[5.55 Bozja spoilers] Additional post-ending Bozja story hidden in the field record

I'd like a cool setting with interesting factions, races and nations that do not necessarily agree with one another and may very well be opposed to one another from time to time.

I think the obsession with 'problematic' and 'uncomfortable' content has led to a lot of the depth and nuance to be sucked out of the fantasy genre across the board.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

I agree and I like this sort of approach. I think XIV leans very heavily on one singular common thread in its MSQ, but I also wouldn't want to go to the opposite end of no connection between stories. A subtler, overarching connecting thread that is gradually pulled apart would be ideal. That said, I'd like to see that achieved without the baggage of the whole WoL role.

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I agree, which is why I think our power as Azem and the Blessing of Light are going to be lost after 6.0. This can bring us down in power and allow believable scenarios to occur, like how much we struggled during HW's 3.0 story.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Except in the Garlean case, it was literally a matter of either attempt to conquer or become literally extinct. Our history has been full of and involved with conquest. It isn’t any different in the games story.Conquest is a major part in both the history of our world and the history in the setting of the game. It doesn’t mean it’s a bad thing whatsoever, in many cases conquest led to people leading more free lives and safety under the law of others.Conquering brings benefits, it doesnt just not bring anyting.

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Huh? they were pushed far to the north and left alone after that. They didn't have to conquer anything. They went and took back their home land then said might as well take over everything else since were superior.

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Originally Posted by thegreatonemal

Huh? they were pushed far to the north and left alone after that. They didn't have to conquer anything. They went and took back their home land then said might as well take over everything else since were superior.

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They were pushed to infertile land by people who had hoped they’d become extinct just because they couldn’t manipulate aether. They literally needed to conquer to survive since they couldn’t rely on aether like other countries could.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Except in the Garlean case, it was literally a matter of either attempt to conquer or become literally extinct. Our history has been full of and involved with conquest. It isn’t any different in the games story.Conquest is a major part in both the history of our world and the history in the setting of the game. It doesn’t mean it’s a bad thing whatsoever, in many cases conquest led to people leading more free lives and safety under the law of others.Conquering brings benefits, it doesnt just not bring anyting.

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Reclamation and conquest are completely different things though. Reclamation would be the Garleans using their newfound power (which by the way, enabled them to create a habitable society in the land they were pushed to already) to fight their oppressors and take back the land that was stolen from them. Conquest is them then continuing their campaign passed their old territory and into lands that they never had ownership over.

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Originally Posted by GoldStarz

Reclamation and conquest are completely different things though. Reclamation would be the Garleans using their newfound power (which by the way, enabled them to create a habitable society in the land they were pushed to already) to fight their oppressors and take back the land that was stolen from them. Conquest is them then continuing their campaign passed their old territory and into lands that they never had ownership over.

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Yes and they engaged in both. Both reclamation and conquest. Neither of these is inherently bad. It always comes with its benefits. Hell, we see that Limsa did the same exact thing. Limsa engaged in conquest to take land from the Kobolds. If it wasn’t for that they wouldn’t be here.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

I agree, which is why I think our power as Azem and the Blessing of Light are going to be lost after 6.0. This can bring us down in power and allow believable scenarios to occur, like how much we struggled during HW's 3.0 story.

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If you mean the crystal of Azem, yes, I foresee that falling away once its plot use is served. However, if you mean simply being a shard of an ancient deemed worthy of joining the Convocation, i.e. the cream of the crop, that will always remain, but they've always kept it vague how much of a role the Blessing of Light plays (I'd say rather considerable even after HW, particularly during the fight with Hades) and once the two eldest of Primals are retired in some fashion or other, that sort of thing will probably be phased out along with them, and will act as a useful corrective measure for bringing down the power level a bit plausibly.

I thought 3.0 was specifically demonstrating that the Blessing of Light is not the reason why we're so powerful.

I think the only thing it would've actually changed was not allowing the key to Azys Lla to be stolen as everything we've seen thus far suggests it mostly acts as a countermeasure against the Ascians and their powers, which likely stem from Zodiark in some capacity.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

I thought 3.0 was specifically demonstrating that the Blessing of Light is not the reason why we're so powerful.

I think the only thing it would've actually changed was not allowing the key to Azys Lla to be stolen as everything we've seen thus far suggests it mostly acts as a countermeasure against the Ascians and their powers, which likely stem from Zodiark in some capacity.

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Yeah we did not really get less powerful without it, so I doubt its the reason for most of our powers.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

I don’t think they really need to change much. Like other’s have mentioned, i think Nerva will be a Larsa-like figure who keeps the Empire’s core ideals and simply keeps friendly ties with the other nations. I’d rather that and they get to have their own provinces than the Alliance try to alliance-fy them. That would be extremely boring.I’m curious what you mean on being extremely careful of having a single character take over? It worked very well in 12 which is a game they take heavy inspiration from. Also i don’t think conquest is bad, necessarily. It’s just natural with the way things are in the setting. Just like irl where we wouldn’t be where we are today with conquest.

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Simply put (as in I'm simplifying to cut down on rambling), a single point of authority in an absolute monarchy means there's a lack of check and balances. This is different from having a limited (eg constitutional, among other forms) monarchy, since these checks against the monarch's powers can mitigate tyranny.

For example, Garlemald had a thriving amount of arts. And then Varis went hard on imperial censors, and the Prima Vista had to flee (and they imply they're not the only ones), and all of it was the fault of one person deciding on this course of action. And since that one person has all the authority in the country, that means nobody can gainsay them.

As for conquest being "normal", I would argue that "normal" doesn't mean "good". IRL conquest brought us to where we are, but I am deeply skeptical that where we are is in any way a good place. I'm not going to bring up RL examples (since that would probably be against the spirit of the forum rules), but merely looking at regional news here in Southeast Asia, the scars from conquest are still festering.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

They were pushed to infertile land by people who had hoped they’d become extinct just because they couldn’t manipulate aether. They literally needed to conquer to survive since they couldn’t rely on aether like other countries could.

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Garlemald survived several centuries in this "infertile land" as a decently-sized polity, after they took over the neighbouring settlements via diplomacy and subterfuge. Nobody "hoped" that the Garleans would become extinct; if your assertion that "conquest is normal" holds here, it would also follow that conquering the lands of the ancestral Garleans is also normal.

Aether-using races had a working relationship with Garlemald. I say "had", because they left Garlemald to fend for themselves after Garlemald refused to pay the Roegadyn mage mercenaries they hired. In other words, Garlemald broke the contract.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Yes and they engaged in both. Both reclamation and conquest. Neither of these is inherently bad. It always comes with its benefits. Hell, we see that Limsa did the same exact thing. Limsa engaged in conquest to take land from the Kobolds. If it wasn’t for that they wouldn’t be here.

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And FFXIV makes it very clear, culminating in 5.4, that Limsa's conquest of Kobold land was wrong. Limsa Lominsa could have had the land anyway, if they had traded with the Kobolds and built up a relationship, instead of marauding and pirating and generally not seeing the Kobolds as worthy partners.

And if Limsa really needed to conquer the Kobolds to exist, with literally no other way possible, then a solid argument could be made that Limsa doesn't deserve to exist.