[Petition] Remove Genderlocked Costumes

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Originally Posted by Kohl

This is a logical argument to make.


Do I think gender locked gear is silly? Yes.
Do I want it to end, be changed? Yes.
Do I think that it should be some sort of priority? Not qualified to make that call. So that is a soft no from me. SE's resources are their business.
Do I like this game well enough at present to continue to give them money to play it? Yes.
I never made the argument that it should be a priority of SE. Can't say that I will argue either way on it.

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Never targeted that towards someone specific, especially not you as your arguments are sound. However, I felt the need to point this out as it is a common concern people forget exists from those who opposes this that is not grounded in pure bigotry.

EDIT: To clarify this statement, I am not saying anyone here is by necessity bigoted, but that there are actually valid concerns from the opposing side.

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Originally Posted by FedoraTheExplorer

You are making a problem out of nothing. Your strawmanning brings nothing to the table.

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Gonna need you to elaborate on that champ. If homogenization isn't an issue with SE then you should tell that to the hundreds of posts I see saying that it is.

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Originally Posted by Jasmyne

Gonna need you to elaborate on that champ. If homogenization isn't an issue with SE then you should tell that to the hundreds of posts I see saying that it is.

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This is definitely a problem in terms of job design as not everyone wants to play x, but everyone is forced to play x as you can only play x as class 1 2 and 3 all play like x while class 1 used to play like x, class 2 like y, and class 3 as z. This, however, isn't that kind of homogenization. This is literally a way to add options for people rather than subtracting options. Two entirely opposing things as we are allowing gender 1 to wear outfit a and b, and gender 2 to wear outfit a and b, rather than gender 1 only being allowed to wear outfit a, and gender 2 being only allowed to wear outfit b.

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Originally Posted by Zeonx

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I am saying that dictating how other people should live based ONLY on whether or not it is offensive (read: only that basis, no other), is immature. Party A is not offended because Party B is offensive, Party A is simply choosing to be offended.
If you see a man in a dress in real life, are you offended, should it be illegal?
In an interview with Heather Alexandra ('We Took A Bold Step This Time': Final Fantasy XIV Director Addresses The Game's Sweeping New Changes), Naoki Yoshida stated:
"... first and foremost, I think there should be freedom in your values when it comes to the different genders. We don’t want to restrict attire and clothing that you wear based on characters’ gender or sex.
There’s two issues for accommodating that freedom. The first is a cost issue. Say you had a dress and it’s originally restricted to female-only and we were considering making it so male characters could wear it. We need to go in and make sure we’re adjusting the design on a male character model and make sure it makes sense on that form. The opposite applies for male only outfits, for instance Hien’s attire. we’d need to make adjustments for the female silhouette...We’d need to adjust for lalafells...If we’re making adjustments to one or two items, that’s easy. But we need to consider just how many items there are, and addressing all of them is not a quick task.
In terms of values and our players, it’s a time when there’s a lot of changes in perspectives, but we can’t ignore the people who refuse to make changes in their values. There may be players who do not want to see male players wear attire that’s traditionally worn on females...We do want to respect freedom of self expression and that people want to dress the same way, but we do need to consider and be mindful of those who look at people dressed in a certain way and manage how they perceive things.
[...]
We need to see more change in the values people have, and we need to consider for Final Fantasy XIV how we push forward in-game and how we represent it."
So there are two considerations:
1.) Cost: The amount of work that it would take to change existing gear.
2.) Players: There are players who will take objection to what other people wear.
It is the latter part I have a problem with.
If players object to the developer's thoughts on the mater, maybe they are playing the wrong game?
My personal stake is the Scion Rogue boots/gloves. But it is a bigger topic than my single frustration. It isn't about me. Or the ability to switch the characters sex.
I accept that you may disagree with me, and that we may never find a way to see eye to eye. I would rather not offend anyone, but I will not silence myself, nor ask anyone else to. I appreciate that you are not trying to be/appear "evil", and I assume that your intention is to explore the topic; which I appreciate and value.

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Originally Posted by Jasmyne

Gonna need you to elaborate on that champ. If homogenization isn't an issue with SE then you should tell that to the hundreds of posts I see saying that it is.

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People wanting genderlocking on costumes to go =/= "they're going to homogenise EVERYTHING". The sky isn't falling. Animations and jobs aren't the same thing as glamours.

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Originally Posted by Lunavi

This is definitely a problem in terms of job design as not everyone wants to play x, but everyone is forced to play x as you can only play x as class 1 2 and 3 all play like x while class 1 used to play like x, class 2 like y, and class 3 as z. This, however, isn't that kind of homogenization. This is literally a way to add options for people rather than subtracting options. Two entirely opposing things as we are allowing gender 1 to wear outfit a and b, and gender 2 to wear outfit a and b, rather than gender 1 only being allowed to wear outfit a, and gender 2 being only allowed to wear outfit b.

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But in a way it kind of is. I play a Viera because of its unique animations, emotes, outfits etc. If they release all of of these things that I enjoy about this particular race/gender to all other races and genders, it's literally making us all the same in terms of having all these same exact "options". I don't understand how that's not the definition of homogenization.

I'm saying that certain things should remain unique to races and genders but that's just my personal opinion. What I actually demand from SE is to maintain some level of creative direction. If they make ALL jobs unique, make every dungeon not copy/paste strategies and at least let me keep some individuality with the character I chose to play, I actually don't care if they let cat boys wear dresses. But for now, seeing the direction they're going with every single aspect of this game using homogenization as a strategy for balance, I'm just clinging on to whatever I can that keeps my game play a unique experience.

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Originally Posted by Jasmyne

But in a way it kind of is. I play a Viera because of its unique animations, emotes, outfits etc. If they release all of of these things that I enjoy about this particular race/gender to all other races and genders, it's literally making us all the same in terms of having all these same exact "options". I don't understand how that's not the definition of homogenization.

I'm saying that certain things should remain unique to races and genders but that's just my personal opinion. What I actually demand from SE is to maintain some level of creative direction. If they make ALL jobs unique, make every dungeon not copy/paste strategies and at least let me keep some individuality with the character I chose to play, I actually don't care if they let cat boys wear dresses. But for now, seeing the direction they're going with every single aspect of this game using homogenization as a strategy for balance, I'm just clinging on to whatever I can that keeps my game play a unique experience.

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It's sort of a fallacy: "If everyone has access to the same things they'll all look the same." This is more complicated for class balance: "If there are different skill trees or different specs, players will just find out the 'best' ones and shun the rest" this leads to some classes being insta-kicked off parties, and some jobs not being played because they're deemed "inferior", but for glamours it's quite the opposite: "the more options people have, the less likely they are to choose/look the same."

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Originally Posted by WhiteArchmage

It's sort of a fallacy: "If everyone has access to the same things they'll all look the same." This is more complicated for class balance: "If there are different skill trees or different specs, players will just find out the 'best' ones and shun the rest" this leads to some classes being insta-kicked off parties, and some jobs not being played because they're deemed "inferior", but for glamours it's quite the opposite: "the more options people have, the less likely they are to choose/look the same."

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No race specific items keeps those out of the pool and increases the differences between races. We need MORE race specific stuff not less. Sorry don't buy it.

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Originally Posted by Jasmyne

But in a way it kind of is. I play a Viera because of its unique animations, emotes, outfits etc. If they release all of of these things that I enjoy about this particular race/gender to all other races and genders, it's literally making us all the same in terms of having all these same exact "options". I don't understand how that's not the definition of homogenization.

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It's why i have alts and I enjoy each and every race because of those differences.

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Originally Posted by WhiteArchmage

It's sort of a fallacy: "If everyone has access to the same things they'll all look the same." This is more complicated for class balance: "If there are different skill trees or different specs, players will just find out the 'best' ones and shun the rest" this leads to some classes being insta-kicked off parties, and some jobs not being played because they're deemed "inferior", but for glamours it's quite the opposite: "the more options people have, the less likely they are to choose/look the same."

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And what are the odds that a Male character will look like me now, in my gender/racial specific gear? Zero. It's really not that much of a fallacy.

I think racial animations and outfits should stay within their race, but the gender restriction serves no purpose. Miqote should be able to wear miqote clothes and do miqote things, gender should have no bearing.

There's really no sense behind restricting cosmetics by gender.
If a Female roe can fit into Krile's outfit why can't a male miqote?