SE must be drunk.

Eh. Parry should just auto counter, block half the damage and return half of it back and force a 2 second stun with no save, no immunity and bring back the concept of stunlocking. Make Parry worth investing in. Instead of lol 20% damage reduction off of an attack. Oh Physical attacks only. If it's magical too bad.

I'd rather Parry do something fun instead of RNG dictating you might take less damage sometimes instead of something consistent. And Parry really has no place here when most content is survive the big hit so healer can top you off. Rinse and repeat.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

That's why I think mitigation skills should scale with the parry stat. Parry would improve your mitigation rate through block and parry and your mitigation power for everything. Exactly like a reverse crit. Of course, stacking a lot of parry should noticeably improve your mitigation skills, above what they do now.

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This seems like a decent idea tbh so long as the base mitigation stays the same (Rampart will block 20% of damage and then go up from there every N points of Parry above 354 or whatever the base is). It's not overtly offensive, but would make your mitigation give you a bit more leeway taking some pressure off healers and allowing you to DPS stance when you might not make the HP requirements to survive hits early on.

They'd probably have to rename the effects of RI to "Block 20% of all physical damage to the front...." And DD to something like "30% chance to block 20% of all physical damage" or something.

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Originally Posted by DaulBan

This seems like a decent idea tbh so long as the base mitigation stays the same (Rampart will block 20% of damage and then go up from there every N points of Parry above 354 or whatever the base is). It's not overtly offensive, but would make your mitigation give you a bit more leeway taking some pressure off healers and allowing you to DPS stance when you might not make the HP requirements to survive hits early on.

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For me, without any parry stats, this new Rampart should reduce less than 20%. If the skills stay natively as strong as they are now, people will treat them like it's "enough". If they start weaker, then people would need at least some parry.

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Originally Posted by DaulBan

They'd probably have to rename the effects of RI to "Block 20% of all physical damage to the front...." And DD to something like "30% chance to block 20% of all physical damage" or something.

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RI, Bulwark or Sheltron would still have the same effect, but the mitigation of parry and block would scale with the parry stat.
Other mitigation skills would just display a "potency" like all attacks and healing skills.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

That's why I think mitigation skills should scale with the parry stat. Parry would improve your mitigation rate through block and parry and your mitigation power for everything. Exactly like a reverse crit. Of course, stacking a lot of parry should noticeably improve your mitigation skills, above what they do now.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

For me, without any parry stats, this new Rampart should reduce less than 20%. If the skills stay natively as strong as they are now, people will treat them like it's "enough". If they start weaker, then people would need at least some parry.

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That's a horrible idea, you're just making it into a second accuracy stat exclusive to tanks. Stack parry to X amount so you can survive tankbusters with your cooldowns, hit accuracy cap, then maximise crit/det. That's how it would go.

OMG you people take this crap way to serious....................

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Originally Posted by Launched

That's a horrible idea, you're just making it into a second accuracy stat exclusive to tanks. Stack parry to X amount so you can survive tankbusters with your cooldowns, hit accuracy cap, then maximise crit/det. That's how it would go.

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You would say this whatever they do with the Parry stat "Enough defensive setup to survive and then attack attack attack"...
If parry improves every mitigation you have, it will have a greater effect than just "surviving tankbusters".

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

You would say this whatever they do with the Parry stat "Enough defensive setup to survive and then attack attack attack"...
If parry improves every mitigation you have, it will have a greater effect than just "surviving tankbusters".

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It won't have a greater effect, because defensive cooldowns are on timers. No one is going to care that Rampart reduces damage by 25% instead of 20%, because it doesn't have 100% uptime. If 20% is enough to survive a tankbuster you'd leave it at that.

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Originally Posted by Launched

It won't have a greater effect, because defensive cooldowns are on timers. No one is going to care that Rampart reduces damage by 25% instead of 20%, because it doesn't have 100% uptime. If 20% is enough to survive a tankbuster you'd leave it at that.

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I think what he's saying is that let's say parry would allow you to block 5% of all damage incoming, maybe with some vengenace type effect (perhaps throwing back a bit of the damage through a counterattack?) and moves like Rampart would then boost it by a certain percentage. I could be misreading him but that's how I interpreted what he suggested.

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Originally Posted by Launched

It won't have a greater effect, because defensive cooldowns are on timers. No one is going to care that Rampart reduces damage by 25% instead of 20%, because it doesn't have 100% uptime. If 20% is enough to survive a tankbuster you'd leave it at that.

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If stacking a lot of Parry suddenly makes Rampart reduce 35 or 40%, Sentinel reduce 50 or 60%, every Parry reduce 40% and every Block reduce 50%, I think you'll need significantly less healing during the whole fight.
While still improving your Parry and Block rate to help keeping your HP higher inbetween tankbusters.

The simple fact of the matter is that there's really not a whole lot that can be done to add further damage mitigation to tank stats without working to trivialize the role of healers (who already can end up getting quite a bit of time just to DPS themselves, depending on the fight). The only reason parry 'works' as a tank stat is that it's wholly insignificant in its function. At the end of the day, the base stat of vitality really ends up covering all the bases for pure tanking stats, and to add anything else with actually valuable impact would end up requiring a fundamental change in how the game's trinity functions. And you can't really nerf tank defenses to compensate, since in this situation, basic tank survivability is a required constant for the game to be playable. To this extent, the stat changes for tanks did very little to actually improve the state of the game, save for making bad DPS players feel better now that tank numbers don't beat theirs by quite as much.

Ultimately, there's really no way to do proper tanking secondary stats in this game. The best way to do it would be to just cut the stat entirely and accept that tanks are going to end up wanting to contribute DPS too.
If Square really wants to actually give tanks proper stats while not making DPS players jealous of their numbers, then they'd best focus on improving the functionality and utility of the DPS classes so that their unique abilities become more integral to the fight. On the other hand, that could also act to alienate players who do prefer to have their responsibility stay lax outside of enrage timers, which themselves are all pretty effortless now. So, as it stands, the problem with tanks doing respectable damage, if there even is one, really lies with how nonessential the DPS role has now become.