On Extreme Role-playing Within XIV

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

That is as dull as dishwasher if it makes up the majority of the rp scene. It does not make use of lore, it does not make use of the world, and it is a narrative devoid of soul. In my opinion it's not but cringey discount second life.

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Tbf again, people usually don't announce their story-driven RP events outside of FC or small groups of friends, because there's some individuals who think disrupting fun for others is cool or something, and such events usually are well planned for everyone in a party to have time to shine and randoms ain't gonna fit in very well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

So you have chosen to continue being obnoxious. Got it. Personally, I won't even give you an answer from my point of view just because it's the principle of the matter now. You don't deserve one. It'd actually be a positive one, too!

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Funny thing was I asked respectfully for clarification before all of this but you guys were the one that sidestepped it so let us not pretend to ourselves and frame me as the only obnoxious one here. Y’all got defensive from the get go, and dismissed me and my questions which I understand it is a sensitive topic that can easily spiral out of control.

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

From experience, I cannot provide examples of from 14. In other mmos it's not too hard to find non-cringey rp. The two that come to mind are ESO and LoTRO (atleast when I played years ago.) SWTOR in its prime was also pretty decent. Then again two of those have pretty decent pvp system to assist with more confrontational rp.

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Oh yeah SWTOR guilds especially early on when Jung ma had a much higher server pop we had some interesting story lines regarding sex trafficking, xenophobia, slavery, drug trades etc . . . With Lords would not pause to degrade and or belittle non force users, or aliens though it did fit more within the universe.

Another good example would be Conan Exiles many of their RP storylines lean into the heavier side outside of what we mostly see here tavern RP.

I do wonder if people are against such topics / characters in RP because they are afraid they will be used as means to promote irl views masked as a safe and fun activity. Which does seem like a weird stance cause OOC comments made by many players could also be seen as hateful remarks geared towards certain characters due to race though normally they are okay, or has RP changed over the years where the character is considered a person because of the player behind the keyboard. Which is also weird cause a character is not the person so anything done to the character should not be taken personally.

SWTOR was my first mmo and also the first type I RP’ed and this was a general rule I was told to follow do not take RP actions personally. Though it seems to differ here or maybe RP has shifted idk.

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

role-playing a character who might be racist, xenophobic or intolerant. A Garlean loyalist who believes in the cause, or a Xaela ultra nationalist. A moral compromised character. I've found these types of role-playing within XIV to be almost nonexistent and even treated as taboo.

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Good. Lets keep it that way.

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Originally Posted by Hatfright

Tbf again, people usually don't announce their story-driven RP events outside of FC or small groups of friends, because there's some individuals who think disrupting fun for others is cool or something, and such events usually are well planned for everyone in a party to have time to shine and randoms ain't gonna fit in very well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Then better to have no rp at all. That'd be better than what rp has morphed into in 14, which is to say wish fulfillment and thinly veiled cybering.

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

From experience, I cannot provide examples of from 14. In other mmos it's not too hard to find non-cringey rp. The two that come to mind are ESO and LoTRO (atleast when I played years ago.) SWTOR in its prime was also pretty decent. Then again two of those have pretty decent pvp system to assist with more confrontational rp.

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Therein lies the crux of your current dilemma. Successful confrontational RP, incorporating themes of xenophobia for example, require an MMO with an "us vs. them" mentality between game players where the RP theme is a reflection of the game mechanics themselves: hatred of the "other", whether it be Horde vs. Alliance in WoW, the Three Alliances in ESO, or Jedi vs. Sith in SWTOR.

As you've mentioned, this game does not have that sort of "us vs. them" mentality, which is reflected in PvP, which is reflected in player attitudes toward confrontational RP.


Also, you really need to polish your argument. When asked to provide an example of a non-cringey RP character, you obfuscate by mentioning MMOs where you didn't think things cringey. Not the same thing.

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

Then better to have no rp at all. That'd be better than what rp has morphed into in 14, which is to say wish fulfillment and thinly veiled cybering.

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Why tho? People are having fun on their own terms, that's all. Who are we to say they can't, honestly?

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Originally Posted by Caurcas

Then better to have no rp at all. That'd be better than what rp has morphed into in 14, which is to say wish fulfillment and thinly veiled cybering.

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You appear to have a complete lack of understanding of the RP communities (plural) within this game if you truly believe such a gross generalization. Sadly, you can never be satisfied, as you see only this vague caricature of the actual RP communities where you might actually flourish.

I'd suggest searching for one of the RP Discords dedicated to this game, but with your preconceived notions of the entirety of the RP community in general, I doubt you'll take the time to actually look.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

Therein lies the crux of your current dilemma. Successful confrontational RP, incorporating themes of xenophobia for example, require an MMO with an "us vs. them" mentality between game players where the RP theme is a reflection of the game mechanics themselves: hatred of the "other", whether it be Horde vs. Alliance in WoW, the Three Alliances in ESO, or Jedi vs. Sith in SWTOR.

As you've mentioned, this game does not have that sort of "us vs. them" mentality, which is reflected in PvP, which is reflected in player attitudes toward confrontational RP.


Also, you really need to polish your argument. When asked to provide an example of a non-cringey RP character, you obfuscate by mentioning MMOs where you didn't think things cringey. Not the same thing.

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That is an interesting view, and I can see the point cause the cases of confrontational RP are in games and worlds where it does foster an us verse them storyline from the start. Though it does make me wonder is that also the reason people that create such characters are judged to be assholes just based around a character they have created. I can see why the game world would not foster such types of RP, but where does the divide come when people who engage in fringe type of RP are for the most part are ostracized by virtue of their character, not just the character itself but they themselves. As noted in the thread people who have x character are assholes / jerks.

I do get the line of reasoning why someone may not want to engage in such RP, but I do nto get the reasoning as to why someone should view another person as an simple by virtue of a character they created. I do not think people would feel it is reasonable for me to say I think all barkeeps are assholes because I disagree with that type of RP. Forgot to mention one more thing, the thing is FFXIV story does tackle more darker themes, so it is not something the community has been exposed too. Also as a community to mock certain races all the time with our memes. They are characters, and as many have mentioned yes RP can be used as means to wave away any aggression and can be used to willfully harm people I agree, but should bad actors detract and thus be the reason why everyone that engages in fringe style of RP as unreasonable monsters.

It is all fictional, none of it is real sure it can be used to harm but even then that requires the person to willfully take offense and view such attacks on a character as a personal attack which should never be the case in RP.

Well even if FF14 has no PvP which fully solidifies divides, it's still assumptive to say that every single person born in Eorzea is cooperative. PvP does not always have to reflect lore. In FFXIV lore there are Elezen discriminatory based on class and wealth (Ishgard wouldn't transform in one night would it?), there are territorial Xaela - somewhere in these forums there is an elaborate official thread about naming conventions which talks about all the Xaela tribes - and there's good old Garlemald. You can have a Garlean willing to be friends with Eorzeans - see Maximus, Cid and Lucia - and you can also have Eorzeans friendly towards the Garlean cause, right? Fordola for instance. Experience and life shaped their views.

If NPCs are allowed to have disagreeable views, why can't an RPer make such a character? Why is it suddenly different in RP? Sure, most of the "bad opinion" characters get painted as villains in the story (although I can't help think back to this one Hyur quest NPC at Hawthorne Hut labelling all Duskwight as poor thieves...) but they exist, right? Why not let someone who has opinions that don't align with yours just exist - heck, it's a fictional character...

I know nowadays saying "what happens in RP is only RP" is seen an excuse to hand-wave aggressive creepers or problematic people. I don't think it makes the statement any less true.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

You appear to have a complete lack of understanding of the RP communities (plural) within this game if you truly believe such a gross generalization. Sadly, you can never be satisfied, as you see only this vague caricature of the actual RP communities where you might actually flourish.

I'd suggest searching for one of the RP Discords dedicated to this game, but with your preconceived notions of the entirety of the RP community in general, I doubt you'll take the time to actually look.

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My notions of the rp community within 14 are founded on what I've seen of them over the 6 years I've played. Although I will say during the HW era it was far better than it is now.