What actually happened to white mage?

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Originally Posted by Ironthorne

Why?


Where?


Why?

I don't necessarily agree that making lilies oGCDs would be the correct way to fix WHM, but all of these claims about how OP WHM's GCD heals are are utterly preposterous, and you would know if you play healers at all (or you know, read the skill tooltips).

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Why you gotta throw personal insults? What’s the point of attacking my knowledge of the game? You don’t know me. I play every healer except Astro in high end content. Lily heals are very powerful, they’re the strongest GCD heals in the game when considering the DPS loss of casting any other GCD heal. Yeah misery DPS could be better but it’s still something.

Just because I don’t go with the current meme groupthink doesn’t mean my experience with the game is lacking These forums are more toxic than the WoW general forums

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Originally Posted by Ath192

I feel WHM is the easiest healer to play, and in SHB it was impossible to raid as a WHM because they were literally everywhere. Even now I see a bunch of WHMs in PF... so I do feel the other more complicated healers should be marginally better and they are. Looking around this has barely dented their popularity and if you search for statistics online it does seem any places with info about it support the fact that WHMs are still as popular as ever.

It is likely SE made them ever slightly harder to play and just a bit underpowered to encourage people to use other healers. It's just my guess.

I only have WHM leveled and geared at the moment, and you bet it was because it's the easiest most straight forward healer. Plus the Aesthetics are nice. So viewed through that lens I'm not really upset about it's state because I put a lot less work into playing WHM than any of the other healers do to play somewhat optimally.

TLDR its not great, it's just okay.

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people play WHM in casual content because WHM can just do glare or use Holy to stun the adds. The tools of other healer are all much better than WHM, take P3S for example , people ban WHM in week 1 and 2 cuz astro can just use ONE skill on 8 man living dead , while WHM need to use a lot of skill and still might fail healer check, a lot of people quit WHM on raiding already due to a lot of reason DPS can’t win “good” sage, MP use the most and lack of MP regen , all these crazy gcd heal which is not the current meta for a while, long CD on all WHm’s big skill and didn’t give as big benefits as astro, you can check fflogs as proven document, yes, WHM is easy to start but hard to be expert, other healer do has higher bar , but once u know how to play , it is a piece of cake , not consider current healing system is totally not rewarding at all

Afflatus Solace: 800
Druochole: 600, gives 7% mp per usage.

Afflatus Rapture: 400
Ixochole: 400, gives 7% mp per usage.

Lillies are 30 seconds
Addersgall is 20 seconds

Both Choles arent used a lot since Sage has other powerful tools to do that too before that needs to be used. Starts with 1 usage of Ixochole and 2-3 of Druocholes of a fight. Whm needs to wait 30 seconds.

Wait... the choles aren't even global, i legit forgot. Oops (unironically forgot)

Heals that can be used more are objectively better than a "slightly" bigger heal that can be used less and needs to be stored for exact moments or be wasted.

Whm has the "strongest" gdc, because other healers can basically do the same, bare a bit potency sometimes, offglobal. Of course i can't find comparable GCDS, because other healers just have that on top of comparable GCDs. They dont really lose dps by using the same tools.
Lightspeed+ Neutral sect or neutral sect alone is a beast as comparison.

Also, i was wrong, Ast and whm have the same healing range and same healing potency (asts regen on ahelios is stronger tho), so range isnt the reason why whm eats all of your mp and Ast doesnt.
Medica 2 is 5 yalms further than aspected helios tho.

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Originally Posted by jamjeeshoul77

Why you gotta throw personal insults? What’s the point of attacking my knowledge of the game? You don’t know me. I play every healer except Astro in high end content. Lily heals are very powerful, they’re the strongest GCD heals in the game when considering the DPS loss of casting any other GCD heal. Yeah misery DPS could be better but it’s still something.

Just because I don’t go with the current meme groupthink doesn’t mean my experience with the game is lacking These forums are more toxic than the WoW general forums

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My post sounds somewhat aggressive because I've read too much "WHM is the GCD healer" and it really irritates me. Insult was never my intention, and if that is how my post appears to you then I apologize.

With that out of the way. You can't really say lilies are strong and then say that they're a DPS loss in the same sentence. Other healers don't have "strong" GCD heals equivalent to lilies, because they have oGCDs instead which are completely DPS neutral. That's like claiming you're the king of the trash pile because you're the only one living on it. The lily system also comes with some heavy restrictions:
- No generation out of combat
- No generation while dead
- Lost on death
- No way to generate other than waiting
- Slowest to generate among all healers' resources

Considering WHM is the healer with the least amount of DPS and the least amount of healing as well in the current savage tier by a considerable margin, making lilies oGCDs would, at best, level the playing field.

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Originally Posted by zabu

a lot of people quit WHM on raiding already due to a lot of reason DPS can’t win “good” sage,

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Seems like it's working to me then. Just as intended.

And remove freecure trait

You should not be encouraging Cure 1 spam for goodness sake

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Originally Posted by zabu

WHM is easy to start but hard to be expert, other healer do has higher bar , but once u know how to play , it is a piece of cake , not consider current healing system is totally not rewarding at all

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The problem is, while the WHM can in theory dish out the most healing, but the game is balanced so the weakest healer can still do enough healing, this gives the WHM too much healing options. As a result of that restriction, damage becomes the primary measurement of players, which is obviously the weakest part of the WHM, as all that damage was exchanged for healing power. Healing power that becomes obsolete.
Healing requirements are often that low that oGCD healing is enough in most cases. Again a weak WHM aspect.
This just tells me that there simply is not enough damage going on to get the most out of healers to begin with.

Either the healing requirements need to increase (potentialy disrupting other roles too much), in such way that GCD healing becomes the default for all healer roles. Or damage has to be made consistent enough for all roles. Which due to the WHM's GCD nature is a hard part to adjust (yet a key aspect that defines the WHM playstyle - which you normaly dont want to adjust). I think lilies becoming oGCD is the easiest change they can do, but also the most dull change.

I think the better fix would be to make healers simply become more healing dependant in higher difficulty raids/dungeons. Their damage should at that point become mostly irrelevant (which is needed in order to prevent healers becoming judged by damage output). Healers should be healing, its their name. And that is what currently is simply not going on.

The only reason a healer cant go without damage is because solo quests demand damage.

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Originally Posted by Hyperia

I pray they will take lilies off the gcd, adjust some mana costs and make lily bell a 2 minute cd.

But, knowing our luck, Sage will get a significant buff, SCH and AST will get some nice boosts and WHM will need “more evaluation” with changes possible in 6.2.

P.S. This is dark humor, I know they will do something, just hope it’s significant.

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I read this and was reminded of the old WoW statement "shamans are fine; learn to play".

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Originally Posted by Alestorm

I read this and was reminded of the old WoW statement "shamans are fine; learn to play".

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Or EW is having a Cata/MoP moment when shield healers became nuts and allowing to even ignore some mechanics due to shield superiority.

Gonna be honest, WHM isn't fun to play anymore. And I say that as someone who has found the job fun and engaging enough (as much as healers can be in this game anymore...) despite a fair number of problems it's always had and ones which continue to pile up. I've secondary-mained it since HW.

But it just isn't enjoyable anymore. Hold it up against AST, or even SCH and SGE, and it struggles in all aspects. Death is incredibly punishing for it now unless you have Lucid and Assize available immediately, and in most content before you get Assize, it struggles even worse than it used to at low levels.

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Originally Posted by Ironthorne

With that out of the way. You can't really say lilies are strong and then say that they're a DPS loss in the same sentence. Other healers don't have "strong" GCD heals equivalent to lilies, because they have oGCDs instead which are completely DPS neutral. That's like claiming you're the king of the trash pile because you're the only one living on it. The lily system also comes with some heavy restrictions:
- No generation out of combat
- No generation while dead
- Lost on death
- No way to generate other than waiting
- Slowest to generate among all healers' resources

Considering WHM is the healer with the least amount of DPS and the least amount of healing as well in the current savage tier by a considerable margin, making lilies oGCDs would, at best, level the playing field.

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Honestly the best sum-up of WHM's current state of things, and why so many are dropping it in favor of other healers who do so much more so much better.

Lucy Pyre had a good video talking about it, as well. The memes cover up the sheer levels of disappointment and salt that I think a fair number of competent WHM players have been feeling since EW's changes.