1 Materia makes any crafted item better than any NM/Raid/Dungeon item. Why?

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Originally Posted by Aenarion

You guys can go on ahead arguing about the whole materia vs. raid gear for eternity for all I care, I couldn't care less either way, as I actually do both crafting AND raiding.

Yes, what a surprise, I actually participate in different aspects of the game!!!

My one and only gripe is with your "beloved leader" and his claim that half of all crafters are cheating bots, so unless you actually have something to add to that conversation, leave me out of it.



your leader insulted himself with his lack of intelligent posting. Also, way to go with the ad hominem, I'm sure you know just exactly how old I am and my life experiences, or maybe you just pulled that out of the same place your beloved leader pulled out his half-of-all-crafters-bot statement.

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I think Alex was referring to me (even though I'm not the linkshell's leader). Though we are an event "endgame linkshell" and have been since launch our actual leader Deceptistar's first class to 50 was a crafting class. She didn't bot, and we have multiple people with nearly all crafts to 50. We have crafters who have amassed hundreds of millions of gil crafting, we have people who actually enjoy crafting, and we have people who spend the majority of their time outside of events crafting.

I never said any of those things you are accusing me of about Crafters. Ever. Also while I don't personally craft plenty of people in the linkshell including Alex do craft. His gripe is that Random Number Generator (luck), and wealth are as of right now the largest determining factors in getting max slotted materia best-in-slot gear.

Whereas getting the top tier drops from raids requires skill and coordination (and for most crafted+materia slotted gear) as well. I don't think him or anyone from our LS is advocating dropping upper tier crafting in general (most of us have long been supporters of hybrid models that require both crafting and upper tier content drops).

Please don't put words in my mouth. I have never accused anyone of botting, and I have nothing against crafters (as I said), I just think that standard crafting alone (using extremely common materials like raptor skin, or cobalt even) should reward players with ultimately much better gear in every or even just the majority of slots if those players are also willing to invest the time and effort to tackle high end encounters with an entire group (or linkshell) of people.

I don't care either if raids drop best in slot gear, I just want them to reward us with something that will continue to progress our characters, because in any RPG progressing your character is paramount.

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Originally Posted by Frein

I bolded the relevant parts. Who cares about time and luck? They have nothing to do with difficulty. I can get around both time and luck by buying a few dozen billion gil from RMT and buying all that stuff from the wards. That's how hard it is.

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Go ahead and do it then. Make sure you show pics. Post here when you've gotten that epic 3M+ gear that no raid gear can compare to. When you do, I will proceed to tell you how many shells have beaten Hyper Ifrit by then.

alex i would like to point out a couple of things.

you claim ur colbolt red +3 with 6 materia is better than anything you can get on a raid, and in your opinion this is a bad thing. but you also say you hate that fact that when you add multi materia and it fails you lose materia and gear, you claim this a a bad thing aswell. so the thing in place to stop you from attaining this colbolt red +3 6 materia you hate? as much as you hate the gear?

also this macro thing where you can lv to 50 in no time at all. just coz it exists don't mean you have to use it. you claim that ppl should be lv up at a proper rate to enjoy the game. but in the same post you explain how you yourself have found a way to suck all the enjoyment out of the game just to gain a rank 50. i can asure you after reading your post and learning how to do this, does not encourage me to go out and do it. as i tell my children "just coz your mates are taking drugs don't mean you have to copy"

and the last thing, is you say you don't want to take 40 mins explaining to some1 how to play their player. this i find quite funny coz most ppl love the chance to explain what they do. it's an ego thing to have some1 value your opinion. also a MMO is a community based game, where chat is good, and what better to talk about than the game its self. as you have already stated they youngsters should listen to what you have to say.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

Go ahead and do it then. Make sure you show pics. Post here when you've gotten that epic 3M+ gear that no raid gear can compare to. When you do, I will proceed to tell you how many shells have beaten Hyper Ifrit by then.

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I won't but people who have a history of buying money in other MMOs surely will (especially if the game ever becomes good enough that these people actually care enough about it). Just give it some time. Heck, if I had hundreds of millions of gil like many people actually do, I could very quickly produce a set of at least M2 gear that completely mops the floor with all end game gear in the game. Right now, I believe, the issue is that people with augmented materia melders are still quite rare.

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Originally Posted by grandm

you claim ur colbolt red +3 with 6 materia is better than anything you can get on a raid, and in your opinion this is a bad thing. but you also say you hate that fact that when you add multi materia and it fails you lose materia and gear, you claim this a a bad thing aswell. so the thing in place to stop you from attaining this colbolt red +3 6 materia you hate? as much as you hate the gear?

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He hates the fact that obtaining the best gear is essentially a casino. It's completely luck based, losing hurts a ton and you can buy more attempts with money rather than skill.

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also this macro thing where you can lv to 50 in no time at all. just coz it exists don't mean you have to use it. you claim that ppl should be lv up at a proper rate to enjoy the game. but in the same post you explain how you yourself have found a way to suck all the enjoyment out of the game just to gain a rank 50. i can asure you after reading your post and learning how to do this, does not encourage me to go out and do it. as i tell my children "just coz your mates are taking drugs don't mean you have to copy"

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You're mixing two separate things here. When he says people should level at a proper rate he's talking about battle content. There is no fun to suck out of crafting because it's not and has never been fun to him (nor to me). I think the fact that a turbo controller is perfectly capable of it says something about how engaging it is.

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and the last thing, is you say you don't want to take 40 mins explaining to some1 how to play their player. this i find quite funny coz most ppl love the chance to explain what they do. it's an ego thing to have some1 value your opinion. also a MMO is a community based game, where chat is good, and what better to talk about than the game its self. as you have already stated they youngsters should listen to what you have to say.

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No, most people don't enjoy teaching everyone they meet things they should already know.

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Originally Posted by Murugan

I think Alex was referring to me (even though I'm not the linkshell's leader). Though we are an event "endgame linkshell" and have been since launch our actual leader Deceptistar's first class to 50 was a crafting class. She didn't bot, and we have multiple people with nearly all crafts to 50. We have crafters who have amassed hundreds of millions of gil crafting, we have people who actually enjoy crafting, and we have people who spend the majority of their time outside of events crafting.

I never said any of those things you are accusing me of about Crafters. Ever. Also while I don't personally craft plenty of people in the linkshell including Alex do craft. His gripe is that Random Number Generator (luck), and wealth are as of right now the largest determining factors in getting max slotted materia best-in-slot gear.

Whereas getting the top tier drops from raids requires skill and coordination (and for most crafted+materia slotted gear) as well. I don't think him or anyone from our LS is advocating dropping upper tier crafting in general (most of us have long been supporters of hybrid models that require both crafting and upper tier content drops).

Please don't put words in my mouth. I have never accused anyone of botting, and I have nothing against crafters (as I said), I just think that standard crafting alone (using extremely common materials like raptor skin, or cobalt even) should reward players with ultimately much better gear in every or even just the majority of slots if those players are also willing to invest the time and effort to tackle high end encounters with an entire group (or linkshell) of people.

I don't care either if raids drop best in slot gear, I just want them to reward us with something that will continue to progress our characters, because in any RPG progressing your character is paramount.

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Oops, my bad, I just assumed that Frein was the leader he was referring to, as that's who I have been arguing with, and Alex had quoted one of my post to Frein and ended it by saying that the guy he quoted (me) had insulted his leader.

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Originally Posted by grandm

alex i would like to pont out a couple of things.

you claim ur colbolt red +3 with 6 materia is better than anything you can get on a raid, and in your opinion this is a bad thing. but you also say you hate that fact that when you add multi materia and it fails you lose materia and gear, you claim this a a bad thing aswell. so the thing in place to stop you from attaining this colbolt red +3 6 materia you hate? as much as you hate the gear?

also this macro thing where you can lv to 50 in no time at all. just coz it exists don't mean you have to use it. you claim that ppl should be lv up at a proper rate to enjoy the game. but in the same post you explain how you yourself have found a way to suck all the enjoyment out of the game just to gain a rank 50. i can asure you after reading your post and learning how to do this, does not encourage me to go out and do it. as i tell my children "just coz your mates are taking drugs don't mean you have to copy"

and the last thing, is you say you don't want to take 40 mins explaining to some1 how to play their player. this i find quite funny coz most ppl love the chance to explain what they do. it's an ego thing to have some1 value your opinion. also a MMO is a community based game, where chat is good, and what better to talk about than the game its self. as you have already stated they youngsters should listen to what you have to say.

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I would just like to point out that the use of stimulants, including Amphetamines is at an all time high among Ivy League students. That amphetamine use has been openly used and celebrated by the top militaries in the world, and that many of the most well respected authors and scholars of the last century have reported using stimulants of some kind. It's not good for them, but it gives them an edge and so many choose to do it anyways (not that I'm advocating it personally).

Some people strive to be the best, this is America the internet you are not well positioned to tell people how to play, enjoy the game, or succeed.

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Originally Posted by Frein

Here's the new R/EX Sentinel's Cuirass: http://www.ffxivpro.com/item/8030112/sentinels-cuirass

Here's Cobalt Cuirass (Red): http://www.ffxivpro.com/item/8030114/cobalt-cuirass-red

Which do you think is easier to get and which is better? Obviously the Cobalt Cuirass, despite being only a L49 piece, is not only dirt cheap to make, it's also clearly better even without materia.

Then let's look at Darkhold gear:

Here's Solid Scale Mail: http://www.ffxivpro.com/item/8031608/solid-scale-mail

Here's Cobalt Haubergeon (Red): http://www.ffxivpro.com/item/8031723...haubergeon-red

The haubergeon clearly comes ahead in terms of offense, though the extra HP on the mail adds some extra survivability. But what happens when you plop pretty much any materia into the haubergeon? That's right, it becomes clearly superior. Now which do you think is easier to get? The haubergeon made of cheap and common materials or the mail that requires you to beat a dungeon most people still haven't cleared once?

I could do this all day long because there pretty much are no R/EX items worth wearing at 50.

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Cool story, cept u can add materia to sentinel gear, which is why I used sipahi as the example earlier, and old dungeon gear is old, I'm sure if they added new unique untradable armour this update we'd see a balance.

Difficulty? Yeah, making 500 of the best materia in game (4.2M each), 500 catalysts (300-600 hours farming), 500 of the gear you want (and of course, the worth of the gear you want is 500k)

This is the numbers for placing 3 iv materias. Please buy this money from RMT and say it is easy.

2100 Millions for Materia
5000*500 = 250000 for catalysts if buying
500000*500 = 250 Millions if buying gear

in all 2.3525 Billion gil for a gear with 3 iv materia.

You go use 3 million dollars on a game, you be pretty dumb. You CANNOT buy materia if intending to use forbidden materia craft.

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Originally Posted by Murugan

I would just like to point out that the use of stimulants, including Amphetamines is at an all time high among Ivy League students. That amphetamine use has been openly used and celebrated by the top militaries in the world, and that many of the most well respected authors and scholars of the last century have reported using stimulants of some kind. It's not good for them, but it gives them an edge and so many choose to do it anyways (not that I'm advocating it personally).

Some people strive to be the best, this is America the internet you are not well positioned to tell people how to play, enjoy the game, or succeed.

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what is your point? mine is just coz other ppl are doing something don't mean you have to copy. i mean why the hurry to power lvl everything. to get to endgame? what the same endgame that is not really there yet? or are you in such a hurry coz you don't like the fact that your not the first. i don't want this to sound like i'm saying you are this kind of person. but i am talking about ppl that use the auto macros to power lvl craft and get a lvl 50 combat to help power lvl their DoW/DoM. i personally am going to take my time if it takes me forever to get all classes to 50 then i'll have fun rying as my sig says

It will become viable in the future when materia prices inevitably plummet.