Please do something about Living Dead

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Originally Posted by Eidolon

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IDK why i bother posting anything on this forums, torrents of white knights are the only people i get. WTV Sure it's fine, every DRK is wrong, it's not like i did the whole last tier progression with it nor like i did every single progression in this game before, so WTF do i know of this stuff right?

Calling Holmgang more painful.. i have no words for you

Just go look how often DRKs use Living Dead in all kinds of content vs Wars Holmgang and PLD Hallowed and then tell me how it's fine..

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Originally Posted by Torunya

*Hiss* Hands off my HG! Drk is a dreamboat in aoe utility compared to Pld, at least let us keep what makes us special! ;^;

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I don't want Hallowed/Holmgang nerfed nor do i want DRK to have hallowed i just want the usability of Living Dead to be improved that is all.

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Originally Posted by Pibz

Stop white knighting ffs

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I just almost snorted, how is effectively saying healers need to get good since there's nothing wrong with a tank skill white knighting? I'll just stop replying peace out.

Just make the Dark Knight survive if it received 25%-50% healing of HP total. Problem solved. Everyone is happy.

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Originally Posted by Pibz

IDK why i bother posting anything on this forums, torrents of white knights are the only people i get. WTV Sure it's fine, every DRK is wrong, it's not like i did the whole last tier progression with it nor like i did every single progression in this game before, so WTF do i know of this stuff right?

Calling Holmgang more painful.. i have no words for you

Just go look how often DRKs use Living Dead in all kinds of content vs Wars Holmgang and PLD Hallowed and then tell me how it's fine..

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You're right you have no words - because there's no reasonable alternative. But you know what? Unlike you, I'll back my words up with evidence.

Right now, at i199 Healer and i206 VIT-DRK. My i199 WHM can land a Cure II for 5,000 HP/cast. That's nearly 10 ilevels under the DRK, and my DRK Has 19,000 HP in his VIT-set. Not only that, he is STR spec, so when switched to VIT he will likely be closer to 20k.

That's 4 casts of a WHM cure II, without any use of CD usage, that will top off a DRK. That can be done within the 10 seconds. You have just been, effectively, debunked by my pathetic healer healing someone even higher ilevel.

Also, DRK's use Living Dead just as often as WAR's use Holmgang. It's the same purpose - though WAR's will tend to die from it due to no buffer time (6 sec total duration on Holmgang) or the fact that it'll bind them into an AoE they could never see coming.

Edits: I had put 1,900 hp and it's 19,000 hp, sorry for that. Fixed the numbers.

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Originally Posted by DeeColon

I just almost snorted, how is effectively saying healers need to get good since there's nothing wrong with a tank skill white knighting? I'll just stop replying peace out.

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Well you just said the issue yourself, DRK living dead requires more effort out of healers (a lot more and you just agreed with me since you said healers need to get good) than any of the other skills with very little gains apart from extremely niche situations. And with the VIT changes it just got significantly worse for no reason and no benefit apart from the devs lack of foresight/ignorance.
It's basic design, if there are 2 skills that require significantly less effort for basically the same results, people will just overall prefer to have the easiest/most manageable ones.
Defending this kind of crap i can only assume due to some instinct to defend the game you play is indeed white knighting.

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Originally Posted by Eidolon

Also, DRK's use Living Dead just as often as WAR's use Holmgang. It's the same purpose - though WAR's will tend to die from it due to no buffer time (6 sec total duration on Holmgang) or the fact that it'll bind them into an AoE they could never see coming.

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They don't. The fact that you don't know this says everything

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

Just make the Dark Knight survive if it received 25%-50% healing of HP total. Problem solved. Everyone is happy.

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While reducing the amount would indeed help, in order to make the usability up to par i believe it would also be needed for the buff to not go away once you have healed the intended amount, but i would welcome any positive change such as the one you mentioned.

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Originally Posted by Pibz

They don't. The fact that you don't know this says everything

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Lol

Ravana-EX, on release, one of the primary strategies was to use Living Dead in order ot cheese the mechanic (Tank could solo soak it and get some heals back to full.) You could also use Hallowed ground, but couldn't use Holmgang due to a lack of target during the time to use it. (Oh man did I just refute you with one example? Woops.)


Void Ark - Second Boss, you can use the Living Dead the same way a Warrior uses Holmgang or a Paladin uses Hallowed ground. In the case of both WAR and DRK, it requires coordination with your healrs to let them know it's being used - but they'll top you off quickly.

Hypercompressed Plasma - you can use Living Dead by itself to completely soak this and just be topped off (again) with coordination from your healers.

Get off yourself. You know just as well as I do that the use of Holmg/Living Dead is roughly the same. The only time that Holmgang pulls ahead is in the fact that it can prevent us from being pushed back (thus adding to its utility - but not it's "Oh crap" nature.)

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Originally Posted by Pibz

ROFL, except no one played full vit ...

Stop white knighting ffs

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-plays full vit on several characters, has had no issues- just throwing that out there.

On topic they could possibly adjust it so being healed as the ability goes off won't kill it, i really don't see it as being a horrible ability as its being called, it's a last resort.. last resorts usually happen.. when everything is going wrong, thus it's likely that the healer is paying attention at this point, just tell your party "things go wrong I'll last resort please watch for this if you can." Its cooperation.. its not that difficult.

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Originally Posted by Eidolon

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You're missing the whole point again, probably because you never played DRK much, but there is a big issue and if you dont see it, i don't know why you care if gets corrected for those that do.

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Originally Posted by Pibz

You're missing the whole point again, probably because you never played DRK much, but there is a big issue and if you dont see it, i don't know why you care if gets corrected for those that do.

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Then make me see the point. Post reliable sources. Post proof that there is something wrong with living dead other than "I don't like it."

So far, I've gone through what you said, point by point, and disproven it. I am giving you the benefit of the doubt here and not just calling you a troll and moving on - I am asking you to make a point that stands up to evidence provided.

You're worried that it requires coordination from healers, or requires the use of a CD? So does Holmgang, and holmgang is actually substantially more risky because of the fact that it will hold us in place - again, a major issue when doing large pack pulls with untelegraphed AoE's (However, in contrast, in content where it's heavily scripted, it's easier to use if you've memorized the content.)

You say it has less use compared to Holm and Hallowed, but you've yet to give me a single situation wherein the use of Living Dead isn't on-par with the two. Outside of your healers just completely neglecting and ignoring you, there is no reasson they can not, even in VIT (as I listed my VIT tank in my example) top you off within a reasonable amount of 4 GCD's (2.4 sec/ea is faster than the 10 sec time on living dead.)