DANCER lowest dps in game? why

My biggest gripe with my personal damage is that the 50% chance to pop X or Y seems to usually behave as a very LOW 50%. Not having those procs, and the times when Espirit seems to go on vacation, really hurts. Slows things down A LOT, too.

Other than that, I think too much personal dps is locked behind standard step... which means ANY sort of delay in executing it is probably going to be a massive overall loss. Given mechanics and such, it is probably easy to let it slip off of cooldown for a few seconds. I wouldn't be sad to see something worked out with all the proc %'s to enable more Espirit and Fan Dances.

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Originally Posted by TraeSnow

I feel the issue with DNC or any utility job for that matter, is not knowing how SE judges what a job's DPS should be.
I'm pretty sure they are going back to the "hard jobs are more rewarding" and that has always been the justification of SMN having utility and also being high DPS. Currently DNC is probably the easiest job in the game by far, so if they are rewarding harder jobs with more DPS, then that calculates into DNC's pDPS.
Of the 3 Ranged Physical Jobs, MCH should be the highest, then Bard, then DNC. Now for how much disparity should be between each, I can't say. There are just too many variables and assumptions.
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You are right if we begin going down the rabbit hole of subjective things like difficulty.

If you exclude tactician and Shield samba as they are the same thing and curing waltz which is more or less a meh utility, then you're left with MCH having only its personal dps and DNC having offensive utility that's only purpose is to add more dps.

So the question becomes if we look at total dps contribution only between the 2 jobs, the disparity is around 900-1k dps "total damage contributions" from both. Is MCH increased difficulty equal to the justification of an extra 10% dps when played by equal players. And even so, does the general population care about that when taking in consideration parties or do they in the end only care about total raid damage. If the later is the case, then the community will see DNC as subpar unless a random party member wants one because he/she wants an orange parse.

I think its fine having a more difficult to play job winning out a bit on the total damage contribution, although for classes to not be excluded that extra gain from difficulty has to be slight and not major.

I would love if flourish, instead of giving us all procs, instead is a buff that makes flourishes and feathers 100% chance for X seconds.

I think it would go a long way into making Dancer feel less RNG sometimes, esp during opener when sometimes you get 0 feathers and are doing nothing during your burst phase.

I’m a PS4 player so I can’t parse (despite DPS numbers being the single most important thing in the game), but I’ve never felt I was dealing too little damage as a Dancer, especially when considering party buffs.
I feel like Fan Dance procs are in a weird situation, because right now it can feel like they never proc, but any higher than 50% and I think our DPS would become too high, especially with Fan Dance 3 procs. I think they should add the effect of giving a fourfold feather upon execution of Standard Finish, that was we have a guaranteed way to generate them outside of using Flourish and hoping for the best, plus Standard Finish should always be used as close to on-cd as possible.

I also think they really need to look at Improvisation. The effect is fine to me, but it feels like there’s never any justification to stop dealing damage just to use it. And having an ability exist solely for use when the boss goes away isn’t great in my opinion (what use is a combat ability that has no use in combat lol).
I think giving a 5% Damage boost to party members within the aoe radius would make it worth using during actual combat, and with the limited range you’d have to be careful with positioning, or possibly a regen effect to tie in with Dancer’s whole ‘healing’ thing it has going on during job quests

"alot of groups dont ask for a dancer for its underwhelming dps"

It's way too early to worry about what groups want. We can currently PUG both extremes.

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Originally Posted by TraeSnow

I'm pretty sure they are going back to the "hard jobs are more rewarding" and that has always been the justification of SMN having utility and also being high DPS. Currently DNC is probably the easiest job in the game by far, so if they are rewarding harder jobs with more DPS,

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yay nin #1 top dps ;)

Personally, I'm ok leaving our personal dps numbers as is and just buffing the support. Currently, technical finish is like a poor man's trick attack. Twice the duration but twice the CD at half the buff. If NIN isn't supposed to be "a support class" and we are the quintessential support class now, wouldn't it make sense that our raid support CD be more powerful than trick? Concurrently, our raid dps contribution is only slightly better than NIN because of devilment. 15% damage buff from technical finish would average out to be 2.5% raid dps contribution (i.e 1500 dps added) add this along with the party member buffs and now we are on par with our total contribution being equal to MCH while still being 1500 or so dps behind them in personal contribution.

They could obviously play with the numbers in different ways.

10% buff 15 sec duration 1.5 min cd and 1.5 min cd on devilment etc.

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

yay nin #1 top dps ;)

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xD I feel NIN and DRG are the conundrums of ShB.

I've been told by several NIN mains, that NIN now rivals SMN as hardest job. I don't play NIN at all, but if that's so, they should deal far more damage. Whereas DRG is simple and straight forward, has more utility than NIN and parses higher.

It's very confusing.

do also remember that trick attack becomes half as effective if we get split bosses whereas dnc doesn't have this issue with technical

Temporary buffs always outperform their base rate, usually by somewhere from 20-50%, for a myriad of reasons (fight not being exactly 2n minutes long, jobs being built to burst at x minute intervals etc).

So Tech Finish is not a 0.83% value, in practice it'll be closer to 1-1.25%. Devilment is a ~2.5% base rate depending on prior state, so more likely you're getting 3-3.5% out of it. All in all, DNC's raid contribution is likely somewhere abouts ~1400, which puts it right in the ballpark of the other two ranged if you weed out their partner-boosted runs.

Mind you, the ranged as a group are some 5% or so behind DRG/MNK, and while they definitely need to be a little behind melee and casters (because if all are equal you'd always take the more mobile job in a fourth slot), 2% or so would be fine. So SE could stand to buff all three ranged a tad, just by a similar tad.