(Un)Official Arcanist/Summmoner Feedback Thread

cast interruption is only for PvP,we have many ways to avoid it,and there are some pvp exclusive spells to use,so pvp must be tried a lot before judge

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Originally Posted by xardus

cast interruption is only for PvP,we have many ways to avoid it,and there are some pvp exclusive spells to use,so pvp must be tried a lot before judge

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Sorry if I don't get the "many ways to avoid it".

If a monk gets in your face with shoulder charge you ... ?

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also this: When multiple characters are playing the same class/job in a party, the gauge for level 2 and level 3 limit breaks will now fill more slowly than before.

why...?

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Probably just to further try to discourage class stacking. Actually not that bad a deal since hardly anyone plays arcanists it seems. Sucks if you're a dragoon or bard though.

well as summoner you have bio and ruin 2 and miasma2 (usefull for heavy) that are istant,we have swiftcast and surecast,so u have some way to apply ur dots while hitted,resistance are differents than pve so can happen u avoid attacks often than in coil

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Originally Posted by xardus

well as summoner you have bio and ruin 2 and miasma2 (usefull for heavy) that are istant,we have swiftcast and surecast,so u have some way to apply ur dots while hitted,resistance are differents than pve so can happen u avoid attacks often than in coil

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Xardus my point is this:

Cloth armor vs medium armor.
1/4 dps (if that) vs 100% dps (though to be fair, likely they will not be hitting many backstabs if you're good at spinning), so 1/2 dps for monks.
No self healing, vs OKAY healing (maybe, though miasma II debuff will likely cripple that).
No movement, vs 30 sec shoulder charge.
No purges, vs one ilm punch
Massive mana drain (ruin II and miasma II are very terrible) vs normal tp drain

Not to mention if they have any experience with arena design, there will be pillars to LoS from.

well now im too tired to understand well ur examples hehe,anyway im agree that can be problems,but we have to see how they changed resistance for pvp before speculate,i was only talking about ways to avoid interruption

Panda : we get a 20s surecast + surecast in pvp. We reduce their range by 30% (that's a lot) and... we're not alone. I'm sure we'll be fine.

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Originally Posted by pandabearcat

Do casters have any mobility options? Do they have any instacast snares?

NOPE!

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That move that makes you run really fast which non casters can't use or else they aren't able to use any abilities anymore. Sprint.

So, basically they nerfed SMN sustained damage output for PvP by removing Thunder and removed Virus to eliminate groups from using rotations, which require a degree of teamwork and raid awareness to do in the first place... They didn't fix anything and took things away. They crippled the ability we were going to get by 50% and increased the duration of heavy by 50% as well... Hmm, smells like a majority of this is to balance PvP and tiny portion to nerf PvE and piss people off.

Well, monks and dragoons are getting "weapon throw" to remove that while chasing -- but summoners still have heavy from miasma/miasma 2, and monks still have to put up with positional requirements for their damage, so...?

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Originally Posted by Illa

So, basically they nerfed SMN sustained damage output for PvP by removing Thunder

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Why the hell do you think that's PvP centric? Thunder's probably the last spell we'd want to cast in PvP anyways given that it's both lower PPCT and PPM than our other DoTs and freecasting time and mana are both limited commodities.

Guys, at least we know they'll give our class some love in 2.2 seeing leviathan comes out. Lol jk, god knows what will happen then.

Don't worry, leviathan will be glitched to only auto attack every 5 seconds, and will have a 130 potency attack making people think it's good.

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Originally Posted by PriyaJugulataris

Guys, at least we know they'll give our class some love in 2.2 seeing leviathan comes out. Lol jk, god knows what will happen then.

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if it can be true...very nice but...what a summoner can do for those 3 months? or maybe 5 months untill 2.2? i really want to see in about 2 weeks when every coil group will kick smn because a blm is better...we dont only have the same dromp of a blm but now we will be replaced as magic casters...you will see guys you will see
the only reason for having a smn is the higher output of dps on boss (and its VERY VERY related to player skills)

Eh i'm not sure about that, imo best coil party is gonna be pali, warrior, scholar, whm, bard, black mage, summoner and monk. That allows for a dps split between physical and magical, gives full LB speed and takes advantage of changes made. Now the reason I still think 3 ranged is optimal is because the principle reason that melee DPS have been losing out to caster DPS is sustainability due to boss mechanics. Due to dealing with less boss mechanics being at a range, ranged DPS have more sustainability. Now while these buffs are made to circumvent that, physical DPS are still going to have to deal with said mechanics (which seriously instead of buffing melee classes, make ranged deal with more mechanic), and in terms of coil and primals, ranged dps are typically the safer bet. Also, non healer ressing is a nice utility to hold on to as well.
But that's just my opinion on it.

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Originally Posted by PriyaJugulataris

Eh i'm not sure about that, imo best coil party is gonna be pali, warrior, scholar, whm, bard, black mage, summoner and monk. That allows for a dps split between physical and magical, gives full LB speed and takes advantage of changes made. Now the reason I still think 3 ranged is optimal is because the principle reason that melee DPS have been losing out to caster DPS is sustainability due to boss mechanics. Due to dealing with less boss mechanics being at a range, ranged DPS have more sustainability. Now while these buffs are made to circumvent that, physical DPS are still going to have to deal with said mechanics (which seriously instead of buffing melee classes, make ranged deal with more mechanic), and in terms of coil and primals, ranged dps are typically the safer bet. Also, non healer ressing is a nice utility to hold on to as well.
But that's just my opinion on it.

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im totally agree with that,im happy about monk buffs because they have to run away to avoid things and loose dps,and its so good have a bumped dps,but we have our mech too ,just talking about coil t2 we have allagan rot,piercing laser,aoe on ground(dont remember name lol) they are quiet easier than melee ones but we have half armor of theme,a piercing laser i cant avoid for server lag stole about 80% of my hp and im half myth armored...that worth the higher dps output
we are rezzer and this is fantastic,and probably one of the only our strong point when looking for coil party,but looking at patch notes we will loose our greater dps output on >2min fights (on short fights we are weak but its a good compromise for me)

Some of the new 2.1 items look so nice! Has anyone started making a BiS yet? (with Allagan book, and without allagan book)

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Originally Posted by Nemhy

Some of the new 2.1 items look so nice! Has anyone started making a BiS yet? (with Allagan book, and without allagan book)

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Courtesy of T0rin (448 acc):
Summoner's Horn
Summoner's Doublet
Summoner's Ringbands
Allagan Rope Belt of Casting
Allagan Breeches of Casting
Allagan Boots of Casting
Hero's Necklace of Casting
Tremor Earring of Casting
Hero's Bracelet of Casting
Hero's Ring of Casting
Vortex Ring of Casting

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Originally Posted by PriyaJugulataris

imo best coil party is gonna be pali, warrior, scholar, whm, bard, black mage, summoner and monk.

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Replace MNK with DRG and I'll agree with you. The two classes have similar dps, except DRG provides the added benefit of buffing your BRD's damage ;-)

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Originally Posted by PriyaJugulataris

Courtesy of T0rin (448 acc):
Summoner's Horn
Summoner's Doublet
Summoner's Ringbands
Allagan Rope Belt of Casting
Allagan Breeches of Casting
Allagan Boots of Casting
Hero's Necklace of Casting
Tremor Earring of Casting
Hero's Bracelet of Casting
Hero's Ring of Casting
Vortex Ring of Casting

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T0rin? sounds like a tool if you ask me =V. KIDDING, I'M KIDDING!

Interesting, does the added crit outweigh Garuda not being hitcap? I saw the 459 acc set (which IMO is overkill), is there no set that gets a bit closer without going way over?

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Originally Posted by pandabearcat

On the other hand, wow caster cross class abilities blow.

I noticed that surecast is still a POS and they're likely not making it any better.

But thats not even the most ridiculous thing.

The most ridiculous thing is MONK BUFFS WTF.

Also uh, did you notice that "any direct damage interrupts casting".


Do casters have any mobility options? Do they have any instacast snares?

EDIT2:

also this: When multiple characters are playing the same class/job in a party, the gauge for level 2 and level 3 limit breaks will now fill more slowly than before.

why...?

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Those bitter tears taste so sweet. Come on now, you honestly telling me you didnt see some nerfing coming regarding ranged dps. Pride before fall.

Mobility options? Are you kidding me? You have the biggest mobility option already. Its called freedom of movement just for being a ranged dps.

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Originally Posted by Nemhy

T0rin? sounds like a tool if you ask me =V. KIDDING, I'M KIDDING!

Interesting, does the added crit outweigh Garuda not being hitcap? I saw the 459 acc set (which IMO is overkill), is there no set that gets a bit closer without going way over?

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Mmmhmm.

The DPS you gain from Garuda for going from 448 acc to 450+ does not outweigh the DPS you lose on your SMN going from 448 acc to 450+. It is quite likely that acc caps at 449.. my parsing at 447 showed a <1% accuracy loss on Garuda, so 448 is near enough to the cap that any additional accuracy at the cost of secondary stats is just going to be a DPS loss.

There is a bit of diminishing returns on accuracy gains the closer you get to the cap, so that last 1 or 2 accuracy doesn't give much return. If it was 440 vs 450 that'd be one thing, but thankfully it is not.

And this BiS set is notably better than the old one by a good ~5 weighted int, not even counting the new Allagan book. (which is a monster from a DPS perspective)

And no, there is no set that I've been able to put together to hit the low 250s and still maintain near max potential DPS.

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Originally Posted by T0rin

Mmmhmm.

The DPS you gain from Garuda for going from 448 acc to 450+ does not outweigh the DPS you lose on your SMN going from 448 acc to 450+. It is quite likely that acc caps at 449.. my parsing at 447 showed a <1% accuracy loss on Garuda, so 448 is near enough to the cap that any additional accuracy at the cost of secondary stats is just going to be a DPS loss.

There is a bit of diminishing returns on accuracy gains the closer you get to the cap, so that last 1 or 2 accuracy doesn't give much return. If it was 440 vs 450 that'd be one thing, but thankfully it is not.

And this BiS set is notably better than the old one by a good ~5 weighted int, not even counting the new Allagan book. (which is a monster from a DPS perspective)

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ahhh okay! Thank you very much for the fast reply! Now I just gotta decide if I care enough to get the myth boots for one week till they patch it. Probably not cause they're ugly! :P

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Originally Posted by Nemhy

ahhh okay! Thank you very much for the fast reply! Now I just gotta decide if I care enough to get the myth boots for one week till they patch it. Probably not cause they're ugly! :P

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Probably not... I'm going to be hitting the EM primal fights pretty hard after 1-5 is done, need that book and 2/3 accessories. :)

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Originally Posted by T0rin

Probably not... I'm going to be hitting the EM primal fights pretty hard after 1-5 is done, need that book and 2/3 accessories. :)

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Don't you have a one week lockout on all E-primal drops?

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Originally Posted by Nemhy

Don't you have a one week lockout on all E-primal drops?

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The patch notes explicitly mention the CT loot lockout. But it says nothing like that about the EM Primals.
It was never mentioned to have one in any comments or live letters before that I've seen.
I see no reason to not assume it functions like the current HM Primals.

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Originally Posted by Truedragon

HM primals have random loot though. Just saying. There might be a lock out.

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So are the Primal accessories.
The weapon is a different story, but it's clearly not related to the instance loot itself considering you have to kill all the primals to get it.
Probably a weekly quest or something.

HM primals have random loot though. Just saying. There might be a lock out.

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Originally Posted by Allyrion

The patch notes explicitly mention the CT loot lockout. But it says nothing like that about the EM Primals.
It was never mentioned to have one in any comments or live letters before that I've seen.
I see no reason to not assume it functions like the current HM Primals.

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...s!-2.1-and-2.2 It LOOKS like it only applies to the weapon but for arguments sake I'm gonna assume it does apply to all drops.

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Originally Posted by Truedragon

HM primals have random loot though. Just saying. There might be a lock out.

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Well the accessories are also random drops. It's just the weapon that has the quest

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Originally Posted by Nemhy

Don't you have a one week lockout on all E-primal drops?

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Well, yeah, after I get one, right? I g uess I need to go back and look at the patch notes.

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Originally Posted by Nemhy

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...s!-2.1-and-2.2 It LOOKS like it only applies to the weapon but for arguments sake I'm gonna assume it does apply to all drops.

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Primal Extreme mode loot and Crystal Tower loot will have a 1 week lockout. You have to beat all three EM Primals to loot one item.

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We both know that loot lock out has to only apply to the weapons.
The description with it is clearly only relevant to the weapon.
There's a fringe chance I guess.

Well even if it is a loot lockout as long as I can do it until I get the Garuda ring and titan earrings I'm fine. If I can only try once per week and have to lot against other smns and blms though that won't be fun

So is the omnitome even worth using over Wiyu zenith?

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Originally Posted by Riotpersona

So is the omnitome even worth using over Wiyu zenith?

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I'll use it until allagan pants drop. It's a good stop gap when transitioning between i70 and i90 gear because of the accuracy issues.

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Originally Posted by Riotpersona

So is the omnitome even worth using over Wiyu zenith?

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I've been tinkering around with some gear ideas using omnitome, but the problem is that when my group finally downs t5 and if I get the wep, then I'll need totally different items to get back to 440-450 acc. That said, who knows when that will be so maybe I'll just go ahead and roll with it. That said, it kinda irritates me that I just bought my myth pants a couple weeks ago to fix my accuracy problem, but that's life I guess.

for the Garuda>Ifrit fight I rather use Ifrit for Trash Mobs (stun and I feel is more dmg wise skill+autoattack) and Garuda for Bosses (Contagion <3 ) . I don t have dummy tests but I ve seen them from other uses and based on my exp I rather stick to it.

I m not in turn 4+ yet so can t tell as much about Acc miss atm my smn has:
Body/Head AF+1
Full DL
Relic+1

I always use Buttons but so far I didn t see Garuda or I missing :) it might change in turn 4+ altho keep in mind if you are only doing Turn 4-5 the whole week (and you wont) and do nothing else acc isn t as usefull compared to the rest of the game s content :)

Ifrit will do more dps if you leave him on Sic, but that leaves his stun unchecked. Also you can still use Contagion before baning trash mobs for nearly every pull

Leaving Ifrit on Sic will actually yeild less damage as all his other moves do less damage then his Burning Strike spam on obey. Since he will repeat that move over and over again in addition to his extra melee strike I usually leave him on obey to max his DPS and have stun on command when needed.

Won't he jump into using another move sooner though? He waits 4 seconds before using his main move again, which is the whole reason he doesn't match Garuda even with his auto attack. Despite being weaker moves if he's throwing them out sooner he would end up slightly higher on dps.

I mean there's really no reason to ever use him because a contagion -> bane lets you do more in the long run than any sort of dps boost he might have hanging out on Sic. Also any dps gain he would have would be pretty minor

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Originally Posted by Truedragon

Those bitter tears taste so sweet. Come on now, you honestly telling me you didnt see some nerfing coming regarding ranged dps.

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Everyone expected some sort of nerf. What people didn't expect was a nerf that directly impacted the playability of the class when they could instead nerf something less visible (i.e. pet auto-attack damage, dot ticks, ruin). Utterly removing a button from our rotation is the problem, not the nerf itself.

Glad they "fixed" Aero too for that matter.

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Originally Posted by Sylari

Everyone expected some sort of nerf. What people didn't expect was a nerf that directly impacted the playability of the class when they could instead nerf something less visible (i.e. pet auto-attack damage, dot ticks, ruin). Utterly removing a button from our rotation is the problem, not the nerf itself.

Glad they "fixed" Aero too for that matter.

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The issue with the nerd for Summoners and Black mages was they buffed Monk and Dragon like crazy and took away a major part of or rotation which was thunder and considering it was on of the few cross class skills we had it hit hard. Also all they needed to do was fix Flare Ner Bards and give Summoners another cross class skill.