Provoke = Useless?

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Originally Posted by Jarlax

I was brainstorming about this the other day with my tank friend and thought about, what if we all stack in an 8 man and I use cure III to purposely get agro for him to receive the hate value of a 1000 plus heal x8 with provoke, then I hit shroud and DPS go totally nuts not having to worry about pulling hate the rest of the fight. If one point of healing = 1 point of hate.......that would be kinda OP

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Show me a tank that can't hold aggro off the get-go with all their DPS bursting and I'll show you a tank who isn't using their cool-downs properly. 1/2 enmity is expected not including an off tank, 3/4 and it tends to be a gear issue.

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Originally Posted by Jarlax

I was brainstorming about this the other day with my tank friend and thought about, what if we all stack in an 8 man and I use cure III to purposely get agro for him to receive the hate value of a 1000 plus heal x8 with provoke, then I hit shroud and DPS go totally nuts not having to worry about pulling hate the rest of the fight. If one point of healing = 1 point of hate.......that would be kinda OP

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1 point of healing = 0.5 points of enmity
1 point of damage = 1 point of enmity

Then add modifiers on top of this (shield oath/defiance = x2 enmity points, savage blade = 3x damage enmity points, RoH = 5x damage enmity points, etc.)

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Originally Posted by Xorn

Ok that makes sense considering that is 95% of what I've been doing lately

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That would be the case then : D - all FATE mobs are immune, because you could walk up to a FATE boss, hit provoke when it has 1% health left, and get Gold because the award is based on enmity.

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Originally Posted by Jarlax

I was brainstorming about this the other day...P

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I believe healing is .5 Enmity per health healed. That would produce 4001 enmity points for the tank, in theory. Its a cool idea but kind of useless since it creates a risk, and if the tank gets the first touch on the target, no one should be able to keep up with 150E + 600E + 1080E in the first 3 GCDs. But it would work and it would be fun to mess around with, if you want to do something unique and fun : D

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Originally Posted by Ehayte

That would be the case then : D - all FATE mobs are immune, because you could walk up to a FATE boss, hit provoke when it has 1% health left, and get Gold because the award is based on enmity.

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Incidentally, you can still do this if you are in a Party since it's based on total party hate not necessarily your own. Nothing like showing up to Cancer to Shield Lob once at 1% and get Gold.

There has to be more to the Provoke mechanic than just that. It certainly has worked for me in party, running dungeons. But I've run into a half-done FATE, hit the boss, followed with Provoke and still had green aggro. I've just been shrugging it off because I don't really need it there but I seem to be falling outside the accepted mechanics of it's use.

Provoke is probably one of the most important skills you can have vs pug players.

In FATES, though it has been a long time since I ran them on my PLD, I always got full threat when using provoke on a mob. I did though provoke Odin one day where i came in late and only got yellow. My guess is there is a cap on the amount of threat you can actually gain from provoke.

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Originally Posted by Lyein

There has to be more to the Provoke mechanic than just that. It certainly has worked for me in party, running dungeons. But I've run into a half-done FATE, hit the boss, followed with Provoke and still had green aggro. I've just been shrugging it off because I don't really need it there but I seem to be falling outside the accepted mechanics of it's use.

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FATE mobs are immune to provoke due to issues already mentioned in here, been that way for long time now

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Originally Posted by rocheetbombe

It only works when the mob is targetting somebody else. If somebody pulls it, you use provoke and it gives you one point of threat more than that person so the mob goes to you instead.

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Provoke is useless for this reason.

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Originally Posted by Gooner_iBluAirJGR

Provoke is useless for this reason.

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If the DPS is being an idiot, they'll keep attacking and not let the tank grab hate back. It's not useless it just needs people to co-operate. But then again this is an MMO so "What's Teamwork?"

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Originally Posted by Gooner_iBluAirJGR

Provoke is useless for this reason.

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Because it can be used to get hate back on something? Seems pretty useful to me. It is also absolutely required for Turn 2 Coil, and has a multitude of other uses like getting hate back after dying and raising, etc.