Black Mage Sanctuary - A Guide to DPS

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Originally Posted by Kaliska

IS there a tentative BiS list for blm - our blm is at a total loss at what to buy next.

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Cap accuracy > highest ilvl > other stuff

At the same ilvl I prefer spell speed, but secondary stats (and piety) got a huge nerf in HW.

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Originally Posted by Tsujiki

hello
in the 3 possible opener the one with convert flare.
If u get a F3P it could be better to use convert on 2 fire IV with swiftcast.
That could be :
Sharp+F1 > ley+eno F3P > RS+pot > F4 > F4 > F1 > F4 > F4 > F3P > convert+swiftcast > F4 > F4 > B3

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Yeah never really thought about that. Makes sense. I will start utilizing this method.

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Originally Posted by Kaliska

IS there a tentative BiS list for blm - our blm is at a total loss at what to buy next.

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What does you BLM have right now? Weapon is a pretty tasty increase. Body is great, ring is great. Sorta depends on what gear he's currently sitting on and what content you're currently working on.

This is the set I'm shooting for except switch the creme brûlée for Sohm Al Tarts:

http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/RFC1

EDIT: And also apparently sub out the gloves. Not sure what happened there but shooting for Gordian Gloves, not Goetia.

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Originally Posted by Clarkamite

What does you BLM have right now? Weapon is a pretty tasty increase. Body is great, ring is great. Sorta depends on what gear he's currently sitting on and what content you're currently working on.

This is the set I'm shooting for except switch the creme brûlée for Sohm Al Tarts:

http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/RFC1

EDIT: And also apparently sub out the gloves. Not sure what happened there but shooting for Gordian Gloves, not Goetia.

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Thank you to everyone who answered. He has his weapon, body, boots and ring from ESO -- trying to figure out what to get next. We're going to be stepping into A1 savage so once again, thank you for the answers. :)

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Originally Posted by Garotte14

Yeah never really thought about that. Makes sense. I will start utilizing this method.

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I'm actually at more or less 1350 dps with this opener at 194 ilvl on dummy without pot and food.
TC management is harder to master than opener and the ways to optimize the timer of enochien to get at 3min raging and 30s enochien at the same time

Anyone have any tips for A2S?

Only just puling 1000dps and I know I should be hitting up towards 1500. Was trying single target with hardhelm/minds based on advice, but was told in game not to (nicely :0) and to just fire 2 everything and save eno rot for widows and jagd.

I am fine in A1S and an only outdone by mnk so I know I can hit good numbers.

I'm not really enjoying A2S but know if I can output what I am capable of it will be a much nicer fight. Any help is appreciated!

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Originally Posted by Viuiji

Anyone have any tips for A2S?

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What other DPS do you have? Depending on your composition, you can either AoE or you'll have to focus priority targets (e.g. in a BLM-SMN-BRD comp).
Since we have a melee, I usually AoE Wave 2/3/4/5, single target W6, single target W7 with all CDs, AoE W8, AoE the soldiers/snipers in W9 and single target the rest.
Enochian only has 60s cooldown and gives a 5% dmg boost, so I almost use it on CD even when I'm AoEing, exception being shortly before W7 where I need to keep Enochian for the start of the wave.

Static broke up 2 weeks ago due to rl stuff so am jumping into pugs. Typically there is BRD-SMN-BLM-MNK/DRG, although many PF don't want BLM and go for SMN-MNK-DRG-BRD. I enjoy BLM though and want to master it and not just jump into another job just to do A2S.

I have been doing some single target in w2, w3, aoe w4, w5. Never get past w6/7 with the pugs, but I am in practice parties.

Will work on my aoe in it more, it seems that's where I am failing atm.

Thanks for the reply :)

Hey guys, I see you all talking about A2S and A3S but Ii'm still working on A1S.

I did it a total 3 times and of course I'm getting used to it, specially because everytime is with a new team. (still working on finding a learning static).

Last night I started with abysmal dps (790) and as the night progresses it went to a 850 average (with 990 in some attempts). The issue is that I'm not really sure on when to sit down and cast after I get my add.

Is there any hints you could give to a starter BLM?

This is what I was doing at the end of the night:

At first, I just dps with full out rotation and I usually hit 1200~1300. There isnt much to avoid or think of it. My problem started when 0.5 shows up and I have to pick up an add, bring it to the corner, avoid reisin and that huge line AoE and bring it to my laser spot. I tend now to do dps at this time because I fear to be OOM for my add :(
How do you guys handle this? After my add is down, should I pop my CDs and enjoy those free dps time untill jump?

After jump, be conservative till add phase is over?

Thank you!

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Originally Posted by Linkan

Last night I started with abysmal dps (790) and as the night progresses it went to a 850 average (with 990 in some attempts). The issue is that I'm not really sure on when to sit down and cast after I get my add.

Is there any hints you could give to a starter BLM?

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Hi Linkan :)

What I found worked for me is just before ads come out, i hit .5/opp (depending on what strat your group is using) with b3, then hit my ad with b4 (as my eno is usually at about 9 seconds at this stage and gives me movement time), run to side and f3 ad, avoid resin, hope line aoe gods are nice, kill at laser with f1 and f4, move away from laser and finish eno rot. Eno is usually ready to go again and you can let loose. Shouldn't be too much movement unless lasers/line aoe are just crap placement.

Alternatively, if gods are not nice, I just use 2.0 rot on ad and save eno for my focus.

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Originally Posted by Linkan

After my add is down, should I pop my CDs and enjoy those free dps time untill jump?

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After jump, if you time it well, and have some luck, you can still use eno rot all the way through to next jump.

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Originally Posted by Linkan

Is there any hints you could give to a starter BLM?

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Pretty much what Viuiji said. What I like to do is position myself at the start of the fight where close to where I'll be taking my add. So I pretty much stand still from the beginning until the second set of adds spawn. Slight movements are sometimes necessary of course, but for the most part I'm already at or near the wall when my add comes down. I''ll pick up my add and then I pretty much play it by ear depending on what happens. I might smack the add right away with a F4 before resin drops and then dps the boss until after the laser goes out and then finish the add off. All kinds depends on procs and/or if I hit a crit. I don't worry too much about the first set I have to grab cause my enochian will off CD as soon as my add dies. The second set is more tricky cause if you use enichion as soon as boss comes down, it won't be ready when your add dies so you have to maintain it during the add part

So I have 267 piety... and every so often in using the 6 F4 starter, my mp pool will hiccup and I will lose my B3 cast in the middle. I will start it, then it's interrupted.

Anyone know what is happening there?

Thanks,
Benolan

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Originally Posted by Benolan

So I have 267 piety... and every so often in using the 6 F4 starter, my mp pool will hiccup and I will lose my B3 cast in the middle. I will start it, then it's interrupted.

Anyone know what is happening there?

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You don't have enough spellspeed/You're generally not fast enough. Your AF3 runs out and B3 will cost more mana (in AF3, B3 costs 1/4 of the original cost) which you don't have, resulting in you cancelling the cast.

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Originally Posted by Benolan

So I have 267 piety... and every so often in using the 6 F4 starter, my mp pool will hiccup and I will lose my B3 cast in the middle. I will start it, then it's interrupted.

Anyone know what is happening there?

Thanks,
Benolan

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Your Astral Fire 3 dropped off in the middle if your blizzard cast

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Originally Posted by Viuiji

Hi Linkan :)

What I found worked for me is just before ads come out, i hit .5/opp (depending on what strat your group is using) with b3, then hit my ad with b4 (as my eno is usually at about 9 seconds at this stage and gives me movement time), run to side and f3 ad, avoid resin, hope line aoe gods are nice, kill at laser with f1 and f4, move away from laser and finish eno rot. Eno is usually ready to go again and you can let loose. Shouldn't be too much movement unless lasers/line aoe are just crap placement.

Alternatively, if gods are not nice, I just use 2.0 rot on ad and save eno for my focus.



After jump, if you time it well, and have some luck, you can still use eno rot all the way through to next jump.

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Thank you.
I'll jump on another learning party group to actually improve my timing.

Oh yeah! Thank you both... I forgot about the changing mp cost. I was not crazy after all.

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Originally Posted by Tsujiki

hello
in the 3 possible opener the one with convert flare.
If u get a F3P it could be better to use convert on 2 fire IV with swiftcast.
That could be :
Sharp+F1 > ley+eno F3P > RS+pot > F4 > F4 > F1 > F4 > F4 > F3P > convert+swiftcast > F4 > F4 > B3

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Inside a F3 Proc Swiftcast + Flare is actually higher PPS. 2.5 seconds 260 Potency > 3 seconds 280 Potency

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Originally Posted by Aikaal

Inside a F3 Proc Swiftcast + Flare is actually higher PPS. 2.5 seconds 260 Potency > 3 seconds 280 Potency

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Tsujiki is saying to Convert -> Swiftcast F4 instead of Swiftcast Flare -> Convert if you get a F3P proc, since you don't need to refresh AF3 with Flare.

Fire 4 has the same 2.5 recast as Flare under Swiftcast right?

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Originally Posted by Sacerdos

Tsujiki is saying to Convert -> Swiftcast F4 instead of Swiftcast Flare -> Convert if you get a F3P proc, since you don't need to refresh AF3 with Flare.

Fire 4 has the same 2.5 recast as Flare under Swiftcast right?

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Oh yeah, potency wise but isn't it the same as doing a 6 Fire IV rotation? Except you'll have cast 2 Fire 1 instead of one Fire 1 so you'll have less mana. I didn't check it out but I'd fear for MP issues.

im actually lalafell dunefolk dont worry for mana i test many time this opener u get enough mana to have enter use one swift F4 + F4 + B3.
It is the 3rd opener in ur guide ( purple one ) depends on if u get a FS proc on the 2nd F1 and when use convert+swift u remplace flare by F4+F4.

I get some gear from savage tonight and got a 1420 dps on 4min on dummy at ilvl 199 ( without food and pot ).

I m testing something too on my side too maybe i m wrong with this but from this few days i search a ways to get my full eno timer on the refresh of RS and a ways to keep always thunder dot on to maximize TC proc.
But on forum it is pretty hard to explain i will surely create an alt avatar on Ragnarok server to talk with u ( if i renember u understand french that will be easier for me to explain this to u ) if u open to discuss about some blm thing.

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Originally Posted by Aikaal

Oh yeah, potency wise but isn't it the same as doing a 6 Fire IV rotation? Except you'll have cast 2 Fire 1 instead of one Fire 1 so you'll have less mana. I didn't check it out but I'd fear for MP issues.

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I think he meant if you get a F3 proc on your Fire 1 after the first two Fire IVs, you can follow it up with F4x2 > Fire starter Proc > Swiftcast > Fire 4 > Convert > Fire 4 > Blizzard III, which is what I have been doing for a while. Thats of course assuming there are no mechanics targeting you soon and you don't care about using swift there.

I actually tested this out last night and the mana thing is not an issue in your opener to F3P > Convert >Swiftcast > Fire IV > Fire IV in the sharpcast opener. I'm left with 990 MP without the Pie party bonus which is still enough for Blizz 3 > Thunder 1. I actually utilized this method in Alexander as well when I got the proc and its pretty potent.

I have gotten a situation using the F3P > Convert > F4 X 2 where I don't have enough MP for B3. Probably based on MP server ticks.

Edit: seems to be wrong, see below.

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

I have gotten a situation using the F3P > Convert > F4 X 2 where I don't have enough MP for B3. Probably based on MP server ticks.

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Yeah. You can watch the third opener on my video after the Fire 3 you clearly see a none-combat mp tick after the cast. This happens 16% of the time roughly and if your tank pulls at 0 sec of the countdown and not 1 second. That's why I wasn't sure about using an extra Fire IV over Flare. The edge of Flare is you can use it at 1k MP.

In raid with sch u will never got problem with the mana in this opener i have more or less 1k mana after the 6th fire 4 when i got my proc.

I used it on A3S actually and u have one dogde to do in ur opener after ur fire 1 if u are not lucky but i don t have prob with slide cast my 2 fire 4 and use the FS and swift for my mobility.

I'm actually unsure if that was a B3 or a B4 I was unable to do. Did some testing with a friend, Piety buff, the Convert > F4 X 2 always lets you B3 unlike I reported but the B4 after requires an MP tick, in combat or out of combat, doesn't matter. Depending on your Enochian placement (if you don't have to move, and you have Selene, you can actually Enochian pre-pull with a Sharp opener), if you get that can't-B4-due-to-mana situation, you will fail or ride the line really bad with a later Enochian but you had to dodge.

tl;dr - Watch out for 10333 MP if you do that method, as a Midlander. B4 will be delayed and if you had to dodge, and need to go into B4 rather than T1 after B3, you would be better off doing Flare in that situation.

Also I don't know if it's lag or what but I have a terribly hard time doing Swiftcast + Convert without clipping the next GCD, after F3P, with Leylines up. Anyone getting it cleanly, consistently?

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

tl;dr - Watch out for 10333 MP if you do that method, as a Midlander. B4 will be delayed and you might as well do SC Flare.

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Yeah it must've been B4. As I stated a bit ago, on a dummy without pie bonus I was at 990 MP after this opener. Blizz 3 is 245 in AF and thunder 1 is 707 in UI. (I could be remembering those numbers wrong) So that's 952 MP. Like I said that's before pie bonus. In raid, I'm at somewheres over 1k which is plenty to at least cast thunder 1 if you need to wait for a tick, which I do anyways cause there is still time on enochian; even with movement.

As lala dunefolk when i train this cycle i got time to use convert + swift F4 >F4> B3> T1> B4 with eno timer at 10s when i cast B3 i have plenty time to refresh eno with T1 before my B4.
If u have to move during this phase use B4 after B3.

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Originally Posted by Aikaal

Oh yeah, potency wise but isn't it the same as doing a 6 Fire IV rotation? Except you'll have cast 2 Fire 1 instead of one Fire 1 so you'll have less mana. I didn't check it out but I'd fear for MP issues.

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I tried it out and mana doesn't seem to be an issue (no party bonus but I'm a dunes lala). I think it's worth mentioning though that even with 717 ss if you do F3P> Convert+Swiftcast > F4x2 instead of F3P > Swfitcast > Flare > Convert > F4x1, that the last F4 won't benefit from Raging Strikes. I believe this is due to the difference in juggling OGCD's. Or maybe I'm being slow or it's ping?

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Originally Posted by Kiwisnax

I tried it out and mana doesn't seem to be an issue (no party bonus but I'm a dunes lala). I think it's worth mentioning though that even with 717 ss if you do F3P> Convert+Swiftcast > F4x2 instead of F3P > Swfitcast > Flare > Convert > F4x1, that the last F4 won't benefit from Raging Strikes. I believe this is due to the difference in juggling OGCD's. Or maybe I'm being slow or it's ping?

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Then without question if you never wait for B4 or T1 if you get a proc it would be a gain. I'll have to take a look but many people confirmed so it shouldn't be hard to do.

Only thing at this point that worries me is there's some clipping with a double weave after a Firestarter with Selene/Leylines, that's for sure. The question is if it's enough to hurt the potency gain on the F4 vs no clipping Flare.

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Originally Posted by Sleigh

Only thing at this point that worries me is there's some clipping with a double weave after a Firestarter with Selene/Leylines, that's for sure. The question is if it's enough to hurt the potency gain on the F4 vs no clipping Flare.

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Yeah. However, Arrow + L:eylines = sweet 2.18 Fire IV casts :D 1.81 for Fire 1 so GCD was at 1.81

Anyone know the PIE requirement to get B1 always off without mana ticks for the 6xF4 opener? Au Ra Raen and party buff leaves me hanging.

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Originally Posted by Waliel

Anyone know the PIE requirement to get B1 always off without mana ticks for the 6xF4 opener? Au Ra Raen and party buff leaves me hanging.

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Not sure what you're asking. Do you mean Blizzard IV? You shouldn't be using blizzard 1 in your opener. You shouldn't have an issue. You need 264 pie to do that opener which you have with party buff as that race. There is always a chance you'll be waiting for a tick during Blizz 4 unless you Thunder 1 before for the 6xF4 opener.

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Originally Posted by Garotte14

Not sure what you're asking. Do you mean Blizzard IV? You shouldn't be using blizzard 1 in your opener. You shouldn't have an issue. You need 264 pie to do that opener which you have with party buff as that race. There is always a chance you'll be waiting for a tick during Blizz 4 unless you Thunder 1 before for the 6xF4 opener.

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I know all that, and by B1 I mean B1. Unless I get a mana tick after F3, I have to wait up to three seconds to have enough mana to cast B4. Would be nice to get at least B1 off during that, and it's not possible with only party buff for Au Ra.

I have moved the guide to this thread by the way and the updates will be made here for now on. Short story, my schedule became too heavy for the hours required and I've been behind on leveling other jobs, crafts, gathering, alt. Not to mention my sleep schedule was a mess on the week I worked so I stepped down from Solitude and went back to Gilgamesh where I know basically almost everybody <3 I don't know for how much time they'll keep the guide. I won't be able to update it anymore anyways.

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Originally Posted by Aikaal

I have moved the guide to this thread by the way and the updates will be made here for now on.

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Thanks for all the contributions and hard work Aikaal. Much appreciated! :) I hope you continue to give advice and chime in when you can.

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Originally Posted by Waliel

I know all that, and by B1 I mean B1. Unless I get a mana tick after F3, I have to wait up to three seconds to have enough mana to cast B4. Would be nice to get at least B1 off during that, and it's not possible with only party buff for Au Ra.

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I'd really like to help you and answer your question, but I'm afraid I don't understand. Maybe I'm just reading something wrong, and it could totally be me. You are trying to cast Blizzard 4 after Fire 3? First of all blizzard 1 is a dps loss. You shouldn't be using it at all except for very specific circumstances. Such as, you just used a thundercloud proc at the end of your rotation and need to fill time while your MP ticks twice before going back into Astral Fire. And that would only be if there was a single mob, or you'd be better off filling that time with thunder on a second mob. I am also an Au Ra - Raen and I have 263 pie pre party bonus. You are doing something abnormal in your rotation. Once you finish your Fire rotation, you use Blizzard III. After that, if you don't have enough mana to cast Blizzard 4, you can fill that time with Thunder

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Originally Posted by Garotte14

I'd really like to help you and answer your question, but I'm afraid I don't understand. Maybe I'm just reading something wrong, and it could totally be me. You are trying to cast Blizzard 4 after Fire 3? First of all blizzard 1 is a dps loss. You shouldn't be using it at all except for very specific circumstances. Such as, you just used a thundercloud proc at the end of your rotation and need to fill time while your MP ticks twice before going back into Astral Fire. And that would only be if there was a single mob, or you'd be better off filling that time with thunder on a second mob. I am also an Au Ra - Raen and I have 263 pie pre party bonus. You are doing something abnormal in your rotation. Once you finish your Fire rotation, you use Blizzard III. After that, if you don't have enough mana to cast Blizzard 4, you can fill that time with Thunder

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Let's see here... After the opener shenanigans, I hit B3 and I'm left with around 200 mana or whatever, which means I have to wait for a mana tick before I can cast B4. Now if I had enough Piety to always cast B1 while waiting for that long tick, which seems to be the case more often than not, I would be actually doing something instead of just standing around looking stupid for three seconds. I guess I could just do the opener with Flare to solve that problem, but I'd have to spend like five minutes learning it and I'm lazy. Now if it could be solved instead by just putting one stat point into PIE, I'd do just that. You get more variance to your DPS from natural occurences alone than that one point of INT affecting it one way or another.

Just to make sure: I'm not talking about the normal rotation, but strictly about phase just after B3 in the 6xF4 opener. I'm not sure where you got the normal rotation from when the only thing I ever mentioned was the opener.

You need 279 PIE (including party bonus) to use B3 after that opener, which is about 273 base PIE I think.
(Calculated with 8 Mana per 1 PIE which was the last known value to me I think. Just get that item which resets your character points and check how much PIE you actually need.)