Teleport kills immersion

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Originally Posted by Chessala

Therefore, being able to teleport is part of the story and NOT having it would ruin immersion.

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I don't know about other folks, but as I said earlier in the thread, I mainly just wish there were fewer Aetherytes or that using them was a bit more involved. The ability to teleport is fine—it's the ease by which we can negate the world with it that contributes to the game world feeling more like a lobby and less like a place to me. It diminishes my level of immersion (as mentioned, I feel the same way about the Duty Finder).

What is the problem with teleports? You can't use then until you get there by foot once (you need to attune first). If you need run to some place again and again (Btw, to people who talk to npc to enter alex savage, and who need to run/fly there every time - how is your immersion?) - it is annoyance, not immersion.

And of course on top of than just don't use them.

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Originally Posted by vp_cmc

And of course on top of than just don't use them.

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For those of us that find constant teleportation immersion-negative, that's not a satisfactory solution. In a sense it's a narrative thing: heroic, fantastic quests nearly always involve a journey, but we tend to skip most of the journey part of the heroic quest in this game. Someone else explained it far better earlier in the thread than I had been able to:

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Originally Posted by Niwashi

It's the difference between walking to a destination to reach it and taking a walk for the sake of taking a walk. You see the scenery in either case, but in one you have a sense of purpose while doing so.

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Originally Posted by Arrius

words

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Originally Posted by Rowena

I ain't normally one to accept alternative forms o' payment--especially for debts, mind--but this bloke's miniature aetheryte has been a bloody godssend, what with me havin' to split my time between the Toll and Idyllshire. Only saves me a short walk to the one outside, but when you're busy as I am, every minute o' every hour o' every day matters.

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Straight from the mistress's mouth. She can go between the two areas at will, even if you don't physically see her teleport.


Back to the teleport immersion thing. I said it before in the past and I'll keep saying it; it's nice to walk through the big open world the first few times. The next several dozen times, you seen everything, you know where everything is, and you have little time to waste going through the scenic route over and over. That feeling of being immersed with the world quickly loses its appeal.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

That feeling of being immersed with the world quickly loses its appeal.

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Especially when you got an Antecedent on pearl >_>

I think the issue is the game needs some overhauls to go along with teleportation. A lot of stuff in this game revolves around using teleports, so just removing them without other adjustments would be pretty bad. IMO There are many other much more important issues (and some much less controversial) that I'd rather dev time to go to.

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Originally Posted by vp_cmc

What is the problem with teleports? You can't use then until you get there by foot once (you need to attune first). If you need run to some place again and again (Btw, to people who talk to npc to enter alex savage, and who need to run/fly there every time - how is your immersion?) - it is annoyance, not immersion.

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Currently, it's not really annoying going to the Hinterlands. At least I remember where the Alexander raid is. For a lot of dungeon content, I completely forget where they are. After I spend some time thinking about it, I can sometimes remember. This is more of an issue with DF than teleports though. I also like that we are encouraged to journey in the beautiful zone (Hinterlands), rather than instantly queue in from our houses

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And of course on top of than just don't use them.

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I think Alahra answered this well, but I wanted to add something. One of the issues, for me at least, is the only reason to go out in the open world is for Hunts. If I decided to not use teleports for these, I wouldn't make a single one. In an online social game, your actions are not the only ones that affect your own gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Alahra

In a sense it's a narrative thing: heroic, fantastic quests nearly always involve a journey, but we tend to skip most of the journey part of the heroic quest in this game.

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You can't use teleports before you attuned. In order to attune you first need to come to that aetheryte. Here comes your jorney.

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Originally Posted by vp_cmc

You can't use teleports before you attuned. In order to attune you first need to come to that aetheryte. Here comes your jorney.

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Are you normally this condescending and dismissive?

The "journey" you mention has taken up an incredibly minimal portion of my playtime, to the point that it's largely forgettable, which thus means the immersive value it provides is negligible because it's dwarfed by the multitude of times you simply warp there instead.

Please bear in mind that this is a matter of personal preference. Some players don't need that level of immersion and others prefer it. Being condescending and dismissive about it isn't going to make me suddenly not want it.

Edit
I'm at the post cap, but I just want to address this:

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

How was her comment condescending?

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It's the "Here comes your journey," bit mostly. In addition to not really engaging with the general thing I was talking about (which is that journeys are a big part of heroic quest narratives, rather than a small one—in the narrative, the hero normally gets a shortcut back home, but everywhere in between, it's a journey) it also implies that I apparently don't know what we do in the game to unlock teleports or something, which is a condescending assumption to make.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

I found it quite a journey walking from place to place for the first time getting chased by mobs until I found an aetheryte to attune to. Just because it wasn't immersive enough for you doesn't mean it wasn't for others. Kind of like what you are telling others that don't agree with you.

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And I don't think you'll find anywhere in this thread that I have dismissed other's opinions—I've only been stating the whole way that I (and the others that agree with me, at times) wish we had more immersion. I've never said that others who don't need any more or don't care about it don't get valid enjoyment out of the game or something.

But the responses to my posts frequently try to argue against what I enjoy as if I either shouldn't enjoy it or that I should have no reason to want more immersion. I'll admit all day that the convenience of teleporting is great and indeed necessary for the game as it stands, but I do wish it weren't as ubiquitous for my personal taste while at the same time understanding that such a thing really wouldn't work in the game we have now (and would indeed turn a lot of people off).

Put another way: don't take my personal enjoyment of a higher level of immersion for a belief that it would be good for the game as a whole. I don't think the game necessarily should remove teleports or anything like that—it's just one of those things I wish they had done a bit differently.

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Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh

Let me bring this up. You say immersive value is lost upon teleport spam, but the same can be said for just walking through the same area dozens of times, which is what people complain about with the dungeon grind; there's nothing of value to stop for, so why go slowly in places you already got immersed in?

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It's not always about "going slowly," for me, though. Travel, to me, has an inherent immersive value in a persistent world like an MMO (and in open world sandbox games, too, which share some similar elements), as it makes the world scope feel larger (again, to me). It's like a sort of persistent reminder that the locations and regions are all interconnected. Every game has concessions in this regard (such as zone lines in this one or some warping and the like), which result in varying changes to the level of immersion I feel.

Of the main MMOs I've spent time with, I generally felt the most immersed in FFXI's Vana'diel which had zone lines, but large zones, "physical" boats and airships, and relatively little instantaneous travel (and what it did have usually involved interacting with "warp points" in ways similar to FFXIV's city Aetheryte networks). I felt less immersed in WoW's Azeroth, but still fairly immersed (though the addition of personal flight and Dungeon Finder diminished that for me—which are other topics entirely), thanks to its overworld flight path system (not unlike Chocobo Porters here) and "physical" boats. I feel the least immersed in Eorzea because of the one-two punch of Duty Finder content and ubiquitous, disassociated teleportation.

Beyond all that, immersion for me in a persistent world is best maintained if it is, itself, persistent. Going to an Aetheryte in a new city (or the unlock point for a new dungeon or something) once provides momentary immersion, but not persistent immersion.

How was her comment condescending? She's not exactly wrong with her statement for I found it quite a journey walking from place to place for the first time getting chased by mobs until I found an aetheryte to attune to. Just because it wasn't immersive enough for you doesn't mean it wasn't for others. Kind of like what you are telling others that don't agree with you.


Let me bring this up. You say immersive value is lost upon teleport spam, but the same can be said for just walking through the same area dozens of times, which is what people complain about with the dungeon grind; there's nothing of value to stop for, so why go slowly in places you already got immersed in?

Elder Scrolls Online has limited (and a punishing) teleporting system compared to FFXIV.
And honestly the lack of teleportation only gives the illusion of a big world.

As I stated in my earlier post.
I am not 100% against nor for teleportation being reduced/limited.

However they would absolutely have to oberhaul the overworld zones, mount system, companion system, and FATE systems because...with us having to go it on foot more...it would turn travel into a nuisance.

Unless they remade the ARR zones (which would involve rebuilding and combining some to equal the HW zone size/scale) and allowed flight (for those who are in a hurry...) And we all know that isn't happening.

As Miles said...

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Let me bring this up. You say immersive value is lost upon teleport spam, but the same can be said for just walking through the same area dozens of times, which is what people complain about with the dungeon grind; there's nothing of value to stop for, so why go slowly in places you already got immersed in?

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This is why they'd need to overhaul FATES, Hunts, Levequests.
To award Tomes, Seals, significantly more gil, items, etc.
Having random coffer chests spawn in random areas or drop off random mobs that contain REAL valued loot in them, & etc.
And it would all HAVE to be soloable.
Otherwise people will dread traveling anywhere.

The issue is...a change like this would now make dungeons significantly less desirable. And I can easily see how mad players who run dungeons & etc would become.

Hell they get mad now that tomes allow less dedicated players to "keep up".