1.0 dungeon rambling

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-community-now

Biggest thread i could find using limited search query on the forums. There have been countless threads over the years, it looks like you only recently joined, and after hunts mostly died down.

Plus, there were lots of shouts on mateus after 4.0 of "Balmung has ruined this server, Balmung players early pull, Early pullers are the worst"

People used to have macros that would target the person the hunt targeted when pulled, call them out in shout, and basically incite mass harassment to that individual, no matter the reason. Hunts used to be more toxic than pvp, and that takes effort.

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Originally Posted by ispano

Actually if they claim it, it's theirs effectively. Other people are the greedy ones expecting them to wait.

The problem is that people want you to share with half the server, and the system does not support that. Contrary to what people want you to believe, there's a limited amount of people/groups who can get full credit. So waiting can be a problem for those who found or engaged it.

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ispano had things figured out back in 2014. The people who hate hunts have always been the lazy that want rewards for free lol



As others have said, the next Eureka is supposed to have "open dungeons". Best start making popcorn now cause its going to be hilarious.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Now lets take an open world dungeon. It has boss inside. Someone kills it. Now you can't until it respawns. Now there is a large group there.

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BCNMs from FFXI is a concept that would avoid this. The dungeon is open world, but the boss is instanced. I feel this is something SE could do well if they just put some thought into it.

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Originally Posted by MicahZerrshia

ESO does public dungeons extremely well imo. FFXIV could easily look there for inspiration.

And while they are at it, they should take a gander at the housing system because it is just magnificent. Spent half the day just decorating my Grand Psijic Villa they just gave us today, for free.

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ESO has a mega server architecture with sharded virtual servers which restrict the number of players in each zone. This will not work with the FF14 server architecture. I don't want to see the whole population of Odin wailing on a Public Dungeon boss. The lag on special Fates like Foxy Lady, Odin or Ixion is already bad enough.

ESO's housing is way better tho :-)

14 does the shards as well for large overworld maps when they get too crowded, like post expac, so it is doable with the way our servers are set up too.

But for the most part I just like how in a public dungeon you can run through and help each other out with various tasks and downing bosses even without being in a pt, esp since bosses respawn as quickly as normal mobs mostly. And everyone has their own loot outside world chests. I have always had for the most part great experiences in eso when it comes to community, esp compared to ffxiv, so I may be a lil bias since I haven't seen the full extent of the dark side that lurks in every game.

They could also have quest specific bosses that work like leve mobs, they appear in an otherwise empty room, but only the player/party can see and engage them.

What needs to happen is dungeons need multiple layouts, not necessarily multiple routes. The best example I can give is from Rabanastre, though it might give a multi-route feel. But the transition from the 2nd boss to the 3rd, forces the alliance apart, with each party taking a separate path. We need dungeons that when you enter the paths that are "open" are different each time. Enemies are similar, bosses can even be the same, but the feel of the dungeon is different each time. But the goal is always the same so no infighting.

This would actually be really nice! So basically, New Dungeon would have like, A/B/C routes where the objectives and mechanics are all the same, but which one you enter would be seemingly random such that, someone queueing the same place back to back wouldn't always run the same route?

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Originally Posted by reiichi

This would actually be really nice! So basically, New Dungeon would have like, A/B/C routes where the objectives and mechanics are all the same, but which one you enter would be seemingly random such that, someone queueing the same place back to back wouldn't always run the same route?

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Correct, that way you have some variety without causing Meta issues.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

1.0 is dead and it was terrible. Keep it all buried.

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Taking every poorly performing package solely as a package deal doesn't allow for any meaningful analysis or, thereby, improvement. Eureka was, on the whole, lackluster at best. Does that make even its terrain art a problem? No. The parts that were problematic, by interaction or in themselves, were the problems. You can identify the patterns that caused those issues, but until then, anything less circuitous or any less precise is going to be inaccurate and not only useless, but outright harmful to beneficial changes in design concept and iteration.

And in this case, 1.x as a package is absolutely irrelevant to the discussion. We are merely talking about (1) public dungeons, which happened to be useful as leveling, hunting, and/or challenge spaces in 1.x, and (2) dungeons which are not purely linear.

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Originally Posted by Ramesses

Ahhh com'on, it wasn't all that bad. To be fair, 1.0 (Tanaka's build) was absolutely horrible, yes... made me even quit for several months. But from the 1.17 build onwards, the game did begin to show some promise.

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And I personally preferred the pre 1.17 vision, had it just been given the same influx of staff and funding that 1.17 and onward had. Though, I'm not sure I'd sacrifice the current combat philosophy for it.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

But it was still terrible. Just seeing that UI gives me flashbacks. *shudder*

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I mean, back then I could /command shortcut everything, or even just hit my middle mouse button and then blind-scroll to where I knew stuff to be, keeping literally everything within a click and a few sfx ticks. There were no item-drag turn-ins; no need to fish special items from your inventory or click on small quest item indicators.

Honestly, I preferred 1.x's menu over 2.0's original menus. It looked cleaner and, for one who'd already used the 1.x menus a handful of times, more intuitive in its all-in-one fly-out sidebar than the permanently on-screen buttons.

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Now, on topic (@ OP) ....

There's really not much to being a public dungeon than being a distinct area. Mechanics, rare mobs, NMs, or virtually anything else you could think of a given area having might or might not be a part of that. I'd argue that the cyclops area in Anemos is probably just as distinct to most players as, say, Nanawa Mines was back in the day, though less than original Sashtasha, due to its layers of increasing difficulty, treasure clues, patrols, and the like. To all intents and purposes, we're kind of using them already, and anything that would improve upon their design can and should be applied elsewhere as well to some degree; we shouldn't have to keep the all but those areas of the world barebones just to call distinction to those areas that (make best) use (of) the added mechanics or whatnot.

There are tons of possibilities, and I'd gladly join enthusiasts in talking and salivating over those prospects, but it arguably shouldn't feel like a new feature. It should just feel like XIV finally learning to make use of their terrain for something other than mob-grinding, NM-grinding, and FATE-grinding.

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Originally Posted by MicahZerrshia

ESO does public dungeons extremely well imo. FFXIV could easily look there for inspiration.

And while they are at it, they should take a gander at the housing system because it is just magnificent. Spent half the day just decorating my Grand Psijic Villa they just gave us today, for free.

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I'd go for public dungeons with some kind of timer for boss fight pull. As far as housing, Wild Star was the best I have seen. The housing here is just piss poor.