Does Anyone Think Crafting is Too Slow?

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Originally Posted by Geldt

It would not feel "slow" if...

- standard wasn't the only action that consistently works.
- the special crafting "moves/actions" actually did anything whatsoever.
- I didn't have to listen to that wretched crafting music the whole time
- I wasn't surrounded by bots out-leveling me day after day after day...

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standard isn't the only action that consistently works.

the special moves do work and work quite well.

the music in the entire game in general(besides mor dhona area) is horrible

this one i do agree with, but bots are in every game not just this one.

All that SE will do about crafting is speed up the animations or increase the rate of the progression bar. They strongly believe in quick fixes....

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

standard isn't the only action that consistently works.

the special moves do work and work quite well.

the music in the entire game in general(besides mor dhona area) is horrible

this one i do agree with, but bots are in every game not just this one.

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All my problems are solved! This game is AWESOME!!!!!

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

how is the way it is set now limiting you anymore than the new way would limit them?

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I never said it was limiting. I said it wasn't fun, it was mindless, and it is too easy to create an automatic botting program to do it.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

you want to take the system and make it what you want and say you don't care what they want.

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No, I want to take the crafting system we have now and fix it so that we can retain the positive aspects about it while removing/improving the negative aspects.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

crafting is meant to be a chore to do.

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Is it too much to ask that this chore be made to be fun to do? I say no.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

if you make crafting too easy or fast you will have the crafters completing the game, making more money, having better gear faster than you will as a battle class.

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So then tweak the SP gained so that the players rank up at an appropriate pace, as per what I said about normalized SP/hour vs crafting actions done.

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Originally Posted by Physic

it might be fun to you or me, but to some they would may hate it, they also might have complaints like it isnt immersive, i might enjoy a mini game that revolves around chess, but many would hate it.

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"might" have complaints that it isn't immersive? What's so immersive about what we have now? What's so immersive about pressing "normal synth" a bajillion times in a row? Are these hypothetical complaints somehow more important that the REAL and ACTUAL complaints people have now about the crafting system?

And what does chess have to do with crafting?

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Originally Posted by Physic

like the shooting gallery, or a beat sim game or any of the million types of games that are generally fun, but that would alienate all the people who dont find them fun/arent good at those type of games, and the people who would say that doing something besides hammering a peice of metal repeatedly isnt what blacksmithing should be about.

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Again, hypotheticals. What about all the people who are alienated RIGHT NOW because of this terrible excuse for gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Rentahamster

I never said it was limiting. I said it wasn't fun, it was mindless, and it is too easy to create an automatic botting program to do it.


No, I want to take the crafting system we have now and fix it so that we can retain the positive aspects about it while removing/improving the negative aspects.



Is it too much to ask that this chore be made to be fun to do? I say no.




So then tweak the SP gained so that the players rank up at an appropriate pace, as per what I said about normalized SP/hour vs crafting actions done.




"might" have complaints that it isn't immersive? What's so immersive about what we have now? What's so immersive about pressing "normal synth" a bajillion times in a row? Are these hypothetical complaints somehow more important that the REAL and ACTUAL complaints people have now about the crafting system?

And what does chess have to do with crafting?



Again, hypotheticals. What about all the people who are alienated RIGHT NOW because of this terrible excuse for gameplay.

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So do you have a concept for a more fun crafting system that you think the majority of people will enjoy?

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Originally Posted by Physic

So do you have a concept for a more fun crafting system that you think the majority of people will enjoy?

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no they don't they just want it changed so they can get everything handed to them without working for it. if you work in any skill trade at all you realize that most of training is repetative in nature and you do it for years before you fully learn your trade.

how does a carpenter learn their trade in real life? they drive millions of nails, they cut thousands of boards, and read thousands of blueprints. how does a carpenter not learn their trade? by playing games when they should be learning.

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Originally Posted by Physic

So do you have a concept for a more fun crafting system that you think the majority of people will enjoy?

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Not really, I haven't though about that issue as much as others. I do know what I want the system to achieve, however, as I stated before: fun, engaging, difficult, rewarding, logical character progression, logical recipe progression, less redundant item utilization, streamlined, easily accessible/deep and complex at higher levels.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

no they don't they just want it changed so they can get everything handed to them without working for it.

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I still don't know why you insist on making this claim when I have said repeatedly that I don't want everything handed to me. If anything, I want the system to be harder than it is now. The main point of any change to the crafting system is that it would be more fun to do than it is currently, and that it won't be so susceptible to botting.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

how does a carpenter learn their trade in real life? they drive millions of nails, they cut thousands of boards, and read thousands of blueprints. how does a carpenter not learn their trade? by playing games when they should be learning.

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This is a game, not real life. Games are fun, first and foremost. We play games to escape real life.

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Originally Posted by Rentahamster

I still don't know why you insist on making this claim when I have said repeatedly that I don't want everything handed to me. If anything, I want the system to be harder than it is now. The main point of any change to the crafting system is that it would be more fun to do than it is currently, and that it won't be so susceptible to botting.

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i said they not you. there is a whole different scenario between the 2. i agreed earlier in this same thread that i would like it to be more fun, but that using the people won't bot excuse holds no water. the people botting are botting not because it is boring, but because they want to get to max rank as fast as possible. unless you made it level so fast that you could level faster than a botter then the same people that bot now will continue to bot regardless of the fun factor.

sure i want to go out and kill dodo's to learn how to craft a shirt. i didn't say i wouldn't like a different type of crafting, but they'd have to think before they changed it to something completely different that what a craft truly is.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

i said they not you. there is a whole different scenario between the 2.

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You direct quoted Physic, who was direct quoting me, therefore including myself in the reference to "they".

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

using the people won't bot excuse holds no water. the people botting are botting not because it is boring, but because they want to get to max rank as fast as possible.

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Indeed people want to bot to get to max rank with little effort, that's always the case. What I am concerned with, is the fact that it is so easy to program a bot to do this. All you have to do is basically program your third party botting program to just keep pressing "enter" over and over again.

If the crafting process took some actual strategy and thought to complete successfully, then it would be much more difficult to program a bot to replicate those functions.

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Originally Posted by Rentahamster

You direct quoted Physic, who was direct quoting me, therefore including myself in the reference to "they".



Indeed people want to bot to get to max rank with little effort, that's always the case. What I am concerned with, is the fact that it is so easy to program a bot to do this. All you have to do is basically program your third party botting program to just keep pressing "enter" over and over again.

If the crafting process took some actual strategy and thought to complete successfully, then it would be much more difficult to program a bot to replicate those functions.

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heres one of the problems, when crafting was more difficult, people complained, so they made it easier on release, when a lot of people still didnt understand, they made it even easier, and made standard the hands down best way to craft, with almost no risk. I dont think people want a challenging or entertaining crafting system, you and i might, but i doubt the rest of people do.

Also some people just genuinely like the current crafting.

But if there was an actual idea, that people could get behind, maybe it could work