Bard - they broke my job

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Originally Posted by Duelle

Not to mention WM means bye bye multi-dotting (too much time spent casting that over attacking the focus target)

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Sorry, maybe I'm missing a situational context here, but there's no difference in multi-dotting now if you don't have to move. With or without WM, you couldn't cast more than one DoT per GCD, so you'd always spend 5 (minus skill speed) seconds applying your two DoTs to another target.

At best, you may be missing 3 seconds' worth of not being able to shoot OGCDs at the focus target if you swapped between the alternate targets to shoot a DoT, then back to focus target until GCD was up, then back to alt target for the second DoT.

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Originally Posted by Aiselia

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Yeah, I disagree with what you're quoting too, bye-bye multidot is not a thing AT ALL

If you want the best DPS you want to be gunning out the highest potency possible for that gcd, if an extra dot is applicable you are gaining a LOT of damage just from the dot alone nevermind procs.
If anything it's better now, for sustained multidotting you aren't burning nearly as much TP and you're spending less GCDs to keep multidots up.

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Originally Posted by Aiselia

Sorry, maybe I'm missing a situational context here, but there's no difference in multi-dotting now if you don't have to move. With or without WM, you couldn't cast more than one DoT per GCD, so you'd always spend 5 (minus skill speed) seconds applying your two DoTs to another target.

At best, you may be missing 3 seconds' worth of not being able to shoot OGCDs at the focus target if you swapped between the alternate targets to shoot a DoT, then back to focus target until GCD was up, then back to alt target for the second DoT.

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Again, it seems like minor stuff, but still makes a difference. Considering it feels long on MCH (which only has one buff and one DoT to maintain), it's worse on BRD with 2 DoTs and a buff.

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Originally Posted by Duelle

Again, it seems like minor stuff, but still makes a difference. Considering it feels long on MCH (which only has one buff and one DoT to maintain), it's worse on BRD with 2 DoTs and a buff.

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Well I mean, in your argument, teeeechnically it takes "longer" to multidot, because it takes a 1.5 second cast before your dot applies, but if you're going to multidot while there is a specific target that needs to be focused, the time it takes is the same.

I said it earlier in the thread but it's basically what aiselia said. There ISN'T a difference compared to before, whether or not you have a cast time, as long as your GCD is longer than your cast time it is the same.

WM off WB -> VB will take you 5 seconds. WM on WB -> VB will take you 5 seconds.

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Originally Posted by Duelle

Again, it seems like minor stuff, but still makes a difference. Considering it feels long on MCH (which only has one buff and one DoT to maintain), it's worse on BRD with 2 DoTs and a buff.

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Practically speaking, it's still the same output since you only ever use 1 weapon skill every 2.5 seconds regardless of cast time or not. It's just not a very fun or engaging way to do so (like SMN mutli dotting without bane). Then there's trying to use up them procs...

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Originally Posted by aabe

Well I mean, in your argument, teeeechnically it takes "longer" to multidot, because it takes a 1.5 second cast before your dot applies, but if you're going to multidot while there is a specific target that needs to be focused, the time it takes is the same.

I said it earlier in the thread but it's basically what aiselia said. There ISN'T a difference compared to before, whether or not you have a cast time, as long as your GCD is longer than your cast time it is the same.

WM off WB -> VB will take you 5 seconds. WM on WB -> VB will take you 5 seconds.

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His argument is also talking into context of multi dotting on the move. And it's just me, cycling through target through target to mutli dot with cast times just feels wrong and unengaging until it's all finally set up. let alone trying to use up all the RoD resets as they come up as well.

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

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There isn't really multidotting on the move tho outside of dungeons so I assumed they weren't making that argument

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Originally Posted by aabe

There isn't really multidotting on the move tho outside of dungeons so I assumed they weren't making that argument

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When we're speaking for a playstyle perspective, I'd like to include all aspects of the game, not just one area like raiding. And he did specifically mention mutlidotting on the go.

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Originally Posted by Duelle

... The mob moving and you having to reposition and being able to refresh buffs/DoTs on the move while getting into position again (like you've been able to for 51 levels) is also gone. It sounds like minor stuff, but it does affect the flow of the job's gameplay.

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I'm begrudgingly playing bard in A2S since foe reqiuem is much more versatile, flexibile and signifcantly boosts our summoner's AoE dps than what hypercharge can do. When I try to multi dot all the enemies, it's just not the same pacing for me due to the cast times preventing the use of oGCDs, and somehing that I liked doing was cycling through the enemnity list, use BL and auto attack on my primary target, then swap back down to cycling the list for my multi-dotting. Again, it's my perspective, but it's one aspect that I liked about bard and I can't really enjoy it as much because of the way WM was implemented onto them.

Here is a dungeon question. I was running Fractal Continuum for my expert, and the tank mentioned I should be 3 shotting all the adds that spawn for the last boss. I can 2-3 shot when bloodletter and EA are up for first mob, but for every mob? I don't think I can with heavy shot and straight shot alone when everything else is on cd. Or am I doing something wrong here?

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Originally Posted by Ferrasper

Here is a dungeon question. I was running Fractal Continuum for my expert, and the tank mentioned I should be 3 shotting all the adds that spawn for the last boss. I can 2-3 shot when bloodletter and EA are up for first mob, but for every mob? I don't think I can with heavy shot and straight shot alone when everything else is on cd. Or am I doing something wrong here?

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He might be hyperboling it. The adds should die relatively fast, before they make their first step.

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

He might be hyperboling it. The adds should die relatively fast, before they make their first step.

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I can do that for first mob with just me on it. Sometimes the add gets to second step before I kill it due to mechanics.