Male Viera as a playable character! show your support

Does this forum software have an ignore feature? I mean, I'm all for a little playful trolling once in a while, but this guy's not even funny.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

Does this forum software have an ignore feature? I mean, I'm all for a little playful trolling once in a while, but this guy's not even funny.

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Click on a player portrait > Add to ignore list. Pretty simple process, actually.

https://i.imgur.com/JEC1J9k.png

I miss when people posted fan art here...

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Originally Posted by Alleo

I agree with your point. Classically handsome is completely subjective to every single culture. And not only culture but times too. In the past it would have been a no go for men to use beauty products and shave more than their beards. Now you have sex symbols that are as clean shaven as some women. (I mean on their whole body)

Heck yesterday while researching what makes someone more feminine I came about a page where they said that there was a study and most females that took part in the study just liked slightly muscular men (so in that case Midlanders of Miquotes). Does that mean that this is classically handsome? Problably not.

(I just googled it and the pictures are so widely spread..from Leonardo Di Caprio, to George Clooney, to Brad Bit, to the actor of Thor and then a side where seemingly Harry Styles is one of the most handsome man alive...Robert Pattison is up there too)

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We don't really need to concern ourselves about "every single culture", because we're discussing a game primarily played in the West and Japan - the "classic" here is with reference to Greco-roman statues, something familiar to both of those broader cultural groups. Regardless, the term applies to facial features and ratios consistently found to be desirable/attractive in men, because believe it or not, biology plays a role in what we find attractive. It's not to say it is the only form of male attractiveness (a strawman), and you can try dismiss it as a "western" concept or whatever, but let's not feign ignorance as to what it refers to because you believe the term is subjective.

Henry Cavill, Robert Pattinson or Mike Vogel are good examples of it.

Theodric just means he prefers males with more typically masculine features, like a strong jaw and a sharp nose. So rather than engaging in pointless linguistic deconstructions, let's just say that's what he's referring to and move on, yes?

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Theodric just means he prefers males with more typically masculine features, like a strong jaw and a sharp nose.

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Well Gee, this response to my question would have been really nice.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

We don't really need to concern ourselves about "every single culture", because we're discussing a game primarily played in the West and Japan - the "classic" here is with reference to Greco-roman statues, something familiar to both of those broader cultural groups.

Theodric just means he prefers males with more typically masculine features, like a strong jaw and a sharp nose. So rather than engaging in pointless linguistic deconstructions, let's just say that's what he's referring to and move on, yes?

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If we take only the west and japanese that would still be a huge difference..and even between western countries it would change. (Googled handsome japanese men and they are quite different from us western ones)

There are some things that are the same. Seemingly we like symmetrical looking faces and find them more attractive. (They talk about liking the average: As in the average of the faces that a certain population has.) But next to the face being symmetric we also have all our indiviual preferences on top of that. So there are pointers but it still comes down to the person itself. (I for example dont find Pattinson attractive)

In the article: Facial attractiveness: evolutionary based research:

Despite some findings showing a preference for more masculine and dominant faces, several studies have shown that feminine characteristics and faces of low dominance are of increased attractiveness [...].Perrett et al. [83] presented both Japanese and Caucasian faces in their country of origin. For the male face stimuli, the shape selected by Caucasians as most attractive was significantly feminized for both the Caucasian male face and the Japanese male face continua. Similarly, Japanese participants also selected significantly feminized versions of the male stimuli for both the Japanese and Caucasian male face continua. Thus, in both cultures it was found that participants showed a preference for feminized male faces. Since then, several studies have also documented preferences for femininity [62,90, 92,93], but some similar computer graphic studies have also reported preferences for masculinity [94, 95]. Although some of this variation may be attributed to other characteristics of the faces that varied between sets of stimuli [96], this does not explain the variability in preferences.

So even in those researches there is no full conclusion on this. There some things that we all have in common (symmetric faces) but they were surprised that unlike with females, where feminine features where seemingly always considered more attractive, this was quite unclear with the male faces.

So yes its probably better to make it clear what exactly you mean and not use such a term because its just too broad. (Just like the pictures one can find, especially if you use different languages)

In the end faces do play a big role in attractivness so to make the most of us happy maybe they just need to decide to create a bigger range of faces. From a more feminine one to a Mike Vogel one to a maybe older version.

And if the body itself is more in the average range and not in range of both extremes it should make the most happy. (Of course it would be the best to have them at all)

[I also only used the source to back up my claim. Not wanting to just say stuff without saying where I got that]

It's crazy that "classically handsome" is a debatable thing.

It's male movie star looks. George Clooney, Brad Pitt, etc. are classically handsome men. It doesn't mean they're necessarily the most attractive men alive (because that's going to vary, you've got people who like everything from The Rock in this thread and also an article indicating perhaps a preference for feminine facial features - clearly a lot of variance exists there) but the word handsome and the word attractive aren't the same word.

Handsome men are fit and tall with masculine facial features like a strong jaw. Not all attractive men are handsome, that'd be like saying all attractive men are tall. Yes, being tall is generally considered attractive but it doesn't guarantee it. Being handsome just means they're handsome, doesn't mean they're attractive by everyone's subjective standards.

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Originally Posted by Veis_Alveare

It's crazy that "classically handsome" is a debatable thing.

It's male movie star looks. George Clooney, Brad Pitt, etc. are classically handsome men. It doesn't mean they're necessarily the most attractive men alive (because that's going to vary, you've got people who like everything from The Rock in this thread and also an article indicating perhaps a preference for feminine facial features - clearly a lot of variance exists there) but the word handsome and the word attractive aren't the same word.

Handsome men are fit and tall with masculine facial features like a strong jaw. Not all attractive men are handsome, that'd be like saying all attractive men are tall. Yes, being tall is generally considered attractive but it doesn't guarantee it. Being handsome just means they're handsome, doesn't mean they're attractive by everyone's subjective standards.

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Of course it is, when somebody says John Cena is a 'classically handsome' man lol. I agree what we could call George Clooney or Brad Pitt 'classically handsome' men, but it doesn't mean at all that we have to have only this kind of men in the game. As I showed in my previous post, the most attractive male NPCs in FFXIV aren't 'classicaly handsome'. So it shows the need of more variety of male beaty in the character creation.

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Originally Posted by Skolopendrokot

Of course it is, when somebody says John Cena is a 'classically handsome' man lol. I agree what we could call George Clooney or Brad Pitt 'classically handsome' men, but it doesn't mean at all that we have to have only this kind of men in the game. As I showed in my previous post, the most attractive male NPCs in FFXIV aren't 'classicaly handsome'. So it shows the need of more variety of male beaty in the character creation.

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But why would we need male Viera to fill one of those roles you've already pointed out are filled by Aymeric, Emet-Selch and the like?

Sounds like if anything I need a buff bun-Clooney for the sake of variety.