The Samurai buffs are terrible. (Preliminary Patch Notes)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TelosNox

Add that 2% to the 75th percentile of fflogs (sigma savage) and SAM is slightly above BLM. So there is nothing to complain about, he is on paar with the magic counterpart.
Brotherhood raid contribution of MNK at 75th percentile is about 250-300dps. So MNK for Raiddps is slightly ahead but not that much. If you buff SAM futher because of MNKs raidcontribution then you have to buff BLM too.

---

I don't think that I agree with this sentiment. Since 2.0, SE has consistently balanced classes so that the strongest melee DPS jobs do about 5-10% more damage in parsing than their ranged/magic counterparts. This has always been done because melee DPS typically do not have as much uptime on bosses due to many boss mechanics causing melee to have to leave attack range.
Obviously individual encounter DPS balance can vary wildly depending on boss mechanics, but for high uptime fights, SAM and BLM should not be within 1-2% of each other.

Maybe SE is changing their view on this type of balance? Or maybe BLM is just a special case? I don't really know, but I do feel that SAM should easily be the highest DPS class in the game when considering they are melee and offer 0 party support.

And what is the source of that numbers? Pure calculation by potency? Attacking training dummy with perfect rotation for 10 hours? What makes that numbers comparable?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tex_Mex

I don't think that I agree with this sentiment. Since 2.0, SE has consistently balanced classes so that the strongest melee DPS jobs do about 5-10% more damage in parsing than their ranged/magic counterparts. This has always been done because melee DPS typically do not have as much uptime on bosses due to many boss mechanics causing melee to have to leave attack range.

---

This is true if you compare pure dummy dps. But with fflogs I compare parsed dps of real fights, so uptime differences are already included there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TelosNox

And what is the source of that numbers? Pure calculation by potency? Attacking training dummy with perfect rotation for 10 hours? What makes that numbers comparable?

---

Using a pure potency calculation for one higanbana rotation for SAM (about 77 seconds), the theoretical DPS increase is 2.7%. This is calculation was done only factoring in the 10% Jinpu damage buff and the 10% slashing damage debuff from Yukikaze. Over this time period, the optimal Samurai rotation produces 17608.7 potency pre patch and will produce 18101.9 potency post patch.

Additional factors like raid buffs will slightly increase the potency gain as well, but the increase is very minimal and likely would not push the theoretical number over 3%. Also potency theorycrafted numbers are normally considered the maximum possible gain, since they do not account for things like ping rates and assume perfectly optimal button inputs. A 2.1% increase like the OP has shown seems completely legit in my opinion.

All that is beside the point the buffs are way too underwhelming for the disparity between Samurai and Monk. When you look at Samurai's damage it's just that pdps but when you look Monk's it's pdps and rdps and it's not always so clear cut how much rdps Brotherhood is contributing because it also depending on the other players making use of Brotherhood. Also if we use your percentile argument of 75th Samurai has 17166 parses to date and a max score dps of 93.5 Monk has 16357 with a max score of 93.99 which means even though Samurai of the 75th percentile have less representation they still perform less then a Monk without rdps contribution. Samurai has no utility and will just now be bridging the gap in damage difference without Brotherhood's rdps being factored in. The Development team needs to more fairly factor this in and a good start would be to bring Samurai's damage up to that of Blackmages.

the trouble of the meta is right now, pure damage dealer are screwed over by the "utility" bring by some, the dev team is scared that sam get too powerfull if they are supported, that why they try to limitate how much they boost it...

what bother me in this, is the fact that dragoon have +15% damage from his self buff, when the sam have +10% and have one attack at 440 potency when we only reach 420.....damn even drk get a 440 now... *sighs*

SAM are means to be a pure damage dealer, the jobs that will be a pain to handle in a group for the tank, since it will deal insane damage. but in the end... not enough to take more risk as melee class, they barely worth the trouble to be bring in raid and this change are not strong enough for change anything. it's still an increase of damage, but it's far far to be enough.

When I first started playing samurai back in 4.0 in Deltascape I have so much trouble finding a competent tank to hold aggro with diversion and every now and then I will get snap aggro and die, for example V3s if you diversion at the start you will die to white flame because you have to midare and high chance of snapping aggro I died there 60% of the time, and if I save diversion for white flame... I die before white flame because I caught aggro...

its a huge issue for samurai and every time a tank start doing emity combo to hold more aggro that where samurai fall short, if emity is a issue they need to give samurai more option to reduce emity which they did with this new patch and the previous diversion patch

However a really good samurai on 95% perf can only do so much raid dps its laughable compare to a dragoon who is only doing 60% perf and have the same raid dps as a 95% Perf samurai

the bottom line is, if a sam is below some where around 80% perf he is a complete burden

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tex_Mex

I don't think that I agree with this sentiment. Since 2.0, SE has consistently balanced classes so that the strongest melee DPS jobs do about 5-10% more damage in parsing than their ranged/magic counterparts. This has always been done because melee DPS typically do not have as much uptime on bosses due to many boss mechanics causing melee to have to leave attack range.
Obviously individual encounter DPS balance can vary wildly depending on boss mechanics, but for high uptime fights, SAM and BLM should not be within 1-2% of each other.

Maybe SE is changing their view on this type of balance? Or maybe BLM is just a special case? I don't really know, but I do feel that SAM should easily be the highest DPS class in the game when considering they are melee and offer 0 party support.

---

Considering the difficulty blm has in adapting to fights, and how unforgiving a single mistake is for it vs any other dps, it's fair that they get to do more when performed perfectly.

BLM is a turret, moving costs them DPS. It's not the case for SAM, hence why BLM will likely remain where it is in the power ranking.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zerathor

Considering the difficulty blm has in adapting to fights, and how unforgiving a single mistake is for it vs any other dps, it's fair that they get to do more when performed perfectly.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

BLM is a turret, moving costs them DPS. It's not the case for SAM, hence why BLM will likely remain where it is in the power ranking.

---

Not to mention, Black Mage and Samurai are designed to utterly lack utility. It'd make perfect sense for the two of them to be higher DPS than their counterparts, since they make up the gap in utility with sheer damage.