Request: Could Lucid Dreaming's Enmity Drop be Re-implemented?

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Originally Posted by X89K1

I was just thinking, since most DPS do not have access to sustained self healing, it would help their survival if they had an option besides spamming a macro saying they have aggro and hoping the healers/tanks notice.
If it would be too forgiving for them to have that option, okay, valid counter-argument.

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What? There is no way a DPS can pull aggro off a tank if he has his stance on. And as far as self healing for dps, I mean dont get hit by mechanics and the healers are complaining about "over healing people" and "not enough to heal" then they can just heal. I don't know what your asking for here, the game punishes you harder for lack of skill, that's exactly what yoshi p said. That the jobs performce comes from player skill, you lack it and the game punishes you. So what do you want, it to be easier?

With how much Aggro tanks do with their respective skills, the enmity drops are kind of unnecessary... Also as stated by others, Provoke exists.

And if the tank is dying, there's two main causes of that, one is the tank being too undergeared and can't survive tankbusters, the second option is healer being terrible and needs to learn how to heal.

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Originally Posted by Mistyregions

So what you are saying is the the game is more punishing for lack of player skill? The lack of tanking skills, healer MP management and lack of DPS avoidance?

So what your saying is the game punishes you more and you dont like it? Would you like the game to be easier?

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I am saying it is better to have the tools even if they are niche and not used often then to not have them and need them. Situations can and do happen because not everyone is perfect and on the same wavelength. There is a variance in skill levels and sometimes the boss just drops tons aoes that are unavoidable and placed by players. I've seen tanks do everything right and still die because of things outside of their control due to how people scatter trying to get away from other AoE's while converging their own with others.

I prefer to have those skills just stay away. Tanks have not had an issue holding aggro from what I have seen. The issue I have seen/experienced is that healing is a different ball game now. I knew the damage tanks would take was going to increase, I was not prepared for it take more than ogcd's to heal. I like that it takes more than 5 brain cells to heal now, it will just take some time to adjust to the new style of healing for quite a few healers (including myself). Also tanks have to get used to the new damage they are taking and adjust their cd's to match. Also it is day 3 ... everyone just needs to relax and let things play out through this first couple of patches.

Pretty much once a tank has established aggro it's close.to impossible for them to lose it unless they die or they accidentally (or purposely) drop tank stance. It's nice not to have to manage aggro outside of tanking, can focus on other things that require more attention.

Yeah honestly since the ShB changes I can definitely tank in my sleep without risk of losing aggro. I did, however, almost die in Sirensong Sea earlier because the WHM wanted to use Holy when I was doing big but manageable pulls, and my cooldowns can't save me from dying when I have zero healing coming in at all.

Tanks die because they're overconfident, undergeared, or their healer forgot they didn't queue as a DPS. Most of the time though, it's the latter. Aggro isn't the problem.

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Originally Posted by Mistyregions

Step 1, don't have the tank die

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Yeah, that’s generally the idea.

However, a lot of our healing kit has been stripped from earlier levels. Running older content is becoming more problematic than it should be.

For example, running Snowcloak (lvl 50) dungeon with a team of level synced (and well geared) characters. The tank was doing large pulls, and my WHM’s healing kit was not fleshed out enough to handle it.

Why? Because at level 50 we have Cure I, II, III, Medica, Medica II, Regen, Benediction, and that is all. Since they took Largesse away from us, bundled it with Protect and called it Temperance (our level 80 ability), we no longer have anything that boosts our healing power in a pinch.

So even spamming Cure II (which you should never have to do in casual content), the tank still died, followed by the DPS. Thankfully, I was able to Rez sir Gundblade-a-lot and avoid a wipe.

But the point is, that shouldn’t have been a problem in the first place. The pull in question wasn’t even his biggest pull of the dungeon.

Healers have been hamstringed in pre-60 content.

Provoke is there for single targets
however they really should add ultimatum back, when you res a tank in a dungeon there's 0 way to get aggro back on a full pack of mobs fast enough to prevent everyone dying

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Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard

With how much Aggro tanks do with their respective skills, the enmity drops are kind of unnecessary... Also as stated by others, Provoke exists.

And if the tank is dying, there's two main causes of that, one is the tank being too undergeared and can't survive tankbusters, the second option is healer being terrible and needs to learn how to heal.

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Or they're standing in bad/had another player run mechanics onto them that got them cleaved. It's not always as simple as 'it's the healer's or their gear's fault' much as we might all wish it was. Having an option to reduce threat, especially attached to a pre-existing skill that causes no button bloat isn't a tall order for those 'oh shit' moments we all know happen from time to time.

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Originally Posted by Enla

Or they're standing in bad/had another player run mechanics onto them that got them cleaved. It's not always as simple as 'it's the healer's or their gear's fault' much as we might all wish it was. Having an option to reduce threat, especially attached to a pre-existing skill that causes no button bloat isn't a tall order for those 'oh shit' moments we all know happen from time to time.

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Agreed. Mistakes happen. Maybe some in this thread are perfect, so they don't need these kinds of skills. The rest of us are mere mortals and mistakes happen. It they don't want it to be a commonly used skill, attached it to something where there is a trade off for dps, then it will only be used when absolutely necessary.