Looks like PLDs are clearing A4s.

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Originally Posted by SpookyGhost

I think you're underestimating how much of a coordinated song and dance A4S is. DRK only makes things marginally easier with DA + Dark Mind, it doesn't take away the stress at all. Every mechanic has to be handled near flawlessly to meet the DPS check and allow for the sacrifices in the last phase, on top of the healers having very little mana to work with to rectify any mistakes. PLD certainly isn't optimal in terms of mitigation for this floor, but it's by no means a massive detriment.

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Yeah I can see the kick in the pants healers have to deal with. I won't lie, I don't have the skill to do this even if I was BiS; also yeah, I do underestimate what A4s requires (you can tell as much by what I'm wearing on the lodestone, which makes for a good laugh too!) I can agree only a few things need to be changed for Paladin (I feel like a moron for making a suggestion thread a ways back.) Thankfully though, I'm not being paid to make those changes.

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Originally Posted by Shining_Tiger_Excalibur

Can it be done is the question everyone is asking.....this is proof that it can be.....at a later date (week/s at best and month/s at worst,) with an exponentially larger learning curve and performance demand. I can't help but commend them for beating it even just once and they provide the sort of group dynamic everyone should strive for when raiding. You can tell they care for one another, you can tell they're all nervous, you can tell they don't want to fail each other but they're ready to just keep trying and enjoy living. I just wish it wasn't so stressful for them.

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A4S is extremely stressful and demanding not matter which tanks you bring.

Edit: And to point one thing out, there are A4S clears with WAR/DRK on fflog which had quite a bit less tank dps contribution than this group.

I'm still looking for a DRK + PLD video. If you find one please post it:D

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Originally Posted by Billeffingmurray

I'm still looking for a DRK + PLD video. If you find one please post it:D

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GL with that probably won't find any until the entire group can compensate the lost from not bringing a war and having a PLD

and even then a war has a obligate spot in the raid since they have everything and they all need a war but then everything is balance and the other tank classes aren't "bad" at all... (notice sarcasm)

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Originally Posted by Ercapote

GL with that probably won't find any until the entire group can compensate the lost from not bringing a war and having a PLD

and even then a war has a obligate spot in the raid since they have everything and they all need a war but then everything is balance and the other tank classes aren't "bad" at all... (notice sarcasm)

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I just wonder if any groups have had the stones to give it a real shot since the first few weeks. It becomes more and more possible with each passing week.

I think those videos are a good example of how PLD should be played in Alexander, compared to how people are actually playing them. PLD Sword Oath DPS isn't far off from WAR/DRK OT, and those PLDs are sitting in Sword Oath for a lot of the fight. They're also having the WAR open the fight instead of the PLD, so when it's time to swap the PLD doesn't need Halone for enmity. There isn't going to be much of a difference in DRK/WAR vs PLD/WAR in damage, and the PLD group has access to 2 Halloweds in such a long fight.

Lets push it even harder.... A4S with no War and no Sch.

Looking at the logs it appears that DPS are pretty balanced with a possible issue for MCH. There is clearly a problem with tanks and healers.

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Originally Posted by Billeffingmurray

I just wonder if any groups have had the stones to give it a real shot since the first few weeks. It becomes more and more possible with each passing week.

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highly doubt someone will change a war for a pld...there's no reason for that beside asking for more difficulty...

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Originally Posted by Launched

There isn't going to be much of a difference in DRK/WAR vs PLD/WAR in damage.

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notice how you only mention DRK/WAR or PLD/WAR but no DRK/PLD see where the problem is?

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Originally Posted by Ercapote

notice how you only mention DRK/WAR or PLD/WAR but no DRK/PLD see where the problem is?

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So bring a NIN, it'll only do a tiny bit less DPS than a group with a WAR. MCH/BRD needs a DRG to do max DPS, BLM/SMN needs a BRD. Melee can get extra DPS from a MCH. Plenty of group compositions need specific jobs to do max DPS, it's not just tanks.

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Originally Posted by RocheKat

Lets push it even harder.... A4S with no War and no Sch.

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It'll probably happen just for the novelty, but this is the problem with designing carbon-copy classes.

DRK is just a PLD who specializes in mitigating magical damage.

AST is just a WHM with card buffs.

There are only two slots for tanks and healers, and since DRK/PLD and AST/WHM fill the same niche they end up competing for one of the slots. The more "unique" of the three, WAR and SCH, gain a guaranteed spot due to poor, or rather unimaginative, class design.