Batraal Fight All Screwed Up.

A similar discussion popped up recently on the Japanese forum, and so Mocchi brought it up with Matsui to get his feedback on the situation and see what changes are being considered.

• Front line damage dealers
  We will be making adjustments to some of the actions for pugilists, marauders, and lancers which will add a bit more damage. We're currently in the process of performing post-adjustment balance checks.
• Monster AoE attacks
  Many of the most damaging AoE attacks have a specific area that is affected, so by standing to the side or behind an enemy you can avoid the attack. I believe there is still some room for adding a bit more strategy to this, so let us monitor the situation for a bit before we decide how to address it.

With that said, we will be making adjustments to both classes and monsters in regards to these things.

At least they gave every melee class something feasible to throw in FFXIV. But it must be too disgraceful for melees to throw things at the enemies, because I hardly see anyone with that ranged slot filled.

I wouldn't have made this thread if I didn't think about most/all situations. I actually did try ranged attacks on it with chakrams. I did 40ish damage tops with them, my melee attacks hit for 70ish twice for roughly 140 damage. But most importantly I cannot participate in battle regiments. It's basically not fun, and last i checked it's a video game I want to have fun.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

We will be making adjustments to some of the actions for ...., marauders, and lancers which will add a bit more damage.

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I always thought a good swing with a giant axe or stab with lance should do a bit more damage than an arrow :P

Cool, Hopefully my axe will hit like its made out of steel and not foam core.

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Originally Posted by Adam

I wouldn't have made this thread if I didn't think about most/all situations. I actually did try ranged attacks on it with chakrams. I did 40ish damage tops with them, my melee attacks hit for 70ish twice for roughly 140 damage. But most importantly I cannot participate in battle regiments. It's basically not fun, and last i checked it's a video game I want to have fun.

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Ya but I'm pretty sure the point of the RA is to build TP from a safe distance from the mob, when you cap your TP just run in use it ina burst and pull back. As for battle regimens, if they were more stable, not sure how much they have been fixed but they were easier to perform, the tactic of running in with your TP and pulling of some BR would work in an instance in wish you don't want to have a lot of melee on a mob caues of it's AOE attacks.

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Originally Posted by Archadius

In theory this makes perfect sense. In reality it's not so simple. The laws of nature dictate that anything will take the path of least resistance, granted, SE should know this, but consider the following:

We (the playerbase) expect everything to be done right, done quickly, and provide long-lasting enjoyment. There needs to be some give. If SE was to deliver on 2/3 of those, then it would take forever to go through all the testing stages before it finally gets to players, at which point we'd be whining and complaining "it's done, just give it to us, let us test it!!". Unfortunately that's what's happened here. SE did some testing I'm sure, but it will never be enough to work out every possible kink. They have to leave some of it up to player discretion. SE can only have so much foresight. Sure, they could toss more manpower at testing, but it means we'll suffer in another department.

I still feel this is more about the players than SE "delivering a broken mechanic".

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I understand what you're saying and don't get my wrong, I'm not saying there are any broken mechanics, the instance functions pretty well on it's own accord. The problem is, nothing in the instance whatsoever is really geared towards giving ranged classes a hard time. It's not really a question of testing things, or whether or not something is broken, or whether or not there is a kink. The community knew from day one: "Ranged or GTFO."

The problem is the lack of ranged mechanics, not anything broken. For example, both the Ogre fight & Batraal fight have a group of AoE ghosts that spawn around the mini-boss/boss. This mechanic in and of itself shows that SE has the brain power to make a mechanic geared at ranged classes, whereas most of the mechanics (if not, ALL) in this instance hinder strictly melee. This is an issue that I feel, could easily have been foreseen.

Like I said before though, this instance is clearly a testing ground. This is the first solid bit of content we've had from the new team, and although I think it's a great step in the right direction, they need to see, and see it now, that ranged mechanics must be a prominent aspect as well, otherwise we will have what we currently do. Ranged, or GTFO.

Just to reiterate, I do not feel that anything is broken, or that things were not tested properly. I think they had a lot on their plate and that over-shadowed certain things that should be considered prior to the design being implemented. It's a simple matter of adding another mechanic, not changing the system.

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Originally Posted by Naylia

I always thought a good swing with a giant axe or stab with lance should do a bit more damage than an arrow :P

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Technically a lance and arrow would do the same amount of damage as generally both are piercing -- Though an arrow could actually do a bit more damage given trajectory vs polearm.

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Originally Posted by Bayohne

[*]Monster AoE attacks
Many of the most damaging AoE attacks have a specific area that is affected, so by standing to the side or behind an enemy you can avoid the attack. I believe there is still some room for adding a bit more strategy to this, so let us monitor the situation for a bit before we decide how to address it.[/LIST]

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I think everyone has seen class balancing coming (Bayohne, tell SE to figure out what they want to do with MRD in this respect, the classes are coming along nicely but it looks like SE doesn't even know what they really want to do with MRD yet.)

And it's nice to see that there is interest in digging into the mob mechanics currently available, and although I do think positioning is important and tends to get missed by players, there are also a few mechanics that strictly hinder melee DD, and with that said, like in my previous posts, I believe an equally hindering ranged mechanic should be put in place. It doesn't even have to be this instance, just a suggestion for future instance design.

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Originally Posted by Airget

Ya but I'm pretty sure the point of the RA is to build TP from a safe distance from the mob, when you cap your TP just run in use it ina burst and pull back. As for battle regimens, if they were more stable, not sure how much they have been fixed but they were easier to perform, the tactic of running in with your TP and pulling of some BR would work in an instance in wish you don't want to have a lot of melee on a mob caues of it's AOE attacks.

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I did exactly what you just said in the fight I did win as pgl running in and out but even the 5-10 seconds I was in, I nearly died. But the point I'm trying to make is I'd rather "skillfully" dodge aoe attacks and be at melee range because it's MORE fun. When I feel like playing with a stick with a string attached to it I'll level archer. A better solution in my opinion to this can be (examples) A) remove one ghost so there is an empty spot so the "skilled" player can dodge aoe damage B) Not have Batraal murder your tank the second he tries to move them out of ghost AoE. And yes add something to smash Archer's faces while you're at it. I'm going to try something new tonight that just hit me in the head, we'll see if it allows the type of gameplay melee should have. I don't base my ideas of "how melee should play" of my personal opinion all the other mmorpgs seem to be able to do it. And one last thing to consider: when your linkshell goes, you can't come because you don't have archer leveled, have fun with our brand new grind fest sp gaining.