Balance

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Originally Posted by SargeTheSeagull

Balance. Doesn’t. Matter. Every job is viable. People whining about job balance (which literally doesn’t matter in everything except week 1 ultimate prog) is how we got to this abysmal state of job design with every job being identical give or take two or three abilities.

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You know that every job is viable because of balance, right?

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Originally Posted by CKNovel

Before adjusments, in 6.0, DRK could afk a whole minute and still outdps PLD.
Do you think it's funny to play an undertuned job? Why you should put extra effort while other job can bring much more with much less efforts?
If the job feels weak, it feels bad.

Using "Balance doesn't matter, all jobs can clear" can excuse many crappy situations.
Imagine if BLM was below SMN and RDM? But it wouldn't matter since all jobs can clear?
What if all 3 physical ranged were at the top? But it wouldn't matter since all jobs can clear?
What if DRG, MNK, RPR and NIN got access to crazy survival but not SAM? But it wouldn't matter since all jobs can clear?

Currently, MCH is below DNC&BRD or just barely ahead by a pixel, but without the extra support the BRD and DNC can bring. It's not balanced.

Let's name this the "all jobs can clear" fallacy.

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As someone who seeks out ‘difficult’ jobs, it’s because of the playstyles and utility they offer, selfish or not. If either gets trimmed out while throwing in random potency buffs for no real reason (SB/ShB SMN, 6.1 NIN) I tend to get really pissed about it, as often those random potency buffs tend to land on filler skills, undermining the value of executing the rotation correctly compared to simply maintaining uptime on top of stripping out distinctive mechanics.


Sure, some forms of utility are parasitic (Pre ShB DRG/BRD, Shadewalker) or take advantage of how they interact with the game (Bloodwhetting, Macrocosmos) and therefore wind up being unhealthy on the whole, but SE has often removed those with prejudice rather than asking why people valued those abilities in the first place and trying to make healthier versions of those effects.

As always, I think they simply do not have the resources to do those things proper justice.

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Originally Posted by Picker

I think the job balance is in a really good place right now. Reaper is performing where it should, and hasn’t been left in the dust. Are you looking at high percentile parses and and assuming that’s how dps shakes out in your struggling ex3 pug? Because in that situation an average player on reaper will out-perform most other jobs with average players.

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I’m looking at the job as a whole. The one thing I do not do, is struggling in ex3 I assure you. Reaper is not in a good place and is not where it should be in the slightest.

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Originally Posted by Wyakin

I serious don’t understand how balancing is done in this game. 6.0 everyone went mental about reaper being over powered. Several patches later and every job has been buffed once, twice and sometimes three times leaving reaper in the dust. The power creep is unreal and crazy. To a point where what was once the most powerful melee to by far and large the worst. At what point does someone say “we’ve gone too far with our buffs” or actually try to balance the classes.

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It would have been better to slightly nerf reaper (and maybe monk too) instead of buffing everything else but people cry about potency nerfs so here we are. We've seen this scenario play out every expansion. It'll happen in 7.0, too.

in hindsight, I have to agree. However 4 months ago I'd have argued against this. That being said, now in my opinion, SE have gone way overboard with their buffs the only solution is to simply... buff reaper to catch up. Sadly this is a drop in the water compared to the salt mines from SAMs and NINs right now with the bizarre 6.1 changes

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Originally Posted by Wyakin

in hindsight, I have to agree. However 4 months ago I'd have argued against this. That being said, now in my opinion, SE have gone way overboard with their buffs the only solution is to simply... buff reaper to catch up. Sadly this is a drop in the water compared to the salt mines from SAMs and NINs right now with the bizarre 6.1 changes

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Yes, because Reaper being slightly weaker than other jobs is nowhere near as much of an issue as jobs feeling awful to play. Any content can be cleared by any job, whether you're doing 6000 dps or 6100 matters very little in comparison to your job feeling awful to play.

Reaper got weaker?

MCHs say hi! Seriously, that job needs a huge buff. MCH, I mean.

Agreed saw the fellow McH

Reaper still brings a party heal over all the dps higher than it and the difference between Reaper and the highest dps is less than 3%. Reaper is fine.

To put it in an even larger perspective, the dps difference between Reaper and the Ninja right now is lower than the dps difference between Reaper and the 5 jobs below it.

Look past dps.