plugin framework doesn't really solve the wider problem in this discussion as the existing tools would continue to work.

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There are some non-intrusive methods to prevent the usage of modifications. They could start to encrypt parts of the client or use methods like ASLR. This would make it way harder to create reliable interface mods. But atm they do nothing.


Cheers

New to MMOs eh? This isn’t a negotiation dawg.