Why have the raid if there is no interest in doing it?

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Originally Posted by Elim

Screw DPS checks. Can we have HEALER checks???

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Check out A4S before you wish too hard, no matter what strat you use the brunt is on the healers.

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Originally Posted by Jeykama

Check out A4S before you wish too hard, no matter what strat you use the brunt is on the healers.

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My raid groups causal (scrubs). We haven't downed AS4 yet but AS3 (and 1,2) healing is a joke.

^ A4S, you constantly deal with less than 5k MP in the last phases. Its tough.

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Originally Posted by Brianmj

There is a vested interest in raid groups to "skip phases", correct? And this interest is very strong. It's so strong that if certain jobs do not facilitate skipping phases, they would be shunned. "Why should I invite X job when Z can do it better?" This quote should be familiar to Dragoon and Summoner mains during 2.4.

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PLD can do all kinds of things that the other tanks would struggle with. For example, IIRC it remains the only tank that can do all 3 Quarantines in a row in A4S, can single-handedly deal with 2 fat adds in A3S (Silence+Stun) and absorb damage in A2S like nobody's business. The DPS check in Alex Savage was brutal on PLD but the bigger problem was the fact the fight had so much magical damage that DRK was overwhelmingly favored. If it had just a bit more physical DMG (e.g. if perpetual was Physical) DRK won't be so desirable even though they technically do more damage.

Also the essence of a raid is problem solving.
You take a really really hard problem, you formulate a solution, you execute the solution, you revise effectiveness of solution.

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Originally Posted by CookieMonsta

For example, IIRC it remains the only tank that can do all 3 Quarantines in a row in A4S

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Sorry, but...all three tanks have the tools to do that. DRK probably has the hardest time (since Living Dead is terrible).

I used to have to tank all three when we had *really* slow kill times on the second quarantine, or when we had this one tank as a sub who would not let me switch with him (and occasionally still will if the swap is just bad thanks to lasers). I'm a Warrior, and I'd do all three in Deliverance.



But, yes, PLD is really good in A2S (know several groups who had their DRK switch just for it) and when a PLD is OT they do decent enough DPS (and with everyone being 205+ now, having a PLD is not the reason you're failing DPS checks). The extra stuns are nice in A3S if someone goofs, but if you have a DRG (2 stuns), MNK (AoE silence and 2 stuns) or MCH (stun and silence) you should be able to get them all no problem.

As for the OP...early progression you have to deal with these "bad" parts of the fight. Being able to skip is a sign of better gear (which early on comes from clearing) and/or getting better at the fight.

There are also certain parts that are there just to say "if you see this, your DPS isn't good enough to clear" and you need to take it as a sign that you need to get good.

I can completely agree we need to do away with hard DPS checks or at least ease up on them. I would much rather see we failed due to people not moving out of the difficult pattern of AOE's and such vs cus the Blackmage accidentally fumbled his rotation and we didn't hit the mark before enrage. Speaking of which, honestly just makes me think of this.

http://vgmemes.net/_nw/4/55780874.jpg

Which I honestly never understood in any game, your almost dead and now your throwing all kinds of "what the hells" which would have been acceptable when you were at full strength.

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Originally Posted by Vivi_Bushido

The problem is enrage timers. Honestly what is the purpose of these? Why should it matter how long it takes us to defeat the boss as long as our team manages to survive. It's the enrage timers that cause harsh dps checks. I can't tell you how many tomes I almost beat AS3 but wiped only because we hit enrage. Seriously; I think raiding would be a lot more enjoyable if we removed enrages.

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If there's no enrage timers, what's to stop us from just taking six tanks and two healers to cheese everything else?

With that said, I think the DPS check in the current raid tier is a bit steep and that's being changed in Midas.

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Originally Posted by Vivi_Bushido

The problem is enrage timers. Honestly what is the purpose of these? Why should it matter how long it takes us to defeat the boss as long as our team manages to survive. It's the enrage timers that cause harsh dps checks. I can't tell you how many tomes I almost beat AS3 but wiped only because we hit enrage. Seriously; I think raiding would be a lot more enjoyable if we removed enrages.

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Enrage timers are a bandaid fix to ensure people go into fights with at least 4 dps.

If there was no enrage then people would just go in with 7 scholars and let the faeries cover everything.

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Originally Posted by Elim

My raid groups causal (scrubs). We haven't downed AS4 yet but AS3 (and 1,2) healing is a joke.

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In current gear yes, but if you were progressing in A1 at release the healing was nothing to scoff at.

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Originally Posted by Brianmj

The current meta is don't invite Paladins for Alexander savage.

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The reason for this is:With PLD its a little bit harder to get the DPS to beat it (A3, A4) at all.

For Alex Savage, I don't remember ways to skip phases. The fights are fully scripted. In A1 and A3 everything is on a fixed timer. In A2 the phase changes when you have beaten the current wave. In A4 the phase switches with every leg.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

MCH (stun and silence).

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You mean stun or silence. They share the cooldown timer ;)