Common Courtesy with End-game Raids/Dungeons

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Originally Posted by Axlle10

so much elitism, so little common human sense. did you forget that you have to train people to do their job? even a frycook cant go and do everything immediately just by watching a video or reading a guide. it takes doing the work to get a feel for it. You think doctors just read books and are immediately an expert in their field? no, it takes PRACTICE and PATIENCE. those 2 words are things you know very little to nothing of i guess. or did you forget when you first did every single dungeon.

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Not really the best comparison. Learning to be a Doctor, or some other profession is much closer to learning to play the game as a whole, or a given class/job. Not a given fight. When you have experience from many other fights in the game, and even other games, a video could be all you need to learn a new fight.

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Originally Posted by ispano

Not really the best comparison. Learning to be a Doctor, or some other profession is much closer to learning to play the game as a whole, or a given class/job. Not a given fight. When you have experience from many other fights in the game, and even other games, a video could be all you need to learn a new fight.

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No, it is a good comparison, and one that is truthful to boot.

Fun fact. Not everyone is an auditory or visual learner. A good deal of us, such as myself, are kinesthetic. Meaning, we learn by DOING. Tactile learners. For example the boss in Aurum Vale that can one shot you, the cyclops with that 1000 ton ability that is an aoe circle around it. Videos mention very little about it. I know, I researched the dungeon before going in. I learned the quirks and mechanics of the fight by having patient DF members and working through it myself, despite the multiple videos I watched having failed me, as so many end game players advise watching.

I was still getting one shotted or dropped to near nothing as a tank. Because none of the videos, and even the people telling me about the boss, told me specifically that it is better to dodge the attack by retreating full on backwards, instead of rushing forwards and through and behind the boss or to it's side to dodge the attack. These are things you have to learn on your own.

Minor details like that make a big difference. Details that get missed and that many videos never deign to explain.

Experience in the game trumps everything. Period. Videos can only tell you so much. Learning first hand? It sticks with you. I can assure you of that.

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Originally Posted by CrAZYVIC

disrespect to the time other players.

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Hear that guys?

We better not waste this dudes time while he's playing video games, hes got a job you know and evidently playing FFXIV is one of them.

It seems the only way to die alongside your party is to be the FIRST to try the content, so everyone is equal and struggle together.

So sorry to all the people on the 'come-up', you got there too late, should have got your gear and levels much quicker, apparently.

B/S

Ive died first and also been the last Char standing, Ive killed myself by rezzing people to keep therm involved in the battle, I actually smile at dead epople on the ground, nobody wants to die.

People have said you should watch a vid to learn Titan/Garuda HM - I say, give it a good 5 runs, if you cant get the pattern, then maybe watch a vid, each attempt will probably be 10 mins or so.

If you dont have the time to die alongside your team, find a new game or adjust your attitude and help where you can, we all die, you too Elitist's.

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Originally Posted by Cigaran

Or you know, people could actually be allowed to play the game, experience the content, and enjoy figuring it out for themselves.

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I couldn't agree more! Nothing is more frustrating then being expected to do "research" or "homework" on every fight and learn it BEFORE you even get there! Heaven forbid you want to have the fun/experience of learning in game! No one wants that anymore. If you die everyone either rage quits, or starts name calling and so on. I think way too many people have lost sight of the fact that the point of the game *is* to have fun.

There was a time when people would stop before any fight and ask if people were new and then explain and walk them through and help, but those days seem mostly gone. Rare now is the day when you can even finish a PUG group run with the same group you start with because people rage quit or leave as soon as they get what they were after. Of course, that is after you actually get *in* from all of the trolls and the dozen times of clicking on commence.

I think they need to put a much steeper penalty in place for abandoning a duty or withdrawing from the duty finder as soon as it loads. I also feel there really needs to be an option to dismiss players for "unsportsmanlike behavior" and report them easily for the same (especially in CT, which seems to be the worst place for it and conversely there should always be the option to give a commendation for extremely helpful behavior, a reward all its own for helping new people and fostering a good gaming environment). Report to the GM is not easy in those situations, if it was easier to do so (so where you could click on a name to do so and it would send in a report with a snippet of text from the 5 minutes before??) community pressure might well fix a lot of the issues.

the more i read this thread,common sense is not common at all and often mistake with dbag/elitist

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Originally Posted by Alyko

Common courtesy: Don't inflate your item level to join a primal extreme group and expect a carry.



That's great. I already figured the content out. As a tank, why should I die repeatedly just to help someone else learn?

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Because you ARE the tank and as such, you are the one people are supposed to look to for how the fight goes? If you don't like that, switch classes. It would be like me saying "why should I have to heal someone who doesn't know to move?" right! That would go over real well. I chose to be a healer- comes with the job. I just tell them what I need to help keep them up and keep working with them. We were ALL new once. Look at what you just said and consider it's a fight YOU are new to and it's the healer who thinks they shouldn't have to wipe for you? Probably doesn't sit the same way from that perspective.

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Originally Posted by Edellis

I like to be surprised by what im playing. I don't play the game to help you beat it faster, i play it to enjoy it.

If you are too impatient to communicate and explain the dungeon to players, here's what you can do:

1) PF finder
2) Absurdly high ilvl requirement
3) State it in the comments


Otherwise, jump off the high horse.

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can any elitist answer this?i also ask alot but those elitist dbag ignore it
why they cant use party finder but use duty finder and harass newbies in it?

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Originally Posted by Jynx

Hear that guys?

We better not waste this dudes time while he's playing video games, hes got a job you know and evidently playing FFXIV is one of them.

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Well people do set aside time for the game. It is disrespectful to the other players in your group if your inability or refusal to learn the content causes repeated wipes which in turn wastes the time of everyone else (I've never met someone who enjoys logging on to not clear content). Just because the time is being spent on something "unproductive" like a game doesn't mean it isn't valuable and doesn't mean it can't be wasted by unwanted nonsense.

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Originally Posted by ElHeggunte

Well people do set aside time for the game. It is disrespectful to the other players in your group if your inability or refusal to learn the content causes repeated wipes which in turn wastes the time of everyone else (I've never met someone who enjoys logging on to not clear content). Just because the time is being spent on something "unproductive" like a game doesn't mean it isn't valuable and doesn't mean it can't be wasted by unwanted nonsense.

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If players didn't care about time FFXI-2 would of been made :(