Viera and Hrothgar Megathread

Somebody sent me this (I hope this works)

https://i.imgur.com/51bmXOv.jpg

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Originally Posted by LuciaMirain

Somebody sent me this (I hope this works)

https://i.imgur.com/51bmXOv.jpg

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Is that a max or minimum height fem viera?

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

Height range is an easy thing to adjust. The female viera are really tall, even at minimum height, so the male viera, if smaller, would be about the size as a max height miqote male. At minimum height, a fem viera is equal to a max height midlander male. I don’t like this. If they are going this route then adjust the minimum height for female viera too or give the males the same height range as the females.

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I'm a min height viera, my boyfriend plays a max height male miqo. My character is barely taller than his. So unless male viera are the same height as male miqos or shorter, then it's going to be possible for male viera to be taller than some female viera.

They definitely look smaller but I’m gonna guess they land somewhere around highlander height.

While I was surprised, and happy about those that got their male bunnies. I do think this is the second worst possible choice they could have made. Since now they have even further reason to push back Hairstyles for the existing new races.

Personally I think it would have been better to focus those resources on the existing ones.

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

I must not see many max height male miqote. Most the ones I run into are pretty small. I thought the main reason people wanted male viera was to have a tall elegant male option that wasn’t elezen or Au Ra, not to create another version of male miqote. I remember people being upset because many people wanted female viera to be smaller or have a smaller version available. The argument was, these players that wanted smaller viera, should just play miqote because viera are meant to only be tall. After all that to have male viera be miqote size isn’t right or fair to the people who wanted smaller female viera.

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I'm going to hazard a guess that a max height male viera is going to reach middle height of a female viera. So still noticeably shorter than female viera, and noticeably taller than male miqos.

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

If this is true, there are going to be a lot of upset people.

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There's nothing right now indicating they actually are shorter, for all we know they'll have the exact same height range as female Viera.

I also keep seeing posts about them being so much less muscular than female Viera but I don't see that at all, they're both slim.

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

If this is true, there are going to be a lot of upset people.

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Everyone I personally know so far is okay with this possibility.

Are you saying people will be unhappy that they're too tall or too short? I personally would be disappointed if they were within the same height range as male miqo, so if they do turn out at the height I guessed I'll be happy. I would be less so but still disappointed if they turn out to be the same height as female viera or taller. I like the idea of having a race in which the women at max height are noticeably taller than the tallest male counterpart.

As far as I'm aware this is the first time SE have shown male viera in not just this game but the FF series as a whole, so we really don't have a visual point of reference aside from guesses made by looking at the reveal video.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

There's nothing right now indicating they actually are shorter, for all we know they'll have the exact same height range as female Viera.

I also keep seeing posts about them being so much less muscular than female Viera but I don't see that at all, they're both slim.

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They look fit, or athletic, like females. Not strongmen, more like they do cardio. I think they are going to be shorter, but slightly, more like Hyur height I'd guess.

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Originally Posted by Awha

While I was surprised, and happy about those that got their male bunnies. I do think this is the second worst possible choice they could have made. Since now they have even further reason to push back Hairstyles for the existing new races.

Personally I think it would have been better to focus those resources on the existing ones.

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We'll have to wait and see, since they are uncoupled from hrothgar now. Even so, if viera as a race are still getting racial specific styles, even if they do unisex we are probably going to be waiting awhile for them. The hat thing will definitely never change.

I tend to agree, I would have rather had the current iterations more 'fixed' than piling on the problems. We will have to wait and see. I have seen some arguments that it was better to add them early, for less work fitting gear in the future. I always expected they would add them at some point, so that is a valid argument.

They better have been working on fixing the hairstyle problem along side with this new male race... At least give us our exlusive hairstyles we've paid and grinded to get!

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

They look fit, or athletic, like females. Not strongmen, more like they do cardio. I think they are going to be shorter, but slightly, more like Hyur height I'd guess.

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They may well be, I have no preference one way or the other. But the room background looks superimposed vs. him actually being there, so it's hard to judge how short or tall they will be exactly.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

We'll have to wait and see, since they are uncoupled from hrothgar now. Even so, if viera as a race are still getting racial specific styles, even if they do unisex we are probably going to be waiting awhile for them. The hat thing will definitely never change.

I tend to agree, I would have rather had the current iterations more 'fixed' than piling on the problems. We will have to wait and see. I have seen some arguments that it was better to add them early, for less work fitting gear in the future. I always expected they would add them at some point, so that is a valid argument.

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I'm withholding judgement until Fan Fest is actually over, but it'll be massively disappointing if they just hop-skip over it again. Everyone is getting excited for a potential engine upgrade in 7.0 when they might be able to do this stuff easier, but by then it's been 4+ years? For some hair?

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

No, I’m not upset they are short. I’m saying people who wanted smaller female viera were flamed on these forums. They were upset there wasn’t a smaller female version. Viera are tall, go play miqote. Now, if males get to be smaller than the female version, I guarantee people who wanted to be a smaller female version will be mad.

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Let em be mad. The models look great and they don’t look too terribly small. I’ve seen height comparisons to female viera but we don’t know what size model they used in the video...but I’ll guess mid height.

I don’t think, given that Yoship was so focused on expanding choice and wanting to give something different, that he’d make the other kemonomimi a catboy clone.

male viera are coming congra to those who fought for them

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Originally Posted by Yencat

They may well be, I have no preference one way or the other. But the room background looks superimposed vs. him actually being there, so it's hard to judge how short or tall they will be exactly.



I'm withholding judgement until Fan Fest is actually over, but it'll be massively disappointing if they just hop-skip over it again. Everyone is getting excited for a potential engine upgrade in 7.0 when they might be able to do this stuff easier, but by then it's been 4+ years? For some hair?

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We can only assume that the shown males were average (50?) height, but there is no real point of reference. Maybe if someone did something similar to that image someone shared earlier with a female/and male on the bed, and did it over and over again with characters of different heights until they had an even match. Even then we would have to wait until the benchmark, I suppose.

Same, I have my hopes up right now though, since people are saying they said they would have hair.. not that I know where they are getting their information. Yeah, I don't think an engine upgrade is really necessary for something like hair, considering they have been adding hairs constistently over the course of ShB, but it would supposedly make the implementation of new races easier, or future gear fitting, so maybe resources freed for hair... Though, now that they have added the equivalent of another full race this expansion, the resources that could have been used to create hairs prior and during EW are going to be used to fit gear... what a cycle.. 4+ years of waiting would really suck.

What if they do something like, make the male viera hairs usable my females, and vice versa.. "here's your new hairs"? I would cry.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Maybe if someone did something similar to that image someone shared earlier with a female/and male on the bed, and did it over and over again with characters of different heights until they had an even match.

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Yeah, but I don't think he's actually in that room with the bed though, it looks "green screened" behind him rather than the model actually being in the room. So yeah, definitely would need the benchmark before anyone freaks out over this lol

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Same, I have my hopes up right now though, since people are saying they said they would have hair.. not that I know where they are getting their information. Yeah, I don't think an engine upgrade is really necessary for something like hair, considering they have been adding hairs constistently over the course of ShB, but it would supposedly make the implementation of new races easier, or future gear fitting, so maybe resources freed for hair... Though, now that they have added the equivalent of another full race this expansion, the resources that could have been used to create hairs prior and during EW are going to be used to fit gear... what a cycle.. 4+ years of waiting would really suck.

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I haven't seen that anywhere myself, but I hope that information is right. I'm genuinely happy for people that wanted male Viera (and female Hrothgar, since that's also confirmed) but I just want some more damn hairstyles. Before November as well, please? Is that greedy and entitled? ;)

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

What if they do something like, make the male viera hairs usable my females, and vice versa.. "here's your new hairs"? I would cry.

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I kind of like this one, but otherwise I'm gonna have to say hard pass on just sharing all of them. :(

https://i.imgur.com/l7tkbjO.png

Glad male viera got added -- but they should have been there on launch. Im still not impressed that we have to wait longer for SE to finally finish races they put into the game 2 years ago.

But thats just me.

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

I like the way they look. I have no issues with that. I don’t think female viera look more muscular either. They look athletic. The issue is just going to be the fairness with the height, just because it has already been something players were upset about. I anticipate a huge backlash from it. I am hoping they are just the same height as females so it’s not an issue at all, but they look small.

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Honestly it's impossible to please everyone. Someone will be unhappy.

And personally I'm with the "you have miqos" for the small viera subject. I would be very happy if we got a smaller viera race, but the fact is they wouldn't be filling in a gap. Miqos already fill the "not very tall race with fuzzy ears" gap. I think SE, at least right now, are more interested in filling in gaps than just giving us different flavours of something we already have.

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

No, I’m not upset they are short. I’m saying people who wanted smaller female viera were flamed on these forums. They were upset there wasn’t a smaller female version. Viera are tall, go play miqote. Now, if males get to be smaller than the female version, I guarantee people who wanted to be a smaller female version will be mad.

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Honestly, every decision is bound to make a group unhappy... Let it be job design, aesthetics, etc. They could, however, have had a height difference between Rava and Veena Viera, but they didn't do that for when females were released

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Originally Posted by Y2K21

Glad male viera got added -- but they should have been there on launch. Im still not impressed that we have to wait longer for SE to finally finish races they put into the game 2 years ago.

But thats just me.

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Serves to remember that such was a compromise. It was either one race with two genders, or two races with one gender each. Iirc they went with the most popular pick for both. Time and resources are not infinite.

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Originally Posted by Lanadra

Time and resources are not infinite.

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bUt ThEy'Re A mUlTiMiLlIiOn DoLlAr CoMpAnY!!!!!

I really hope that the minheight option will be within the male miqo'te range.

Actually, I probably wound Fantasia regardless of gender just because the body structure and face looks great. Already used not to use hats because nothing looked good on male Au Ra anyway.

What I don't understand is why Hrothgar are limited to TWO hairstyles when there are Hrothgar NPCs in Bozja with different hairstyles. It's either a hint for what's to come or the biggest kick in the teeth I've ever seen.

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Originally Posted by Seafishie

What I don't understand is why Hrothgar are limited to TWO hairstyles when there are Hrothgar NPCs in Bozja with different hairstyles. It's either a hint for what's to come or the biggest kick in the teeth I've ever seen.

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I just want to know why we can't even switch between the 2 hairstyles of the same face? Does it have something to do with they way they code things?

All the hype around the male race does not fix the problem of hairstyles and hats

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Originally Posted by BunniEclair

Let em be mad. The models look great and they don’t look too terribly small. I’ve seen height comparisons to female viera but we don’t know what size model they used in the video...but I’ll guess mid height.

I don’t think, given that Yoship was so focused on expanding choice and wanting to give something different, that he’d make the other kemonomimi a catboy clone.

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Exactly. And literally every other race in the game has larger males than females (some almost comically so--looking at you Au Ra). Having one race with males smaller than females is a refreshing step away from typical masculine archetypes and just a change of pace in general from what we already have.

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Originally Posted by Misitoo

All the hype around the male race does not fix the problem of hairstyles

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True.

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Originally Posted by Misitoo

and hats

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I don't think they promised a solution there, in fact they explicitly stated you wouldn't get hats before ShB even released. So not sure why you're beating that carcass again.

Now maybe I can play hrothgar without being told to kill myself for "being the reason male viera aren't in the game"

"Hey guys we fixed it!! We added new viera hare!!!"
:D get it! New HARE!!

I am happy for those that wanted male viera and fem hrothgar...but I am still remaining very skeptical about how they plan to fix the current problem which still seems to be ignored. and I feel that since we have been left to wonder for so many years what's been going on if we will have to wait even longer til they release fem hrothmama's. But I will save my bellyaching till fan fest is over and hope they make me eat the words that swarming in my head right now about how i feel priorities are off, and they should have fixed the current issues before adding a whole other half of race.

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Originally Posted by Verius_Nox

Now maybe I can play hrothgar without being told to kill myself for "being the reason male viera aren't in the game"

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Whoever told you that is a disgusting waste of space and Oxygen.

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Originally Posted by Verius_Nox

Now maybe I can play hrothgar without being told to kill myself for "being the reason male viera aren't in the game"

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LUL If true the fact you let that stop you from doing something is far more sad to me personally then what the person said.

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Originally Posted by Verius_Nox

Now maybe I can play hrothgar without being told to kill myself for "being the reason male viera aren't in the game"

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„Server - Balmung“

Well i guess that explains alot.

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Originally Posted by Awha

LUL If true the fact you let that stop you from doing something is far more sad to me personally then what the person said.

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Never said it did. I swap between races often, but thanks for the support.

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Originally Posted by Abaigeal

"Hey guys we fixed it!! We added new viera hare!!!"
:D get it! New HARE!!

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Haha please, noooooo!

"Here's your new, race specific hair... On a male Viera! New Hrothgar faces and manes? Female Hrothgar!"

:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Yencat

Haha please, noooooo!

"Here's your new, race specific hair... On a male Viera! New Hrothgar faces and manes? Female Hrothgar!"

:rolleyes:

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Someone who gets my humor and train of thought! ;)

Think it would be interesting if both female and male Viera can wear all the same hair ... so their release would double the amount of hair for Viera females. If not that they could have at least "some" cross over I'd think.

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

You refer to filling in gaps, but the male viera look like a reskinned male miqote and that isn’t the same thing?

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Personally I don't think they look like reskinned male miqos. I don't think they're worlds apart but my opinion on them is the same as female viera; it looks like viera and miqos could share a common ancestor, but they're definitely not the same.

Their body proportions are not the same, the male viera look leaner and have more length. Lanky, for lack of a better word. That's not a word I would use to describe male miqos. The similarities lie chiefly in the head area.

When I first saw female viera announced I thought they just looked like tall miqos, but when I got to create one myself and got to see one properly in the game I saw how different their facial proportions are. They have similar features like large eyes, upturned noses and heart shaped faces but they only look super similar when seen from the front. When seen from other angles you can see their facial structure in some faces is quite different. In the face for my character her nose and mouth area really don't look like a miqo at all when viewed from any angle that isn't the front. And in my opinion the face I use is the only one that actually looks similar to a miqo.

I suspect I'm going to have a similar experience with male viera - that when I actually get to make one I'll see that while there are similarities to male miqo, they're definitely not just a reskin.

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

It’s becoming more clear they allowed the male viera to be very short to appeal to fans but couldn’t be bothered to allow players who wanted smaller female viera get what they wanted too. I saw a picture of a minimum height fem miqote whose knees are just a little bit below the knees of the male viera in the release video when standing next to the bed. Its upsetting, not because male viera are short but because female viera are denied this option at all.

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In the image below we can see that the height difference from min to max isn't uniform across all races, not even when proportion is taken into account. Fem roe has the largest difference between the shortest and tallest. For all we know the height slider for male viera has more flexibility than miqo. So I wouldn't count on a pair of knees being compared to a height slider we know little about to jump to conclusions.

https://i.imgur.com/bB114BT.jpg

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Originally Posted by Moonsprite

I agree the body shape of the male viera is different than male miqote and what I was trying to convey is that if the male viera are the same height then the argument that the they are filling a gap doesn’t work then. The female miqote and female viera have different bodies too. You can’t say female miqote fill a certain roll and turn around and say viera are taller to fill a gap when literally male miqote and male viera comparison is the same. I absolutely think based on the pictures posted in the male viera thread it more than proves they are about midlander male height if not smaller. I don’t want to wait until a month before the expansion to launch to voice my opinion. I think they should let female viera be a bit smaller too. I could care less if male viera want to be tiny. I just don’t like the option being given to the males and denied to the females.

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I'm starting to think your entire problem is short female viera don't exist.

Live letter looking pretty disappointing so far T_T

Well looks like its 5.55 and not 6.0. I guess we have to wait for future letters that deal with the xpac. I was hoping we'd see stuff tonight but doesn't look like it's not going to happen sadly.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Well looks like its 5.55 and not 6.0. I guess we have to wait for future letters that deal with the xpac. I was hoping we'd see stuff tonight but doesn't look like it's not going to happen sadly.

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We got an answer Male Viera and Female Hrothgar are coming....not at all the answer we were looking for but that's the answer we got. Again don't get me wrong, happy we are getting the missing genders to the races!!! still disappointed there is no communication on current situation and it continues to be ignored/glossed over.