Anyone else think the ilvl requirement for Ultima HM is too low?

Ultima remains the only DF I have never best! every group wipes then disbands.
I honestly wish it wasn't even on DF, beat it lots via PF , and agree the ILvl is too low but even Ilvl 100 won't help if people go in expecting to Faceroll it without dodging

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Originally Posted by alhandra

ultima hm is more about dodging mechanics and coordination than raw numbers. the dps check at the end is quite small and most groups dont even see it he dies so fast.

the real trick is getting everyone to coordinate on the last set of orbs. this is where ive seen most groups fail, even premades. other than that its usually just 1 or 2 people that cant dodge in the earlier phases..

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No, no, no. The entire fight is a dps check. Ultima has an 11 minute or so enrage and yes, it's very easy to hit enrage. If dps is low or dps dies too much, you will not kill it in time.

Item level does NOT equal player skill. Gear can only do so much to help.

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Originally Posted by Orlandeu

It's not a problem of ilvl. You can get a group with full weathered soldiery gear and animus but still fail at it. It's all about dealing with mechanics. Doesn't matter if you have full 110 and a 115 weapon when you can't deal with mechanics.

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If you have a 115 weapon I sincerely hope you can deal with mechanics in Ultima Weapon lmao

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Originally Posted by krazykrusnik

Been trying like hell to pug this in DF(in my monk gear) for a while now and it seems like no group I've been in has come close. After my first run as a whm and looking at the gear for some of the party members, they seemed really undergeared for what i think the fight requires. Anyone else running into this problem or have had similar thoughts?

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No, it's fine people just have to accept that people will die while LEARNING the encounter. A few days ago I went in there as an ilevel 63 monk. It was in the earlier hours of the morning so I went with three people from my free company. It was taking a while so we queued with language other than English. this wasn't the issue, anyway. So my first ever go I died a few times, my fault. I wasn't the only person there was a 7k health scholar who died many more time and struggled with the other healers to heal basic damage - part of the reason I died so often. So second time scholar died, so what I didn't mind. I was low on health and just missed the rush Ifrit did. My second time give me a break, one screw up is good. So in chat some French but what I do notice in it: Blue kitty. Well we all know what that means and when we wipe - not due to me, I'm back in Gridania. Sadly French player's out numbered me and my people from the free company.

Morale of the story, I may have been two ilevels above the recommended and it's was perfectly fine once I did know the mechanics and there were people far more geared than me, really geared, and they failed and those failures killed them. The tuning is fine, people just need to learn to play and not blame the person not over geared for the encounter. L2P is not a gear/encounter issue. Expect wipes while people learn.

The ilvls in this game for pretty much EVERYTHING are set a bit too low, imo. Having a full party of eight go into any instance with an ilvl with gear at that ilvl might make for an interesting challenge for an experienced group. On the other hand, having a full party of eight go into any instance with an ilvl at that ilvl because they're all new and that's the best gear they have... well, they're going to have a rough time. XD

While I don't deny that it may be possible for a fresh group at barely the needed ilvl might be able to complete these instances, I tend to think of the ilvl requirement as more of a "you can bring gear this weak and still be able to contribute something worthwhile to the fight" sort of thing, rather than "as long as everyone in your group has gear this good or better, you're fine".

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Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

No, no, no. The entire fight is a dps check. Ultima has an 11 minute or so enrage and yes, it's very easy to hit enrage. If dps is low or dps dies too much, you will not kill it in time.

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11 minutes is mooooore than enough time to beat ultima even at the base ilvl. once again it falls back to dps being able to dodge. if they can dodge they could meet the dps check, naked most likely

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Originally Posted by alhandra

11 minutes is mooooore than enough time to beat ultima even at the base ilvl. once again it falls back to dps being able to dodge. if they can dodge they could meet the dps check, naked most likely

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Back before it had the echo, I saw many parties wipe because of the enrage. I seldom saw groups that had enough dps/could stay alive to actually kill the damn thing.

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Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

Back before it had the echo, I saw many parties wipe because of the enrage. I seldom saw groups that had enough dps/could stay alive to actually kill the damn thing.

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then that is just bad dps, it has nothing to do with ilvl

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Originally Posted by alhandra

then that is just bad dps, it has nothing to do with ilvl

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Indeed. Gear is what you would call the potential, it presents a ceiling that can only be achieved if the player puts forth the skill and effort to do so. If they don't, they will be under performing. The closer to the minimum ilvl someone is, the more of the gear potential they need to exploit, ie the more skilled they need to be to beat the content. And that's the thing, even people well over geared, don't use that potential, and it shows.