whats the point of crafting...

I think the difficulty is fine as it is.

Yes some players can HQ any 80 dura item with NQ mats, but they have spent a lot of time getting the required skills and gears in order to be able to do this.

HQ mats exist to make it easier to HQ something for less geared/skilled players, i.e. they spend more time to make the same final product, giving better geared/skilled crafters a slight advantage.

That said, if they did actually want to make HQ'ing more difficult, all they need to do is nerf Inner Quiet. e.g. reduced it's effect by 50% or something.

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Originally Posted by scarebearz

That said, if they did actually want to make HQ'ing more difficult, all they need to do is nerf Inner Quiet. e.g. reduced it's effect by 50% or something.

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Aye, it depends on what their design goal is overall. Reducing how strong Inner Quiet is would certainly be one method if a change were to be made at all, though it would effect 40 durability crafts as well, which currently feel fine (to me, at least) in terms of effort needed to HQ them.

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Originally Posted by Teykos

I feel you're muddling your point about RNG by talking about how people find an RNG-based crafting system annoying in one breath, and then mentioning how much you preferred crafting when Tricks of the Trade -- which 100% relies on the RNG popping Good -- mattered.

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It's basically perspective and how the RNG feels, but I put the short version in another post.

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Random chance to suck is not all that fun. Random chance to do better than expected though, is a bit more pleasant.

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When I was initially leveling before I had lots of abilities (GSM was my... 6th 50 I think, so no Innovation for quite awhile), I could generally get a 40 Dura mat (stuff like Linen when made at level) to around 80% or so. Guaranteed, no Hasty Touch. If I had a few Good procs, I could do much better and often get it all the way to 100%, but I could always get a pretty decent chance at HQ with the stats/abilities I had at the time even with bad luck. That's what I mean by enjoying when Tricks of the Trade was relevant. The RNG was a bonus (and required me to react to it, so not macro'd), without which I wasn't guaranteed a HQ result if I didn't start with any HQ mats.

The Hasty Touch method (aka, similar to what would happen with a weaker Steady Hand) has a chance to just fail horribly every now and then and there's nothing you can do about it other than find a method that doesn't rely on touches not missing more times in a row than seems reasonable.


Being able to guarantee HQing something with some method is fine (otherwise we basically just have Hasty Touch spam), but doing so without at least some HQ mats has several effects. For one, it incredibly weakens the HQ mat market which hurts Gathering professions and mainly makes them about farming quantity rather than quality or a balance of the two. Avoiding botting (to obtain HQ mats through sheer volume) shouldn't be part of a class design process, but I think we all know SE has room to improve when to comes to their anti-bot measures.

The other major impact of HQ from all NQ is that it shortens the time to create a piece of HQ gear by a ton (making it far easier to flood the market in general). Rather than spending the time to HQ the 4-6 1 star mats before making a standard lvl 70 item someone can just spend 2 steps on each mat quickly completing the progress bar and utterly ignoring quality altogether on every craft but the final one.


Obviously with RPG stat progression there will be a cutoff where someone can HQ a piece of gear without any HQ mats, but it seems that point should come before the most 'difficult' crafts in the game. Another thing to consider is CLN, as sometimes they can't just spend the time to HQ most of the mats used in their final craft. They also aren't doing crafts worth several hundred thousand either, though. Devs also had to make a decision of where to draw the line on someone having a reasonable chance of HQing stuff if they only had one crafting class at 50 (much like they said up through HM Ifrit is balanced without cross class abilities factored in). Lots of factors to consider.

Crafting gives nothing that's needed, or required, there is no point to it, you can make gil faster selling TO crafters than being one yourself.

Crafting is dead, sheep just haven't realized it yet.

Reason to level crafting now:
1/ To get everything to 50 for perfect game purpose
2/ To be self efficient
3/ Because you enjoy it (so far i do)
4/ To be actively working on housing and in the future building the airship
5/ Some crafting AF looks super sexy ;)

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Originally Posted by Laryndra

as was said earlier.. Ilv 70 gear (armor in particular) is incredibly good and much better compared to DL. I have a whole set of this and my monk in parties sits at ~4500hp, 510 accuracy (way over the cap..) 500 Crit, 305 determination, ect ect.. Darklight doesnt come close. I even got my first drop from coil today.. an earring (ilv 90).. and its a tough choice compared to my ilv 70 rose gold earring.. Lose 150hp for 4 strength?

Crystal tower will likely however render it useless.

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I don't think CT will make it useless. Materia just makes certain items especially jewelry best in slot at the moment for everyone besides tank end gear raiding. If anything it may destroy vanya/darksteel but I don't think accessories will be out-done until they input the new ilvl80 jewelry.

You can cook food. That is what crafting is used for.

I gave up crafting and so did my roomie who is 50s across the board in crafts. You make more gil by selling your mats anyway and why waste the time and money leveling and gearing a crafter job that's useless anyway.

The actual crafting I find fun and my roomie absolutely loved but the lack of need, well, why bother? If you do want a crafted item, wait a couple days until everyone has undercut everyone else to the point that million gil piece of gear is selling for 50k. Doesn't take that long

So Yoshi, if I started this game in 1.0 should I unsubscribe since I can't craft ilvl 90 gear? Because I don't want to play a game where the best crafting item is 20 item levels below dungeon drops. Why can't I just make my own un-tradable ilvl 90 gear with unique items from dungeons? Anyway, it seems like this will always be the case so perhaps I should quit now seeing as I wasted all my time getting all my crafts to 50 in 1.0.

You mentioned that FFXIV is adding a way to custom tailor dungeon drops in the future. Will this take any skill or will it be as simple as point and click?

The HQ thing...
I would gladly be ok when I've used NQ mats and in the end will get a 50-95% (adjustable) to get a HQ. In germany we have a saying. It's roughly translated like: "There has no grandmaster fallen from the sky"
Sh*t happens, we all know it. Why on earth do we always have to have success? Sure I can plan ahead, real craftsmen do so too, but sh*t does happen.

I miss times in LotrO crafting (comperable with WoW) with a 30% chance.(? was it even that high?). It was easy to get mats for those crafts that's why I gladly accepted this percentage.

Well it goes boring to keep running dungeons and coil, so crafting can be an escape from dungeon too.

Crafting can be fun, I like to be self sufficient and also, I feel great being a "FC Crafter". It's like you're the armory for your FC, it gives me joy in outfitting them with crafted i70 HQ and prepare them for Coil and stuff :cool:

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Originally Posted by scarebearz

So far it's gil and it's a pretty big motivator! lol

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Gil is pretty useless in my opinion. As a 8x50 player, It's just there to help people in my FC who still need it. Anything relevant in this game pretty much comes from dungeon grinding, which is wrong. I wish we could craft ilvl80 or 85 items via Coil 'Bind on Aquire' materials that had say double or 30% more requirements then a 2 star synth currently does. Basically, give crafters and players more choices whilew also making those choices relevant in difficulty to the end gamke that DoW/DoM's face. This avoids RMT, makes players work for the best gear still (Coil based drops) AND avoids RMT. There you go Yoshi, I just offered you a way to make crafting mean something again and avoided the RMT that you so rightfully fear.