An Open Letter to Yoshida-san: Please Slice One Zero Off the Housing Prices

I love it, in a simple sentence the response is:

If prices were cheap enough, someone would be a beast and just buy 100x the land deeds, and then sell those for profit. It's as if they pre-emptively figured out how people would try to gamble what is potentially a new market, and did something about it.

And the world continues to complain.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

While I cannot give a specific date on when personal housing will be implemented, I can say that prices will be completely separate from free company housing, and, naturally, far more affordable.

---

This is exactly what I wanted to hear and very relieving. I think a lot of people were assuming we'd also need 20+ million for basic houses when personal housing arrived. I'm suddenly excited for the future personal housing patch again (although still a little sad that I likely wont get to experience the housing for a few months).

Thank you for responding so directly to the community. I think the major thing people are upset about is that the housing was the most anticipated feature of 2.1 and, whilst the pricing structure -is- in the best interests of long term game health, the inability to experience the fun of fiddling with your house on day 1 of the patch is a similar feeling to being told the patch will be delayed 2 months. This feels like a communication/expectation issue really... if the community was prepared for the pricing structure months in advance and the philosophy that it will take 2-3 months to grind money for an FC's house, the uproar likely would have been a lot less.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KHShadowrunner

I love it, in a simple sentence the response is:

If prices were cheap enough, someone would be a beast and just buy 100x the land deeds, and then sell those for profit. It's as if they pre-emptively figured out how people would try to gamble what is potentially a new market, and did something about it.

And the world continues to complain.

---

fc's can buy more than one house? i also remember reading that u cant sell ur plot if u wanna upgrade. u simply lose it without getting any reimbursement. :3

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sapphidia

I think the major thing people are upset about is that the housing was the most anticipated feature of 2.1 and, whilst the pricing structure -is- in the best interests of long term game health, the inability to experience the fun of fiddling with your house on day 1 of the patch is a similar feeling to being told the patch will be delayed 2 months.

---

NO, it's MUCH worse that that .. this pricing means SE have PLANNED on 20% of FCs not being able to afford it after THREE months, so your analogy is wrong and should be comparing housing to an INDEFINITE DELAY!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KHShadowrunner

If prices were cheap enough, someone would be a beast and just buy 100x the land deeds, and then sell those for profit. It's as if they pre-emptively figured out how people would try to gamble what is potentially a new market, and did something about it.

And the world continues to complain.

---

LOL, are you being deliberately obtuse or what?

SE can simply make the deeds NON-TRADEABLE for a period of months and/or until the house had been upgraded by x%.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Axidrain

fc's can buy more than one house?

---

Probably not. And - more importantly - they most likely also won't be able to sell it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KraggyKor

LOL, are you being deliberately obtuse or what?

SE can simply make the deeds NON-TRADEABLE, your synthetic problem is therefore a non-problem.

---

So tell me, what do you do with the land deed that you buy for 200m when you decide you are done with it? Do you just, toss it away? Count it as lost? My synthetic problem is the problem that the team resolved. I'm sorry that you have issues with that, but it's the reality. If they made them non-tradable, then if a guild master had to leave but they STILL WANT TO KEEP THE HOUSE THEYD HAVE TO SPEND ANOTHER 200M!!!! (since we're using all caps)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KHShadowrunner

So tell me, what do you do with the land deed that you buy for 200m when you decide you are done with it? Do you just, toss it away? Count it as lost? My synthetic problem is the problem that the team resolved. I'm sorry that you have issues with that, but it's the reality. If they made them non-tradable, then if a guild master had to leave but they STILL WANT TO KEEP THE HOUSE THEYD HAVE TO SPEND ANOTHER 200M!!!! (since we're using all caps)

---

yep. thats what they said. u have to take down everything, and u dont get ur money back. and i dont think u can sell ur plot either

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Efrye

Probably not. And - more importantly - they most likely also won't be able to sell it.

---

Pretty sure they stated that yes, Land Deeds are a first-come/first-serve basis. And yes, they are able to trade and sell the deed, so that guild members do not lose everything they own when a master can no longer access the game.

Sorry Yoshida but I think this is still a bullshit thing. It might be ok for a BIG FC Housing(plot whatever) wait 3 months to 1 year, but for a small one? Seriously?
Did you ever consider that some FC doesn't feel to have 666 members inside and they like to stay in a small group? Where you think this FC will gather money? From RMT?
Come one... without consider who transfer server lost gils. This is a total disappointment. You guys checked how many gils players have, how many gils in fc players have and so on, but you didn't consider that players tend to change fc and ls, so this won't HELP at all. Also not every players want share the so hard gained money they have for build a FC...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Black_Pearl

Sorry Yoshida but I think this is still a bullshit thing. It might be ok for a BIG FC Housing(plot whatever) wait 3 months to 1 year, but for a small one? Seriously?
Did you ever consider that some FC doesn't feel to have 666 members inside and they like to stay in a small group? Where you think this FC will gather money? From RMT?
Come one... without consider who transfer server lost gils. This is a total disappointment. You guys checked how many gils players have, how many gils in fc players have and so on, but you didn't consider that players tend to change fc and ls, so this won't HELP at all. Also not every players want share the so hard gained money they have for build a FC...

---

If you are actively changing FC's, why would you ever want to invest in an FC house? Just wait for personal housing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KHShadowrunner

I love it, in a simple sentence the response is:

If prices were cheap enough, someone would be a beast and just buy 100x the land deeds, and then sell those for profit. It's as if they pre-emptively figured out how people would try to gamble what is potentially a new market, and did something about it.

And the world continues to complain.

---

If a free company buying more than one plot was their main concern, why not just limit the plots to one per FC, though? Before someone says "What about large FCs?" if the plot prices weren't so high, a large Free Company could buy a large plot instead of several smaller ones.

Yoshi seems to think that everyone with large amounts gil will want to actually waste that gil on housing for free company, most people who have put in the hard work and countless hours to acquire a large amount of gil will not be so willing to part with it lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SummonerSenah

If a free company buying more than one plot was their main concern, why not just limit the plots to one per FC, though? Before someone says "What about large FCs?" if the plot prices weren't so high, a large Free Company could buy a large plot instead of several smaller ones.

---

I'll give you that one, but exactly how would they restrict it to an FC level? And what happens if multiple FC's ally themselves (and each has a house)? Since FC Alliance is a thing (isn't it? I thought itwas...)

EDIT: to explain - as far as I'm aware items are used to determine if a plot of land is taken, as such the item would need to also be tied to the FC, I still think it's possible.. but I don't have a good example on how it would be happened.

Let's say we have a really large FC (400 members), and 250 of them work really hard to save up for the large plot. Now let's say a wealthy subset of 25 of them think (hah), they want to just buy a small one really quick. We would stop the 250 from buying the big, and locking the FC to a small? So you'd think you'd kick em (I would), since they're no longer in an FC, what happens to the house, does it instantly get nuked?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SummonerSenah

If a free company buying more than one plot was their main concern, why not just limit the plots to one per FC, though? Before someone says "What about large FCs?" if the plot prices weren't so high, a large Free Company could buy a large plot instead of several smaller ones.

---

I have been in enough mmos to see the shenanigans people do to abuse a system,like multi guilds to abuse a mechanic.it always happens.if fc wold be able to buy jst one,im dead certain some people with ton of gil would create multi branches to buy just more.and leveling fc's in this game its stupid easy too

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

Please understand that while we will be adding servers and expanding housing areas as soon as we can, it is simply physically impossible for us to accomplish this easily, in a matter of one or two weeks.

---

You have been working on this for how long now? 3 months at the very least, if not since the end of 1.0. I simply cannot understand that your team fails to properly assess the hardware requirements over a period as long as this. This is just too unbelievable for words!

Word of advice: Next time you know your company isn't ready to release a feature to the player base, just postpone it instead of looking for a ridiculous solution that bars most people from experiencing said content completely while it should be available for everyone.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

Snip[/INDENT]

---

Basically the reply to the outrage is... "We are right and you are mis-informed, so deal with it."

Maybe FC housing could have had other factors versus allowing all the lands to be bought up as an excuse. Maybe make it that only certain size FC's can own certain size plots. i.e.

4-50 - Small Plot
50-99 - Medium Plot
100+ - Large Plot

Make houses only re-sellable/list-able to sale defaulting automatically to 90% of the price paid so they don't become a commodity and really used.

For such a creative team you really picked a ridiculous argument with no basis and poor math and understanding of your communities.

You have divided the community instead of uniting it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KraggyKor

NO, it's MUCH worse that that .. this pricing means SE have PLANNED on 20% of FCs not being able to afford it after THREE months, so your analogy is wrong and should be comparing housing to an INDEFINITE DELAY!

---

Indefinite... you use that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. while you are correct in using the word indefinite, your intent was to use a different word. I can understand how your life experiences may have made you think that the word indefinite meant infinite, however that is not the case. While most things that are postponed indefinitely end up being postponed permanently, the word indefinite means without defined constraints, meaning an unknown period of time.

TL;DR
You are right that the delay is indefinite, but you are wrong in your thought that it would be permanent.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

If the initial price of land was easily within the means of wealthy players, one can envision all available plots of land being snatched up immediately, leaving other players—even those possessing the necessary gil—unable to purchase land for an extended period of time. Seeking to avoid this, we made the difficult decision to go forward with the pricing scheme we presented, aware that many players would be unable to afford housing for a while.

---

So in order to prevent people from being unable to purchase land you made it so that they are unable to purchase land.

BRILLIANT STRATEGY!!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KHShadowrunner

If you are actively changing FC's, why would you ever want to invest in an FC house? Just wait for personal housing.

---

Im the leader of a FC not changing... and I know that ppl tend to move from FC to FC.

Yoshi's strategy for housing. "F' over everyone. Only the elite super large FC's who have no lives so they can spend 60 hours a week grinding in game to make enough to afford a house can have one."

I thought you were better than this Yoshi. I guess I was wrong. Crap like this is how you lose a player base...well this and the abhorrent lack of endgame.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

I understand that, in taking these measures to ensure even distribution of land, we are asking for considerable patience from those players who are eager to enjoy housing right away. While I sympathize with players concerns, we believe that this is in the best long-term interests of the game.

---

I have already waited 3 months to enjoy housing, why are you making us wait longer?

I do not enjoy playing markets to save gil. I do not enjoy trying to save up gil, that is why I haven't even managed to make 250k gil in the whole time I have been playing.

Why are you forcing me to play this game the way that you want me to play it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Black_Pearl

Im the leader of a FC not changing... and I know that ppl tend to move from FC to FC.

---

If you are the leader of an FC, and you can find others who are dedicated to the same principles as you, you can afford the housing. You can do it. It's possible and it's there and it's an achievable goal.

If you're the leader of an FC and sort of just hope people come and go, then wait for personal housing where you'll be able to have your own house, significantly cheaper, and without the fuss of others ruining everything.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Scribe

I have already waited 3 months to enjoy housing, why are you making us wait longer?

I do not enjoy playing markets to save gil. I do not enjoy trying to save up gil, that is why I haven't even managed to make 250k gil in the whole time I have been playing.

Why are you forcing me to play this game the way that you want me to play it?

---

The same reason my 50 miner cannot see twintania and finish the story related to bahamut. I simply can't do it, without the investment to get it done.

You know what also annoys me about your post, Mr. Yoshida?
The fact that even though the forums are on fire about the matter, and that a large part of your player base is angry about it, you still insist that you're right and we should just shut up and deal with it. Because, no matter how long and elaborate your post is, that's what it boils down to.
I have honestly never, not once in my life, seen a company handle a poor decision with such arrogance.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

Our fundamental stance toward housing prices was that we wanted to ensure that plots would be evenly distributed, avoiding a situation in which the wealthiest players could easily buy up all available plots of land. Please understand that while we will be adding servers and expanding housing areas as soon as we can, it is simply physically impossible for us to accomplish this easily, in a matter of one or two weeks.

---

SE has proven to be amazing at doing lockouts, why would there be a concern that the wealthiest of players buying up all available plots of land? This is FC Housing, lock FC's out from buying a second house, only allow each FC to own one house. I don't get how this is an issue, SE, do your thing, implement a lock out!!

ITT: We make personal attacks against the people who are trying dearly to help us. We also will complain about having to work toward a goal and not have instant gratification.

ill try too,
I would really like to have a basement and make an airship, but i do not see how i will be able to if only the largest houses allow it.
Yoshida-sama, there is a scuff mark on your ring and four of your hairs are of inappropriate length!!! Bayone's avatar was cooler in 1.0!!! Minagawa ruined my experience by changing the UI!!! removing pummel from pugilist was only because you had grotty code!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

Please understand that while we will be adding servers and expanding housing areas as soon as we can, it is simply physically impossible for us to accomplish this easily, in a matter of one or two weeks.

---

What I take from this statement is that housing wasn't ready for this update so you artificially priced it out of all but the richest players' grasp. If this is the case I feel I would have had more respect for you were you to hold up your hands and admit you needed more time to deliver a product everyone could enjoy. Right now you have a huge part of the playerbase who feels let down, deceived, or downright lied to.

Legacy players are understandably feeling heartily disappointed. Try to remember, the Legacy servers represent people who stuck with you through all the highs and lows of the initial release through to the greatly improved product we have now. I feel you have seriously failed to reward their faith in you.

I usually like to be wined and dined before I get....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

Excuses

---

That's all they are. This content may as well not exist. Most won't participate.

There is honestly nothing to spend gil on because all the decent gear is purchased off currency you farm from duties so how do people not save their gil? Like what are they spending their gil on these days? If you reuse your old gear from level 1-50, why do you still need to spend your gil? How are you not without gil? Just wondering. I'm guessing food?

Why is FC housing attached to individual wealth in the first place?!?!? Don't we have free company credits? Why on earth is this begin settled in such a ridiculous fashion? Let me tell you Yoshi, you won't have to worry about me or my FC increasing our daily amount of Gil earned to try to get a small FC house for 50+ guys cause guess what, I quit!

This thread: People complaining about instant gratification as usual. No surprise. This community is just the best...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KraggyKor

NO, it's MUCH worse that that .. this pricing means SE have PLANNED on 20% of FCs not being able to afford it after THREE months, so your analogy is wrong and should be comparing housing to an INDEFINITE DELAY!


LOL, are you being deliberately obtuse or what?

SE can simply make the deeds NON-TRADEABLE for a period of months and/or until the house had been upgraded by x%.

---

exactly what i thought...
unless they think that different wealthy FC are getting the plots, which after i took a bit is pry what they r thinking. e.g they have x plots available, they r x number of FC can get them, so they make it that most cant get them. which kind of no make sense bc thise are gonna get them faster anyway... i dunno..

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LoLo

There is honestly nothing to spend gil on because all the decent gear is purchased off currency you farm from duties so how do people not save their gil? Like what are they spending their gil on these days? If you reuse your old gear from level 1-50, why do you still need to spend your gil? How are you not without gil? Just wondering. I'm guessing food?

---

Can't speak for everyone else but repairs and teleports eat up significant chunks of my gil.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Abriael

...As a veteran of 1.0, first on Mysidia, then on Gungnir and now on Balmung, I have only 300,000 gil to my name, and while I don't believe I represent anyone else, I also don't believe that the vast majority of my server's population has that much more than I do. Almost everyone I talked to doesn't, and I talk to many. I'm aware this is not a valid statistic, but it's the best I can come up with readily...

---

This is very confusing to me. It may have to do with server econ scaling but I have been playing the game literally for one week and I have made at least 40-50k gil easily. How can a veteran player only have roughly 6 times as much gil as me?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

Can't speak for everyone else but repairs and teleports eat up significant chunks of my gil.

---

but teleports and repairs are hardly ever that much gil. Like you can easily make that money back. How is 500-5000 gil a day expensive?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Greywizaqrd

That's all they are. This content may as well not exist. Most won't participate.

---

All I see is an excuse from you for not stepping up. Work towards something nice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vipey

This is very confusing to me. It may have to do with server econ scaling but I have been playing the game literally for one week and I have made at least 40-50k gil easily. How can a veteran player only have roughly 6 times as much gil as me?

---

In 2.0, it was relatively easy to make money from 1-49 through questing, but opportunities to make gil dry up somewhat at 50, especially since repair costs start becoming a major expense. With the addition of new sources of money, this should be less of an issue.

forgive me if i do not understand this.. but if the best housing is too expensive, wouldnt that just cause the more richer fc to buy all the medium and small plots even more?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vipey

This is very confusing to me. It may have to do with server econ scaling but I have been playing the game literally for one week and I have made at least 40-50k gil easily. How can a veteran player only have roughly 6 times as much gil as me?

---

Everyone gets ~2ØØ-3ØØK on their way to 5Ø. It slows down after.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Grizzlebeard

Can't speak for everyone else but repairs and teleports eat up significant chunks of my gil.

---

Is it really hard to make that money back? 5000 gil is a lot? I'm truely curious. Because its takes about 15 minutes to make that back in my experience.