[SUGGESTION] LIMIT POINT / MERIT POINT SYSTEM

Perhaps you perceived my initial post as hostile. I would like to say I would love if they added any sort of system to further character advancement especially if it added more diversity and uniqueness. The point of my post was, as far as choices go, it's still too complex. AS I'm assuming there would be a limit to points earned? Or is it strictly a "Earn as many points as you want but the categories are point capped. Also a few abilities seem rather useless or just fluff compared to others but as they're for the most part in separate categories, it can't be too bad. I still it's lacking a certain something, and knowing Squares desire to keep things as simple as possible, you know if it gets implemented Square would make sure that feeling of it lacking somethign would be even worse than it is now. Such is the nature of pandering to the lowest skilled and those with the least desire to inform or improve

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Originally Posted by Daranion

You're all so quick to blame raiders and min maxers when Square themselves have said these type of things would be too complex for their generally low skilled playerbase. It's too confusing and even our classes as they are, with a very set rotation that anyone can read up on and get good at? Too difficult for the average person. You have to keep in mind the lowest common denominators, can't have anything with too many options or numbers. That's the real reason why we don't have TP bars. They found that having a TP bar was jsut an extra set of numbers and caused some of their test base to completely lose focus on what they were doing. You want to add a system of various choices now, choices that would inevitably end up with someones feelings getting hurt when they put everything into all elemental resistances? There's no way, it would never happen unless you babyproof it. Take it back to the drawing board, make it impossible to mess up, and then we'll see it having a chance of being added

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Oh please. Old school 2D Final Fantasy has elemental resistances, weapons that do elemental damage, ... etc. it wasn't rocket surgery back then, it isn't now.

Players handled it just fine. You act like raiders are the only ones that can do simple algebra.

Some kind of alternative advancement system at the level cap is sorely needed, whether that's merit points as in FFXI or something else.

Rift had a nice system for this. Once at the cap your xp would start going towards 'planar attunement' which allowed you to spend XP on increasing stats on a branching grid. Players would start in the centre and could spend XP to move along a given branch. Each branch focused on a specific stat with some unique extra perks later on like +1% crit chance, +1% damage to a specific enemy type, etc. Each point got more and more expensive the further out they got. Eventually it would be possible to earn every point on the board but it would take a very very very long time. The bonuses were also very small so there wasn't a huge disparity between new and old players.

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Originally Posted by Alberel

Some kind of alternative advancement system at the level cap is sorely needed, whether that's merit points as in FFXI or something else

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Alternate advancement system is definitely needed.

Currently all we get is advancement via gear giving a flat power increase.

It's boring because we have no say in the matter, no choices to make in what gear to get, it's get gear or don't get gear.

Also the methods of acquisition ... there are tomes/seals, dungeons, and raids. The latter 2 can bring you into contact with the most toxic players in the game. They don't like "noobs" that didn't read up the equivalent of GameFAQs before entering the dungeon and we don't like their taunts and lecturing.

It's the same thing patch after patch. We are like hamsters on a hamster wheel.

Bishop, I'm not the one saying it would be too complicated. That's all on Square. I'm saying Square keeps things complicated because the fan base in general is pretty... well. they're stupid. At least the most vocal ones. I kid you not, the reason we don't have TP bars? Yeah too confusing because there's too many numbers. The reason the spells aren't called Fira Firaga Firaja in English but they are in Japan? Too confusing for the average player. Everytime we have something added thats simple to the point of being rediculous? BEcause otherwse it'd be too hard for the average player. So the point behind my original comment in the thread? Don't blame raiders for the lock of variety. Blame the average player being too stupid. And thats somewhat straight from Square. I say somewhat because they would never ca;ll their users stupid. That's just me venting my frustration over no TP bars because testers found it too confusing

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Originally Posted by Wobi

The only real issue is over time this will create a rather wide gap between new and older players, it's fairly well thought out and like FFXI I imagine they'd set it to where you cannot cap out everything. I'm not against the idea on principal but there will be consequences, even if unintended.

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If the next expansion would have merit system instead of 10 new levels added to level cap there wouldn't really be any difference from what we have now. Now new people have to get to 60, then they will have to get to merits. Both things mean the same = exp.

Like I said in the last thread on this topic I'll say it again. If you guys want merit/limit points why don't you go to ffxi. Yah I know you guys are gonna say well its old but so is the idea of merit/limit points. Stop trying to bring things from ffxi and start loving the game for how it is. Again please stop trying to turn this game into ffxi this is ffxiv so please just stop.

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Originally Posted by Daranion

Bishop, I'm not the one saying it would be too complicated. That's all on Square. I'm saying Square keeps things complicated because the fan base in general is pretty... well. they're stupid. At least the most vocal ones. I kid you not, the reason we don't have TP bars? Yeah too confusing because there's too many numbers. The reason the spells aren't called Fira Firaga Firaja in English but they are in Japan? Too confusing for the average player.

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The Final Fantasy series has always been "easy".

FFX was easy, you can play thought the whole thing without knowing what heck you are doing and get to the end - first hand experience. ;) Yet, it has depth if you are willing to look.

With FFXIV, there is nothing.

"Too confusing for the average player" ... yet the said average player has to memorize a wiki page of information in order to kill a raid boss. Multiple pages of memorization for the entire raid. Granted you just need a good memory, analytical capability being optional. I really don't see how this is better for the average player as you are just trading "thinking" for "rote memorization" - making it boring at that.

PS: I have no idea what you are going on about with "TP bars" since we do have TP ... not the kind you are looking for?

If you're raiding you're not the average player. And as for TP bars we very much don't have party TP bars for the reason stated. Again, please stop ignoring the point at hand and look at the wider image. Hell, even the forums most likely aren't the representation of the majority fanbase. Fact of the matter is, things have to be simple, and the merit point system as presented in the OP, still has too many numbers and choices. This isn't an argument over it being easy or hard, this is an argument over it being too easy or too hard for the average player. And since the average player, according to Square themselves, gets confused by adding a TP bar next to the MP bar in the party list, the bar is set kind of low dont you think?

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Originally Posted by Bishop81

The Final Fantasy series has always been "easy".

FFX was easy, you can play thought the whole thing without knowing what heck you are doing and get to the end - first hand experience. ;) Yet, it has depth if you are willing to look.

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There's a multitude of reasons you really shouldn't be comparing single-player console games to an MMO.

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"Too confusing for the average player" [...]

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Is exactly what SE has said in response to players asking for more complex systems. And considering some of the things I've witnessed in-game and the various posts that pop up here on the forums, I'm inclined to believe them.

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PS: I have no idea what you are going on about with "TP bars" since we do have TP ... not the kind you are looking for?

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I think he means being able to see the TP bars of your party members. Which is something we're finally getting, sans the numbers.