Tactful ways to inform people that they're playing badly?

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Originally Posted by Driavna

That's simple: people are doing their best and trying to using the kit offered by their class as their skill level allows it. It does not even have anything to do with how long a dungeon is going to take.

I don't mind have to wipe all the times a player needs to learn a boss as long the person communicate and ask for tips and/or is willing to listen to them. I also don't mind to do smaller pulls is the healer needs them because of any reasonable reason. However, I really mind when a DPS refuses to do AoE, in ShB there are zero reasons for not using it, or a healer spamming Cure/Physic on me when is not needed or standing there doing anything.

Same for tanks refusing to adapt to the needs of the party making the run take longer and/or bad usage of CDs. I think we can also add DPS doing really low damage, my own standard is low/mid-green.

Just out of respect for the other player in your party putting the bare minimum of effort should be the norm. Sadly, is usually not and the excuse is always a variant of "does not matter".

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I was using completion time as diagnosis in my question if something is causing the dungeon run to go 30-45 minutes yes there is some sort of problem that needs to be addressed but like I said that’s been very, very rare in my experience, and not sure what low/mid green means.

While I agree that no one should jump aggressively on others because of their performance, carrying those who somehow got to lvl 80 without a clue of how their classes work should not be a thing.

https://i89.fastpic.ru/big/2019/0918...4650ef8404.png

E4. Summoner was new and was dying to everything, no one else was new or dying. (Not to brag) I was second on dps THE ENTIRE FIGHT.
Not knowing a new fight is fine. But you SHOULD know at least some basics of the class you're playing by the time you get to 80.
How do you tell them they are not doing good? After E4 you can unlock savage already.

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Originally Posted by Rhus

Sounds like you're trying to channel your inner Emet-Selch.

"You are a mistake. For we who have known perfection, this shattered class and these parses are ghastly mockeries of the true player" or something like that.

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i love when people's egos are hurt and they get all up in arms over this statement. its not an edgy statement its literally the truth. i ran 5 duties last night in roulette, if you put a bunch of players in front of me today and told me to pick out my group members ... i would have no idea. that's the point I couldn't tell you Y'dyalani Rhus from XXSephirothXX sixninesixnine to Waifu McAnimeName to Kloud Stryfe to Jayna Proudmore. so why would i take advice from you? for all i know you could be the worst player in your guild the player that no one wants to take, or you could be the type that everyone immediately messages to get in their group/raid.

no one besides your guild/clan or friends know you so i ask again why should i take unsolicited advice from you?

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Originally Posted by SerLuke

I was using completion time as diagnosis in my question if something is causing the dungeon run to go 30-45 minutes yes there is some sort of problem that needs to be addressed but like I said that’s been very, very rare in my experience, and not sure what low/mid green means.

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FFLogs colour code for "ranks".

In any event I have a learning disability if I’m on a job I’m leveling with I have a hard enough time keeping track of/practicing my own rotation rather than looking at what someone else is doing, for this I’m greatful I can’t parse on PS4 I don’t want to nitpick what other people are doing as long as we’re clearing whatever dungeon we are running in a reasonable amount of time I’m fine with it.

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Originally Posted by AleXwern

This is one of the most assbackwards thinking I've ever seen in my life. You literally cannot have an opinion or voice concern if you are not 101% expert.

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its actually not, most people in real life actually do not like unsolicited advice especially from non-experts. they are just nice about it and smile and nod at you maybe saying "oh yeah i'll look into that" which is the nice way of saying "yeah ok whatever you don't know what you are talking about"

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Originally Posted by SerLuke

In any event I have a learning disability if I’m on a job I’m leveling with I have a hard enough time keeping track of/practicing my own rotation rather than looking at what someone else is doing, for this I’m greatful I can’t parse on PS4 I don’t want to nitpick what other people are doing as long as we’re clearing whatever dungeon we are running in a reasonable amount of time I’m fine with it.

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The other Day in Expert Roulette, wall to wall pulls, my AOE DPS was ~26k, while our BLM was at ~7k. Do I know how to play BLM? Nope. But I still know that they were definitely doing something wrong :P Did we get through the dungeon without problems? Yes. Still, someone doing only 20% of what they should be doing does not classify as a "nitpick" ^^

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Originally Posted by RoyalBeef

The other Day in Expert Roulette, wall to wall pulls, my AOE DPS was ~26k, while our BLM was at ~7k. Do I know how to play BLM? Nope. But I still know that they were definitely doing something wrong :P Did we get through the dungeon without problems? Yes. Still, someone doing only 20% of what they should be doing does not classify as a "nitpick" ^^

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Okay I'm genuinely curious how in the world a BLM can have such low dps in expert dungeons ! Even if they weren't AOEing it should be higher... and BLM is so easy, especially when AOEing... oh my gosh x.x This is why I support giving advice in-game even if it isn't "serious content" because that person is likely going to try and go into said "serious content" and I guarantee they won't have a pleasant experience. Nor will the others that are forced into dealing with.... that.

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Originally Posted by MikuMitsuko

Okay I'm genuinely curious how in the world a BLM can have such low dps in expert dungeons ! Even if they weren't AOEing it should be higher... and BLM is so easy, especially when AOEing... oh my gosh x.x This is why I support giving advice in-game even if it isn't "serious content" because that person is likely going to try and go into said "serious content" and I guarantee they won't have a pleasant experience. Nor will the others that are forced into dealing with.... that.

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Yeah, they should be able to obliterate my DPS, even whan half-assing it. Still I have no clue how the class works so I wouldn't be able to give them any advice. We still got throught at an OK'ish pace so I just rolled with it.

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Okay I'm genuinely curious how in the world a BLM can have such low dps in expert dungeons ! Even if they weren't AOEing it should be higher... and BLM is so easy, especially when AOEing... oh my gosh x.x This is why I support giving advice in-game even if it isn't "serious content" because that person is likely going to try and go into said "serious content" and I guarantee they won't have a pleasant experience. Nor will the others that are forced into dealing with.... that.

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BLM has a lot of options when it attacks, many of which cause people to stray into suboptimal rotations. There are a lot of ways for BLM to screw up, and it shows a lot in the DF. "Ice mages" are just one of the ways this can happen; they're just the most egregious form of it.

I wouldn't call it a simple job; it's simple to *you* maybe because you play it. Most other jobs outright highlight the next GCD you should take by making its icon get a glowy outline. BLM doesn't really do that, and the few times it does get a glowy outline (Thundercloud, Firestarter, Foul/Xeno), it still doesn't mean it's an action that should be used right away. In fact, usually it isn't.