Ishgard Housing No Lottery For Wards

i'm pretty against the lottery at all honestly.

like if people thought their odds were bad in a first come first serve situation, think about the fact that you were only ever competing with the other people who cared enough to set an alarm and log in right away.

under a lottery... why WOULDN'T anybody throw their name into the hat? people who hardly care, and wouldn't have been competition before, will be now.

i am reminded of the time squeenix added new wards that were "FC only" a few years back. sounds reasonable on it's face right? (well no actually i wouldn't even agree with that, but lets say it is for the sake of argument) but what ACTUALLY happened was my servers biggest house hording conglomerate had a whole week of free reign to just make new dummy FCs and snatch up plots. they tripled in size in a week.

the lottery might seem more "fair" but it's going to EXPLODE the demand. players who have been really trying this whole time are now competing with literally any character with a few million gil? cuz again... why NOT throw my name into the hat?

i think we're gonna see a whole lot of undecorated ishgard houses.

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Originally Posted by Buzzwords

i'm pretty against the lottery at all honestly.

like if people thought their odds were bad in a first come first serve situation, think about the fact that you were only ever competing with the other people who cared enough to set an alarm and log in right away.

under a lottery... why WOULDN'T anybody throw their name into the hat? people who hardly care, and wouldn't have been competition before, will be now.

i am reminded of the time squeenix added new wards that were "FC only" a few years back. sounds reasonable on it's face right? (well no actually i wouldn't even agree with that, but lets say it is for the sake of argument) but what ACTUALLY happened was my servers biggest house hording conglomerate had a whole week of free reign to just make new dummy FCs and snatch up plots. they tripled in size in a week.

the lottery might seem more "fair" but it's going to EXPLODE the demand. players who have been really trying this whole time are now competing with literally any character with a few million gil? cuz again... why NOT throw my name into the hat?

i think we're gonna see a whole lot of undecorated ishgard houses.

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It is not a matter of "seeming" more fair. It IS more fair.

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Originally Posted by Eraden

It is not a matter of "seeming" more fair. It IS more fair.

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see... i disagree? everybody has always had the same opportunity to set an alarm and log in for the 5 minutes it takes for a first come first serve launch to get resolved. connection errors and login ques suck but they're not UNFAIR. the cruel whims of fate don't know who i am when they disconnect me.


so yah... i don't think a lottery is more fair. at least not significantly so. maybe you could make a case for people who work odd hours or something. but REALLY it's just easier. so easy as to be incidental. and i think that a lot of people are gonna be disappointed when they realize how much worse their odds will become when the competition expands from "only the people who care enough to SLIGHTLY inconvenience themselves" to "everybody"?

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Originally Posted by Eraden

It is not a matter of "seeming" more fair. It IS more fair.

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how? pls explain.

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Originally Posted by Buzzwords

see... i disagree? everybody has always had the same opportunity to set an alarm and log in for the 5 minutes it takes for a first come first serve launch to get resolved. connection errors and login ques suck but they're not UNFAIR. the cruel whims of fate don't know who i am when they disconnect me.


so yah... i don't think a lottery is more fair. at least not significantly so. maybe you could make a case for people who work odd hours or something. but REALLY it's just easier. so easy as to be incidental. and i think that a lot of people are gonna be disappointed when they realize how much worse their odds will become when the competition expands from "only the people who care enough to SLIGHTLY inconvenience themselves" to "everybody"?

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I'm sorry but your response smacks of "I believe the moon is made of blue cheese because I said so". The lottery being more fair to all is an OBJECTIVE statement. What you appear to be arguing for is something that gives YOU a better shot at getting a house. I am retired. I can stay at my keyboard night and day to try and get a house. I DON'T want that kind of a system to be in place. I want a system that is fair to ALL. The lottery is that system. EVERYONE has the same chance at getting a plot.

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Originally Posted by miep

how? pls explain.

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Honestly, do you not understand how a lottery system is fair to all? It gives EVERYONE the same chance at getting a plot.

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Originally Posted by Viedyn

I answered a question that was already answered. WOMP WOMP.

So I'll just note for the people who suggested creating a bunch of alts for extra entries - A fresh alt cannot actually walk into Ishgard and buy a house. You must meet several in-game requirements to access the Empyreum. IF you were to create a bunch of alts AND fulfill all of the requirements on every alt AND won the house on one of those alts, the house would be bound to that alt with absolutely no way to transfer to your main. The "Instant transfer" system was removed in Endwalker so you wouldn't be able to take advantage of that any longer. It's not practical if your goal is to have a house on your main character. But....I guess if you wanted to make your winning alt your new main then...maybe? It just seems like a huge waste of time for very little if any reward.

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I don't think the "fresh alt" concerns are over personal housing but rather FCs trying to stack the odds in a FC's favor for a plot.

It also won't work with any new alts created after 6.1 is released. The alts will need to sit through the new member waiting period before they can be granted a rank with land acquisition permissions.

On the other hand, it doesn't stop anyone from making those alts right now and adding them to FCs before 6.1 while they can be given those permissions immediately.

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Originally Posted by Reinha

He got a house, didn't he? Did you win the most recent raffle you participated in? You get two chances in the housing patch. Once for Ishgard, then once for the houses the relocated house owners left behind. I've been saying for years this is a bad idea but it's coming so I hope people will enjoy never getting a house.

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How many of those he was competing against likewise got lucky?

Would he still feel the same way if he hadn't gotten lucky, or would he have joined the ranks of those who complain about placard camping? It's really easy to feel biased in favor of a system that worked for you even though it doesn't work for others.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

You would be amazed just how many people will camp smalls.
(snip the rest)

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He's got it fairly well described for when Ishgard opens. Many of those 15,000 will have no interest in getting a house or will be using the single entry they're allowed to help their FC get a house.
A lot of players are going to be trying to get lucky on a medium or large when they first become available. That's going to reduce the number competing over the smalls, especially the smalls in the weird places that no one wants (as an example, if you're going to end up with a small, would you rather have it up the hill tucked behind a medium so there's no view or next to the hot springs?).

But it's only going to hold true for the initial lottery period, and possibly the second one. Once Ishgard sells out and we're down to what's been relinquished or demolished, the odds of getting a house will become very small. The thousands of players still without a house will be left competing over the dozen or so that will be available each lottery period.

As for why SE is doing it, I wouldn't say "bots" but I would say resellers are one of the targets. Some of the changes they're making only have a meaningful impact on the resellers. It's still not going to stop them but it will decrease the number of plots they're able to obtain because they'll be fighting the lottery odds and it slows down how rapidly they're able to sell off their current plot before that character can try to obtain another.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Perhaps the ESO approach would serve better here by making housing instance-based rather than perma-space. Granted I think that would heavily nerf outdoor decorating and kill the fun of seeing other people's houses and outdoor decor in a neighborhood but at the very least this means every player will be able to have their own housing without getting into plot wars. Here's hoping Island Sanctuaries happen to be something akin to that.

I dont think people fully understand how much strain, difficulty and costly for them to just add "more perma plots". I dont imagine the solution is THAT simple for them.

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Instanced housing wouldn't nerf outdoor decorating. It would massively enhance it. There would no longer be tiny outdoor item limits. Most of my RIFT decorating focused around the exterior environments while interiors would be fairly basic (I like clean interiors, not cluttered).

Backdrops in instanced housing could easily replicate the neighborhood feel, even if it wouldn't replica some of the wilder decorating efforts (but then how many people genuinely like looking at those Namazu effigies filling the yard of a Paissa house?)

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Originally Posted by Buzzwords

i think we're gonna see a whole lot of undecorated ishgard houses.

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That would still happen even if everything was FCFS. Too many people buy just to say they own, not because they actually want to use.

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Originally Posted by Buzzwords

see... i disagree? everybody has always had the same opportunity to set an alarm and log in for the 5 minutes it takes for a first come first serve launch to get resolved. connection errors and login ques suck but they're not UNFAIR. the cruel whims of fate don't know who i am when they disconnect me.

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Except everyone doesn't have the same opportunity. What about those who have to work when the servers come online? What about those who need to care for a sick child?

People do have real life obligations and they can't simply ignore them because they want a house in a game.

The lottery absolutely is more fair even if it's still a non-solution to the actual problems with the housing system.

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Originally Posted by Eraden

I can stay at my keyboard night and day to try and get a house. I DON'T want that kind of a system to be in place.

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that's not what first come first serve is... you are describing the lockout timer.

i think the lockout timer is terrible and should be removed. it is neither of the things being debated here.

i dunno what more to say when it seems like you LITERALLY don't know what we're talking about?

the problem i personally have is my fc wants a house, especially in ishgard for over 6 years, so for us it's far from fair that every player (veteran or new player, single fc player or a real fc, people who doesn't care for where the house is placed and people who do care where their house is) has the same chance via lottery, like usually you just went there, bought the house for the fc or had the move option. i don't understand why we can't move with our house anymore, why do i need a lottery when i already have a house and just want to move to ishgard???

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Originally Posted by Buzzwords

that's not what first come first serve is... you are describing the lockout timer.

i think the lockout timer is terrible and should be removed. it is neither of the things being debated here.

i dunno what more to say when it seems like you LITERALLY don't know what you're talking about?

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If you are against the lottery that leaves only FCFS left. I therefore assumed that was what you were after. If it is not, then please elaborate on what alternative you propose that would be fair. If it is what you were referring to, then my original statements still stand. FCFS is NOT a fair system. It punishes people with slow computers, poor connections and real life obligations that prevent them from getting to housing at launch. The lottery system is objectively fair. It gives EVERYONE the same chance at getting a plot. Remember, in the proposed lottery system, each character is allowed to bid on ONLY one plot at a time.