Balance

[Wyakin]

I serious don’t understand how balancing is done in this game. 6.0 everyone went mental about reaper being over powered. Several patches later and every job has been buffed once, twice and sometimes three times leaving reaper in the dust. The power creep is unreal and crazy. To a point where what was once the most powerful melee to by far and large the worst. At what point does someone say “we’ve gone too far with our buffs” or actually try to balance the classes.

[SargeTheSeagull]

Balance. Doesn’t. Matter. Every job is viable. People whining about job balance (which literally doesn’t matter in everything except week 1 ultimate prog) is how we got to this abysmal state of job design with every job being identical give or take two or three abilities.

[MikoRemi]

Balance. Doesn’t. Matter. Every job is viable. People whining about job balance (which literally doesn’t matter in everything except week 1 ultimate prog) is how we got to this abysmal state of job design with every job being identical give or take two or three abilities.

Just because all of them are viable doesn't mean all of them feel great. Machinist is a great example of that as is. If anything, because everything can clear content, it shouldn't matter if some classes are changed to be made better, carefully of course.

The job design changes mainly come from trying to appeal to the casual base too hard, lowering the skill ceiling rather than the floor which has been exceptionally terrible. Yet these same people will somehow manage to have a hard time regardless because they just can't be bothered to take any sort of time to learn the jobs no matter how easy they get. Lowering the skill floor is one thing, that shouldn't be a big deal, but lowering the ceiling has been a rather sorrowful experience.

Personally I think Reaper is in a pretty good spot though, it's around the middle in terms of DPS given the insanity of Arcane Circle while having a rather powerful set of potencies all without being overly complex. It's still not quite as static and easy as Dragoon of course, but it certainly holds its own so I don't know where the idea of being the worst comes from. Most I would like is for some fixes to the actual button bloat like Arcane Circle turning into Plentiful Harvest once you hit the button and Enshroud turning into Communio while the state is active. That's a whole other topic though.

[MrJPtheAssassin]

Balance. Doesn’t. Matter. Every job is viable. People whining about job balance (which literally doesn’t matter in everything except week 1 ultimate prog) is how we got to this abysmal state of job design with every job being identical give or take two or three abilities.

Just because all jobs can clear content doesn't mean there shouldn't be a balance. I want to point out the caster role for this. Right now there really isn't a real reason to take an smn over an rdm because smn does the same damage as an rdm but is worst for prog than rdm. Rdm can do everything an smn can but better since it's the better support mage. Meanwhile, you have this huge gap in the casters. There isn't a middle mage that offers higher dam and some utility/buffs at all now, you have the pure dps mage in BLM and the support mage in rdm but nothing in between since smn doesn't fill this spot anymore. The game might as well have just two casters now that they gutted smn. Either way, my point is if you don't have a balance among jobs it will lead to ppl denying party spots to jobs or ppl will just stop playing the weaker jobs to play the stronger ones. Balance is very important even if every job can clear fights.

[Wyakin]

Balance. Doesn’t. Matter. Every job is viable. People whining about job balance (which literally doesn’t matter in everything except week 1 ultimate prog) is how we got to this abysmal state of job design with every job being identical give or take two or three abilities.

You’ve had two people counter you with perfect logic. So here’s a third.

Balance does matter. While people may argue that reaper is the easiest melee and deserves to be bottom etc etc. it doesn’t mean it should be so far behind the rest it gets excluded from groups.

[Vatom]

Wait.. reapers weak?

[Wyakin]

Wait.. reapers weak?

Honestly, it’s not so much that they’re weak. It’s more that every other job has had two or more buffs in recent patches creating a power creep. Leaving reaper in the dust. I honestly believe that SE went over board with the buffs. So now the only alternative is to either nerf (which no one wants) everything else. Or buff reaper.

[Wyssahtyn]

that "we want to bring all the dps up to reaper's level" sure worked out well, didn't it.

[Picker]

I think the job balance is in a really good place right now. Reaper is performing where it should, and hasn’t been left in the dust. Are you looking at high percentile parses and and assuming that’s how dps shakes out in your struggling ex3 pug? Because in that situation an average player on reaper will out-perform most other jobs with average players.

[CKNovel]

Balance. Doesn’t. Matter. Every job is viable. People whining about job balance (which literally doesn’t matter in everything except week 1 ultimate prog) is how we got to this abysmal state of job design with every job being identical give or take two or three abilities.

Before adjusments, in 6.0, DRK could afk a whole minute and still outdps PLD.
Do you think it's funny to play an undertuned job? Why you should put extra effort while other job can bring much more with much less efforts?
If the job feels weak, it feels bad.

Using "Balance doesn't matter, all jobs can clear" can excuse many crappy situations.
Imagine if BLM was below SMN and RDM? But it wouldn't matter since all jobs can clear?
What if all 3 physical ranged were at the top? But it wouldn't matter since all jobs can clear?
What if DRG, MNK, RPR and NIN got access to crazy survival but not SAM? But it wouldn't matter since all jobs can clear?

Currently, MCH is below DNC&BRD or just barely ahead by a pixel, but without the extra support the BRD and DNC can bring. It's not balanced.

Let's name this the "all jobs can clear" fallacy.