BLU for Duty Finder and Raids! Show your support!

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Something like "Do that quest to 100% learn this AoE, but hunt these optional mobs to learn 6 different aspects of this AoE for elemental purpose in the Carnival" ? That could be a thing, but it might be difficult to do the same with every type of skill.

Or, like I suggested in some other topics, you could have talents that would be "limited". So, in matchmaking, you'd be forced to use the base version of a skill and those wouldn't be random, but in "talent-parties", you'd have your talents available to enchance some of those. And BLU would have to hunt those "talents" or "talented-skill".

Yes, but considering SE basically said that this was the only way they could implement BLU, you still need to have a plan to give shape to those options.
It's like if someone made a poll asking if people want "10 dungeons, 5 trials, and 15 floors for raids in each major patch" or if they'd rather "stick to the current formula".

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Except it's not, option one is meant for people who want option one BLU but with less focus on solo content outside of learning.

but wait what if someone wants BLU to be a regular job but they don't want the solo content at all and just want it to be a normal run of the mill job?

Or Hey what if someone just straight up doesn't want BLU to be like every other job but doesn't like how weak it is now and just wants OP skills that lets them solo anything with a hard focus on more solo content?

Or what if people just like how BLU is right now and want more of that?

Or what if someone just doesn't care?

The point of the options is to just give a general CHOICE of how you would like BLU's design plan to be, there's no point in elaborating on what you feel BLU means or how which would be implemented, as each has their own draw backs and benefits and is meant to speak to a general demographic. Just because one has less text attached to it doesn't make it an inherently wrong decision, feeling that way is a subjective interpretation.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Something like "Do that quest to 100% learn this AoE, but hunt these optional mobs to learn 6 different aspects of this AoE for elemental purpose in the Carnival" ? That could be a thing, but it might be difficult to do the same with every type of skill.

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Yeah that's basically the gist of it. Say you learn AoE spell that does 130 potency through your Job quest and applies a slow. You can then go learn AoE spells that do the exact same potency in the world with the same additional effect, but in the Carnival you'd have additional elemental effects applied, the same as they are now but only in the Carnivale. You swap these out in a similar BLU spellbook menu to what we have now, except you choose what skills to replace over your core Job spells. Illusion of choice? Yes, but you still get the satisfaction of "learning" and in theory you can at least have that sense of personality involved with your rotation; for example you can have all your spells replaced with lightning themed spells if that's your flavor, or fire or ice.

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Originally Posted by MrKimper

The point of the options is to just give a general CHOICE of how you would like BLU's design plan to be

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Again, if the design plan is not doable, this CHOICE has no value, especially if you want your poll to prove anything in how BLU should be implemented.
Sure, my criteria might not be shared by everyone, but if you suggest I'll have a BLU that's simply another caster DPS that would still have the additional work of hunting for the skills while every other job simply gain them by leveling, there's no way I would chose that type of BLU.

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Originally Posted by GucciSan

Yeah that's basically the gist of it.

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It would be interesting to pick several BLU spells and see how we could tweak them. I think White Wind could be easily adjusted by splittng the healing on all targets. So, basically, in solo, the skill would still be very powerful, basically doubling your HP, but in 8-man party, it would simply be a moderate AoE heal. And maybe you could have a "glamour' version that works the opposite, giving you the HP you lack, like the one from FF VIII, that would still be less useful in group content since you wouldn't be the one to take heavy damage.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Again, if the design plan is not doable, this CHOICE has no value, especially if you want your poll to prove anything in how BLU should be implemented.
Sure, my criteria might not be shared by everyone, but if you suggest I'll have a BLU that's simply another caster DPS that would still have the additional work of hunting for the skills while every other job simply gain them by leveling, there's no way I would chose that type of BLU.

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Right now it's simply to show what the majority player feedback is leaning towards. Who knows what the devs are thinking right now, anyway? I imagine this poll just helps clarify what the majority playerbase is actually wanting. You're a couple steps ahead in your thinking, as we all are, that's fine and understandable, I have my ideas about how I want those options realized too, but that's the step after a poll. Think about what your ideal Blue Mage implementation is and which option would potentially lead to it, then you can vote that way. If the poll ends up leading to anything then further distinctions can be made.
Another way of saying this is, if each idea about specific criteria within branches of development direction were added it'd be like a 20 item poll and not a very good one. This helps narrow things down for further discussion.

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Originally Posted by Valdegarde

but that's the step after a poll.

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For me, that's the step before the poll. Otherwise, it's no different than empty promises like politicians do. It's easy to gain support if you tout an ideal solution that adress every issue without any drawback.

Like my example above :

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

It's like if someone made a poll asking if people want "10 dungeons, 5 trials, and 15 floors for raids in each major patch" or if they'd rather "stick to the current formula".

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If the drawback is "having a major patch once every 2/3 year", that might change your vote.

This thread has my support. Blue Mage and the many loyal players who wish to main it deserves better.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

So, my question is : How would you do a BLU that match at least all the criteria below :

• Have to hunt for spells
• Can hunt spells in mostly random order
• Is customizable to be versatile in content
• Have comparatively more powerful spells than other jobs to compensate for the additional work of hunting them
• Is balanced with every other job so that matchmaking and the meta are not overrun by BLUs

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Bullet point 4 isn't necessary.

The hunt for abilities is actually reasonably fun in its own sake, at least it is when it's not locked behind begging for help and terrible RNG.

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Originally Posted by Jandor

Bullet point 4 isn't necessary.

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Yet they adressed this exact issue.

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Yoshida: For example, BLMs learn fire II at level 18, but BLUs end up not having an AoE action and have to go to learn it. Let's say you do go and learn it after farming the mobs, but if it deals the same damage as BLM, that's just extra work for nothing and troublesome.

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Source

And I agree with them. What's the incentive of having to hunt and only have a random chance of learning a skill that would at best do the same damage as Fire II that is gained "free" ? Or even less damage since, BLU having more "utility" would imply it should do less raw DPS than the "selfish" BLM.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

What's the incentive of having to hunt and only have a random chance of learning a skill that would at best the same damage as Fire II that is gained "free" ?

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Implying hefty portions of the skills we do learn aren't barely recolors of each other, if they're useful at all.
To answer seriously - The thrill and enjoyment of hunting for that skill, as it is undoubtfully a core part of what makes BLU a BLU. And it is yet again a point comparable to other jobs because some jobs are inherently more difficult to play and they don't necessarily give higher dps than the easier ones. So why play one of the harder jobs instead of the easier ones? Because it's what you enjoy better and fits your personal preferences.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Again, if the design plan is not doable, this CHOICE has no value, especially if you want your poll to prove anything in how BLU should be implemented.
Sure, my criteria might not be shared by everyone, but if you suggest I'll have a BLU that's simply another caster DPS that would still have the additional work of hunting for the skills while every other job simply gain them by leveling, there's no way I would chose that type of BLU.

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Then dno't choose it, there's a reason there are MULTIPLE options, and if you don't like ANY of those I can't really help you there chief. You're already coming into this with the idea that "This can't work because I can't envision it working and don't agree with it therefore this option is invalid" so there's not even a point discussing it. To you the BLU implemented is the way BLU should be and any vote that doesn't align with that is invalid to you.