SE, don't overthink Summoner 7.0. Just give people what they want. Just do it.

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Originally Posted by Ggwppino

Staying on the topic of proposals, in my opinion if we free Mountain buster from topaz rite and nerf topaz rite just that little bit to make ruin 3 more damage-worthy, the smn can decide whether to do a little more damage but remain stationary, or use topaz rite to gain movement (as happening for garuda pre 70). In addition, each Mountain buster has a % chance of proc a significant boost damage for topaz rite

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The problem of this system for the current summoner is that it would be necessary to redo all the balancing of the battle system for it to work, because if bahamut is not quickly accessible the summoner, the SMN will not have any opening burst, even during the stormblood and shadowbringer period, bahamut was accessible quite quickly under 15s at stormblood and under a few seconds at shadowbringer the time to weave the 4 egi-assaults in dreadwyrm transe .

I think the best solution would be to make titan, ifrit, garuda ogcd spells and split their spells in the summoner bar, so that summoner can rush bahamut in a few seconds and then use the spells after according to the situation and without specific order
removing the summon gcd from 2.5s -> instant ogcd would put a cooldown of 30s for using elemental summons again,
this would make gameplay less slow and give the summoner real choices then whether they could use the Ifrit Combo, Garuda, or the Titan Combo whenever they want and with no time limit after use of bahamut.

For the problem of Demi-phoenix there are 2 possibilities, either giving the choice of burst with bahamut or phoenix depending on what you want from DPS or support such as the pvp system,
either make phoenix an ogcd which puts a regen or shield on the team and gives us 4 stacks of fountain of fire which replaces ruin 4 and a recharge of 120s.

basically the use of the 3 ogcd garuda, ifrit, titan unlocks the 3 gems which allow Bahamut to be summoned very quickly, then after using bahamut the summoner spends the spells of the respective summons in the order he wishes before the elemental summons are up again,
with this system they could also replace the 3 basic elemental summons by Shiva, leviathan and ramuh during the recharge of 30s.

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Originally Posted by remiff

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uhmm I admit I missed your point, I may have missed something with my reasoning. My proposition also works with the current rotation: when you summon Titan you have 4 topaz rites as usual and you have 4 Mountain bursters. If the 4 mountain busters oGCDs were untied by topaz rite, you could use them as the oGCD during titan. If we now assume that topaz rite does less damage than ruin 3, a hungry dps, if he doesn't need high movement, would prefer to use "Ruin 3 > Mountain burster > Ruin 3 > Mountain burster > Ruin 3 > Mountain burster > Ruin 3 > Mountain burster " instead of topaz rite. Assuming Mountain burster has a % chance of doubling topaz rite's damage at this point instead of using Ruin 3, the player should be careful to use topaz rite to get even more damage. In this way we have:
1) the player must choose whether to do more stationary damage or have more mobility
2) the player must be careful to vary his rotation in case of proc
3) the player must be careful to manage the time and not to exceed with resources

This thing already exists more or less with the smn before 72 but is then lost. Before 72, emerald ruin 3 does less pps than ruin 3, but is instant. then the smn is put to choose whether to do more damage and use ruin 3 or have more mobility and use emerald ruin 3.
This proposal is based only to make, in my opinion, the most boring evocation, less boring. Also, titan mobility would be used for a just cause and not because it has to be done

Anyway, I like your idea to make the smn rotation more interesting and frenetic overall.
I also like the fact that I have to use ogcd elementals as fast as possible in order to get into burst at the beginning and having other elementals inside the lego phase

Of course, it's completely different to how I had thought. i even would have added cast time to the various elementals ahahah In this way having a fairly stationary rotation I would have liked to find a way to manage carbuncle placement.
Giving him skills that involve good positioning: rescue, searing light, radiant aegis 2 (aoe), a heal with a reset cd when phoenix appears, a dot aoe to position.
For the dot I had also thought about the possibility of resetting the timer every time the carbuncle re-enters the area : position the dot under pet -> move the pet out of the dot area -> reposition the pet in the dot area to reset the timer (which might sound silly, but between base rotation and game mechanics it might not be so straightforward in practice) ah clearly the dot cannot be as strong as garuda's. I am not so clueless as not to consider that this dot can get buffs and with the timer reset continue to have them.
Yes, the toilet brings advice ahahah

on phoenix I think the your first option is the smartest choice to make. the oGCD one would be a utopia, but realistically I expect more the first option. Knowing me I will hardly ever use it t.t but it sure makes more sense than it does now.

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Originally Posted by Ggwppino

uhmm I admit I missed your point, I may have missed something with my reasoning.

on phoenix I think the your first option is the smartest choice to make. the oGCD one would be a utopia, but realistically I expect more the first option. Knowing me I will hardly ever use it t.t but it sure makes more sense than it does now.

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What they could do is cast 1.5s/2.5s gcd on bahamut and add the automatic version like the pheonix everlasting flight spell for bahamut: Megaflare + ahk morn and deathflare to make it the ideal risk taking and burst phase,
since they want to remove the summoner resurrection for 7.0, they could just limit its use to increase phoenix support and interest for example:
Phoenix is summoned and use everlasting flight + every spell are instant cast but overall less potency than bahamut + Renkindle and 1 stack of instant rez ( basic rez deleted),
phoenix would therefore be ideal in situations that require mobility and support but at the cost of a DPS decrease.

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Originally Posted by remiff

What they could do is cast 1.5s/2.5s gcd on bahamut and add the automatic version like the pheonix everlasting flight spell for bahamut: Megaflare + ahk morn and deathflare to make it the ideal risk taking and burst phase,
since they want to remove the summoner resurrection for 7.0, they could just limit its use to increase phoenix support and interest for example:
Phoenix is summoned and use everlasting flight + every spell are instant cast but overall less potency than bahamut + Renkindle and 1 stack of instant rez ( basic rez deleted),
phoenix would therefore be ideal in situations that require mobility and support but at the cost of a DPS decrease.

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That seems pretty fair to me. I would only find a way, as it was for the old smn with manage stacks of ruin 4, to still have a minimum of mobility under bahamut. This is to hypothetically make the smn compatible with certain raid mechs

imo all Smn needs is one additional dot..
..
want more challenging, play Blm or hard content

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Originally Posted by Shiroe

imo all Smn needs is one additional dot..
..
want more challenging, play Blm or hard content

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It is clearly not a credible argument that you offer us.

This post is legendary

Just...give me my dots back and ability to spread them with miasma. Maybe a new gauge that gradually gets filled up by dots which allows you to summon something new when it's full or perform some kind of attack so that the "DOTS R POINTLESS" crowd shuts up.

one dot on highe content is already enough, spreading it would very nice
.... but on easy / notmal smn will still remain a sleeping pill, but its fine if some classes renain easy in easyv/ normal content
.... while on hard content, shuffling your primals & skills within them, and now getting that dot off as optimal timed as possible, is no huge change, but adds one extra layer (really missed by smn fans), which shouldn't be hard to implement (and maybe allow a slight dps increase, smn / caster need badly)

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Originally Posted by Eorzean_username

Leviathan.

Ramuh.

Shiva.

That's. It.

Please. Don't overthink this. Don't do something weird and pointless.

We don't need "Ruin 5".

We don't need "Summon Bahamut II".

We don't need "Energy Vacuum".

We don't need some weird fourth gauge that we consume to ride Susanoo around like a mount for 15 seconds and force enemies to engage in Active Time Events.

Please. Don't try to "subvert expectations". Don't.

Just do the thing.

Just give us the rest of the Classic Final Fantasy Summons™.

Just do it.


"But the Lore says that they need to come from a weird mutated Carbuncle gem, or something!"

Okay sure, here:

• Aquamarine Leviathan
• Amethyst Ramuh
• Sapphire Shiva

There, done. Let's move along.

"B-But you can't summon Shiva! That's blasphemy!"

Sir and/or madame. We've been carting around Louisoix's desecrated memory like a designer handbag, in direct disrespect of his final wishes, for 4 years now. The ship of sanctity sailed back in Shadowbringers.

What matters now is, "Will this increase pre-order purchases if it appears during a Live Letter?" And the answer — which SE's board of directors will be happy to hear — is a resounding, YES!

So not only will this make Summoner players happy, but it will also increase SE's revenue, which can then be reinvested back into Forspoken 2. Win/win! (?)

And anyway, you can think of it as honoring someone's memory, rather than an enslavement — since we are, after all, just play-doh'ing Carbuncles into effigies of Primals... not actually performing a true summoning.

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Yes please, I loved the new SMN but it just feels incomplete. I need the rest of the summons.
Also, Odin. It could be another option for the LEVEL 100 ULTIMATE SUMMONER ATTACK.