So Summoners! Someone posted this on reddit. Discuss!

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Originally Posted by OmegaNovaios

Yeah, I guess you could open up with Garuda and then swiftcast Ifrit in but you will need to resummon Garuda again on longer fights. But it still better than casting Ruin x3 during your rotation. But as long as Ifrit on obey is stronger than Garuda on obey then it's fine because TBH Garuda on obey is stronger than Garuda on Sic because her actions reduce her DPS since they aren't optimal for single target.

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on most boss fight you dont have to summon another garuda,and its a waste of mana do it 2 times,its just an opening chain with RS,after 3 minutes of RS cd bosses are near to death so is better focus instead contagion,you can set ifrit on full attack after you summon him and gain every bonus he can provide,but there is still the Stun problem to think about

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

You didn't lose Thunder 2 months ago.

Only thing for certain here is you can't now until 2.1 hits and you go out and do some testing to confirm.

Theorycrafting based on tests performed in 2.0 suggest, however, that the loss of Thunder not only diminishes SMN DPS by small chunk, but also significantly diminishes the value and effect of Contagion (the skill that was the primary reason Garuda > Ifrit universally) and gives Ifrit the edge.

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Ifrit straight out parses less than Garuda.

Like I said, we've already been over this 2 months ago.

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Originally Posted by OmegaNovaios

I'm not acting like that, I'm taking it into consideration. Simply put if you can use Contagion from Garuda every cooldown and use Ifrit for the rest then it SHOULD be stronger.

Also, if not switching pets mid-fight and also not fighting more than one mob (because Contagion > Bane is really strong) then Ifrit SHOULD (this means im speculating on how the SMN should work and not how it may or may not actually work) be stronger than Garuda for the same reason that Melee are getting buffed (IE Ifrit is going to die).

To say Ifrit SHOULD never be used is a waste of an action I'd rather push SMN and/or SE if not balanced, rather than have a job with 4 actions instead of 5. Or in this case more than 1 pet to use.

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Can you even read?

This is one of the things SMNs were mad about.

All we got was stuff taken, and none of our issues were addressed.

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Originally Posted by Kevee

No.

Stop talking about this as if the person who posted was right.

He/She isn't.

Don't spread bad information, we already went through this 2 months ago where people thought Ifrit was stronger.

He isn't.

Period.

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I'm not acting like that, I'm taking it into consideration. Simply put if you can use Contagion from Garuda every cooldown and use Ifrit for the rest then it SHOULD be stronger.

Also, if not switching pets mid-fight and also not fighting more than one mob (because Contagion > Bane is really strong) then Ifrit SHOULD (this means I'm speculating on how the SMN should work and not how it may or may not actually work) be stronger than Garuda for the same reason that Melee are getting buffed (IE Ifrit is going to die).

To say Ifrit SHOULD never be used is a waste of an action I'd rather push SMN and/or SE if not balanced, rather than have a job with 4 actions instead of 5. Or in this case more than 1 pet to use.

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Originally Posted by Kevee

Ifrit straight out parses less than Garuda.

Like I said, we've already been over this 2 months ago.

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This topic is about 2.1.

Until there are parses from 2.1, you're 2 month old parses don't apply. They are nice for theorycrafting, but are not evident of anything.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

This topic is about 2.1.

Until there are parses from 2.1, you're 2 month old parses don't apply. They are nice for theorycrafting, but are not evident of anything.

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Yes, what is changing about Ifrit in 2.1? Or Garuda?

Oh, nothing?

Those parses were just straight Obey on the dummy.

Garuda did more.

Garuda has contagion.

Ifrit has nothing.

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Originally Posted by Kevee

Ifrit straight out parses less than Garuda.

Like I said, we've already been over this 2 months ago.

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by my self test,using only pet in full attack mode ifrit is better in <40seconds fights
my test went in this way

mob lvl 38 ,cast garuda at her max range and pressed attack
Same mob, cast ifrit at same range of garuda,pressed attack

i did the same with a lvl 32 mob (for lower hp so shorter fight)

i dont remember right timing,i did it lots of time ago but can give you a qualitative near rappresentation
on lvl 38 mob fight lasts for 43 second for garuda,39 seconds for ifrit
on lvl 32 mob fight lasts for 19 second for garuda,14 seconds for ifrit

obviously as i said before i counted time ifrit need to reach mob at max range of garuda

a little strong point of ifrit in boss fights is for his dmg reflection skill (im in doubt if it is on titan and not on ifrit,lol correct me if im wrong) so MAYBE and i say MAYBE he can have a little more dmg when hitted by aoe

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Originally Posted by xardus

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I also tested this.

Ifrit does more DPS on Sic, rather than Obey, and it puts him even with Garuda.

That doesn't factor in that Ifrit is a MELEE pet, needs DRAGON KICK instead of Foe Requiem, and has nothing like CONTAGION.

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Originally Posted by Kevee

Yes, what is changing about Ifrit in 2.1? Or Garuda?

Oh, nothing?

Those parses were just straight Obey on the dummy.

Garuda did more.

Garuda has contagion.

Ifrit has nothing.

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That sounds like a very accurate parse. Funny how parses suggesting the opposite exist. Oh, the dilemma. Perhaps your Ifrit has bad AI?

I disagree. They didn't change the potency or cast times or anything at all about Ifrit or Garuda. They changed the effective value of Contagion. The *actual* pet DPS between the two has not changed based on ANYTHING in the patch notes. So Ifrit wasn't being used because 1) no contagion, 2) less pet DPS and 3), less survivability in melee. 2.1 changes none of that besides the relative value of contagion, which is still far better in any situation where you can Bane.

Unless you have anything that refutes the above statement, then Kevee is correct.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

That sounds like a very accurate parse. Funny how parses suggesting the opposite exist. Oh, the dilemma. Perhaps your Ifrit has bad AI?

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I'm pretty sure a 2 hour parse of pets(obey) on the dummy is more valid than whatever parse you claim to have.